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Wednesday, 20 September 1972
Page: 1083

Senator CARRICK (New South Wales) - I too viewed the television programme 'This Day Tonight' and the interview with Mr Lovokivic. I came to a conclusion different from that reached by Senator O'Byrne regarding a number of the statements made by Mr Lovokivic Lest anyone should in any way misunderstand why I rose to my feet I point out that I have done so as one who, some 15 or 18 years ago, helped proudly to form the Liberal Party Migrant Advisory Council. So good was that Council and so effective has it been that the Australian Labor Party, as Senator Mulvihill well knows, has tried many times to form a similar organisation with exactly similar objectives. But it has failed to do so. Let me make this clear: The Liberal Party Migrant Advisory Council was formed, with other undertakings formed by banks and by community bodies throughout the country, to help migrants to assimilate in this country - for a fine and proper motive. It is a voluntary body. Mr Lovokivic stated correctly that no migrant member of the Migrant Advisory Council is asked to become a member of the Liberal Party. Those migrant members are elected by their national groups and they meet, I think, monthly with representatives of the Libera] Party at the Federal, State and local government levels to exchange views on their problems and to get help. The Migrant Advisory Council is in no sense a political body; it is no sense Liberal Party political. It is designed to assimilate migrants. Let any Labor Party senator rise and condemn the institution and its objectives and I shall be very happy to send to each of these organisations the condemnation of the Labor Party.

Senator O'Byrne - Are you talking about the Croats?

Senator CARRICK - Senator O'Byrneattempted to pin a tail on a cat. When he finds that the cat is lively and scratches, let him accept it. If anybody in the Labor Party wants to condemn the Liberal Party Migrant Advisory Council now, let him do so, because I assure the Labor Party that I will send a copy of Hansard to each migrant group. About 20 of those migrant groups in Australia, proudly led by their leaders, acknowledge the very great work that is done by that Council. Equally I believe it true to say that Mr Lovokivic was a delegate elected by the Croatians, though I do not know whether he is still a delegate. I have no doubt that the Croatian leaders would have had similar contact over the years with the Labor Party. I hope the Labor Party has made that contact.

Having said that and put it in perspective, I think it important to put in perspective also that sadly and tragically in the post-war years to this country have come people from 10 or more countries from behind the Iron Curtain - Poles. Czechs, Hungarians, Rumanians, Estonians. Lithuanians, Latvians and Yugoslavs. All have come with one common tragedy: They have been driven from their homes, they have been forced out by the tyranny of communism, the military tyranny, the bloody murder of communism. That is why they are here. What has been stated about freedom movements in this country is common to the Hungarians, to the Czeches and to the Rumanians. I can take honourable senators to any one national group and show them freedom movements, liberation movements which are of course endemic to the group, because they all live with the hope that one day the tyranny of the Iron Curtain will end and they can be free.

Senator Cavanagh - Does that justify what happened in Sydney?

Senator CARRICK - Senator Cavanagh knows that I have said I will have no part of any kind of violence. Of course, nothing justifies violence. But one can start with a basic assumption, namely, that the Croats and the Hungarians - and does anyone deny the Hungarians the right to have a liberation movement? Does anyone do so?

Senator Cavanagh - In Australia, yes.

Senator CARRICK - Do you deny them the right to have a liberation movement, and the Czechs and the Poles? Let us have this said because the migrants themselves will be thoroughly interested to know it. They will be thoroughly interested to know that the national aspirations of human beings to seek freedom for their country from the tyranny of communism is being rejected by the Labor Party. As I understand it, nothing is known to implicate in any way either Mr Lovokivic or Mr Kokic with any kind of violence. I ask Senator O'Byrne and I ask the Labor Party whether they know anything specific that will in any way implicate the 2 men who have been named tonight with any kind of violence at all. If the answer is no - and it is - then a terrible potential injustice has been done, because we have set up a star chamber here tonight, we have convicted these men by implication. We have done this kind of thing: We have said this-

Senator Hannan - We have not; they have.

Senator CARRICK - Yes, I am talking about the Labor Party. They have said that these men are leading members of the Croatian Liberation Movement, and then the Labor Party spokesmen have said it is the Croatian Liberation Movement which has caused this violence - that is what has been implied - and that these men are guilty men. What kind of country are we living in when we try to convict people before we have any evidence at all? That is the nub of the situation. The AttorneyGeneral as the protector of freedom in this country has stood proudly in this Parliament to defend freedom.

Senator McAuliffe - You are a humbug.

The PRESIDENT - Senator McAuliffe,I know you regret saying that. Will you withdraw it?

Senator McAuliffe - With respect to the Chair, I will.

Senator CARRICK - I do not seek Senator McAuliffe's respect. If what I have said makes me a humbug then I shall proudly go through life being a humbug.

Senator Cavanagh - Then why ask for the remark to be withdrawn if you are proud of it?

Senator CARRICK - I did not ask for the withdrawal.

Senator Primmer - Why don't you be more temperate in your approach to things?

The PRESIDENT - Order! the whole Senate is being intemperate at the moment.

Senator CARRICK - Let me express in very temperate terms what I want to say and if it appears to be humbug, let the Opposition tell me. The principle of British justice is that a man is innocent unless he is proven guilty. Is that humbug? The next situation is that yesterday I told the Labor Party that if any members among them had specific evidence of any man being connected with any crime or allegation of crime it was their duty to give it to the AttorneyGeneral or his officers, or to the police officers. I understand that no such evidence has been given, only that there has been conviction by implication. As I understand it, what Mr Lovokivic said tonight with the TDT interviewer trying to pin Ustasha upon him was this: T am an active member of the Council of the Croatian Liberation Movement. That movement embraces all those people who believe in freedom and independence for Croatia'. I ask Senator O'Byrne to deny that.

Senator O'Byrne - Who were members of Ustasha.

Senator CARRICK - The interviewer said: 'And the Ustasha?', and Mr Luvokivic used a form of words to this effect: 'Including those who formerly followed the beliefs of the Ustasha because the Ustasha had as its goal freedom for Croatia'. That is an essential paraphrase, but to suggest tha; from it the Croatian liberation movement was said by Mr Luvokivic to be the Ustasha is to corrupt the whole basis of the situation. If any member of the Croatian movement or any other migrant or any Australian is found guilty of violence I will roundly condemn him.

Senator Devitt - Why condemn him? Kick him out of the place. This is no place for that sort of thing.

The PRESIDENT - Order!

Senator Devitt - Kick him out.

The PRESIDENT - When I call for order, I require order.

Senator Devitt - I know that you have called for order.

The PRESIDENT - Senator Devitt,would you repeat your remarks to me?

Senator Devitt - I said that I know that you have called for order.

The PRESD3ENT - I call Senator Carrick.

Senator CARRICK - The interesting fact about the whole situation is that a parallel factor, equally wrong and equally violent, is the allegation that international communism, quite strong as such, is operating here to provoke and to intimidate migrants.

Senator Milliner - Where is the evidence?

Senator CARRICK - That allegation has come forward with equal strength, migrants alleging that it is so. That is why my view is that as soon as the police inquiries are completed it would be a very good thing to set up a royal commission to check situations of this kind. If we are to allege that certain people are causing violence, we must look equally at the fact that there is a strong allegation of violence by communists in the trade union movement.

Senator Cavanagh - Does the honourable senator think that two wrongs make a right?

Senator CARRICK - I do not say that two wrongs make a right. The allegations are parallel. It is alleged that provocation and intimidation by international communism is one of the reasons for and a primary cause of response by Croat independents. If it is true that secret police are in this country they should be sought out, identified and expelled. If anybody in this country is using diplomatic privilege for the purpose of intimidation, the same thing should happen to them.

I rose to say three things. The Migrant Advisory Council is a proud and effective body which has made a great contribution to migrant welfare. That is acknowledged by all national migrant leaders. The men named tonight have had no specific allegations made against them, and the people of Australia should know that that is so. I reject the idea of a star chamber trial. While opposing violence, I ask that there be in Australia a human understanding that all people who have been forced out of Iron Curtain countries have, in their hearts, a natural hunger to form freedom bodies in the hope that one day they will return to their countries. This is an aspiration that they almost certainly will not achieve, sadly enough.

Senator Milliner - Does the honourable senator suggest that they have a right to bomb people in Australia?

Senator CARRICK - Senator Milliner'sinterjection has been answered by me a dozen times.

Senator Douglas McClelland (NEW SOUTH WALES) - The honourable senator has not convinced us. He is apologising for them.

Senator Milliner - Tell us about the spies. Did not the honourable senator know that the Government put spies in a friendly country.

Senator CARRICK - The background orchestration seems to go on. One thing that I have said repeatedly is that one form of violence is the violence of words, and that is as much a form of violence as is physical violence. We hear this tonight. I make clear the position that I adopted in the Senate yesterday. In common with my colleagues, I oppose all forms of violence.

Senator Milliner - Does the honourable senator? We would not have known.

Senator CARRICK - Let Senator Milliner and his colleagues read the Hansard report of my speech. I make it clear to them that we are no apologists for violence of any kind. If there are apologists for violence, they sit on the Opposition benches and for 20 years have hidden and excused the violence of the Left. They talk of apologists but let them claim that over the years they have denied communist violence and communist intimidation. Let them deny this. If there are apologists, they are on the Opposition benches.

I conclude by saying that the Parliament should not condemn a man until he has had a fair judicial trial. I repeat that the waving of pieces of paper and the mouthing of allegations are in no way substitutes for hard facts. If any member of the Labor Party knows anything about particular acts of violence let him say so, otherwise he should not do harm to justice by alleging things of people without any facts.

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