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Estimates - Reports of Senate Estimates Committees on Particulars of Proposed Expenditure for year 1973-74 - Estimates A


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THE PARLIAMENT OF THE COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA

1973-Par/iamentary Pap er No . 288

Senate Estimates Committ ees

A , B , C, D , E and F

Reports to the Senate on Departmental Estimates 1973-74

Brought up and ordered

to be printed 15 Novemb er 1973

TH E GO VE RNMENT PR INTER OF AUSTRA LIA

CAN BE R RA 1975

Printed by Ambassador Press, 51 Good St., Granville 2142

RESOLUTION OF THE SENATE

RESOLUTION PA SSED ON 13 SEPTEMBER 1973

P ARTIC ULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1913-14-Reference to Estimates Committees:

The Leader of the Government in the Senate (Senator Murphy), pursuant to notice, moved-( 1) That the Particulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the Year Ending on 30 June 1974 and the Particulars of Certain Proposed Expenditure in respect

of the Year Ending on 30 June 1974 be referred herewith to Estimates Com " mittees A, B, C , D , E and F for examination and report. (2) That the Committees deal with the departmental estimates as follows: Estimates Committee A :

Attorney-General's Department Department of Customs and Excise Parliament Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet Department of Science Estimates Committee B:

Department of the Special Minister of State Department of Foreign Affairs Department of the Treasury Department of Services and Property Department of the Capital Territory Department of External Territories Estimates Committee C : ∑

Department of the Media Department of Social Security Department of Education Department of Tourism and Recreation Department of Immigration Postmaster-General' s Department Department of Health Estimates Committee D:

Repatriation Department Department of Defence Department of the N avy Department of the Army

Department of Air Department of Supply Department of Labour Estimates Committee E:

Department of Work s Department of Urban and Regional Development Department of Transport Department of C ivil Aviation Department of Aboriginal Affairs Department of Housing Department of the Environment and Conservation Estimates Committee F:

Department of Primary Industr y Department of Ov erseas Trade Department of Secondary Industry Department of N orthern D evelopment Department of Min erals and Energy Department of the Northern Territor y (3) That the Committees report to the Senate on or before 15 No vember 1973. Debate ensued. Que stion-put and passed.

iii

CONTENTS

page

1. R esolution of the Senate-13 September 1973 iii

2. Estimates Committee A-Report 3

Appendix-Written answers to questions 7

Minutes of Proceedings 1973 -9 October 25

18 October 27

22 October 29

6 November 33

13 November 35

15 November . 37

3. Estimates Committee B-Report 41

Append ix-Written answers to questions 45

Minutes of Proceedings 1973-11 October 53

13 November . 57

4. Estimates Committee C-Report 61

Appendix-Written answers to questions 65

Minutes of Proceedings 1973-11 October 83

22 October 87

6 November 90

13 November 92

5. Estimates Committee D-Report 97

Appendix-Written answers to questions 101

Minutes of Proceedings 1973-15 October 105

8 November . 109

6. E stimates Com mittee E-Report 113

Minutes of Proceedings 1973-15 October 117

8 November 121

13 November 123

v

7. Estimates Committee F -Report Appendix-Written answers to questions Minutes of Proceedings 1973-

9 October 18 October 12 November 14 November . Further Report . Minutes of Proceedings 1973-

20 November .

vi

page 127

131

149 151 153 156 159

163

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A

REPORT TO THE SENATE

ESTIMAT ES COMMITTEE A

REPORT TO THE SENA TE

Estimates Committee A has the honour to report to the Senate.

1. On 13 September 1973, the Senate referred to the Committee the Depart-mental Estimates for the year 1973-197 4 relating to the following Departments: Attorney-General's, Customs and Excise,

Parliament, Prime Minister and Cabinet, and Science.

2. The Committee bas considered these Estimates and has received explanations of them from the President of the Senate, Senator the Hon . Sir Magnus Cormack (in relation to the Parliamentary Departments), from the Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, Senator Murphy and from officers of the Depart " ments concerned. A copy of the Minutes of Proceedings and Hansard reports of the evidence taken by the Comm ittee are tabled for the information of the Senate in connection with the Appropriation Bill (No. 1) 1973-74 and the Appropriation Bill (No. 2) 1973-74. Certain written answers to questions asked at the hearings

are incorporated in the Hansard reports of the hearings of 18 October, 22 October and 13 November. Additional replies received on 14 November are included as an Appendix to this Report.

3. The Committee wishes to refer to a matter which attracted its attention during its hearings, and that is the arrangements under which computer services for Government Departments and authorities are provided and utilised by them. The expense involved in providing equipment, by purchase, hire or lease, is con "

siderable (of the order of $13 million, and to this cost is added a further cost of $5 million for maintenance) and has been referred to by the Auditor-Genera! in his Annual Report for the year 1972-73. The Committee understands that the Public Service Board exercises a continuing supervision of the maintenance problem, but

the Committee believes that consideration should be given to conducting a complete re-appraisal of the methods presently employed in acquiring and utilising A.D.P. equipment to ensure that a consistency of practice develops at the most economical cost possible.

4. Particular attention was also given by the Committee to the following line items in the estimates: (a) Attorney-General's D epartment - Division 129 - Sub " division 1 - Conciliation and Arbitration - Payment in

lieu of long-leave-President . $62,900

(b) Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet - Division 430, sub-division 3, item 06-Acquisition of works for, and conservation of, the National Collection . $4,000,000

5. Senator Greenwood, as a member of Committee, wishes to record his objection to the refusal of the Attorney-General to answer questions r ∑~ !a ti ng to the employment duties and activit ies of persons for which an appropriatio n was

3

contained in the Estimates. He records also his objection to the refusal to provide information to the Committee as to the nature and the reasons for the expenditure incurred by the Attorney-General' s Department in respect of the hearings of the Senate Committee inquiring into Civil Rights of Migrants. The basis of the objection is that the purpose of the Senate E stimates Committees is to examine the estimates of expenditure proposed for a department. Matters directly relating to the functions and employment of staff of the Department and persons for whom salary and other appropriations are sought are proper matters for inquiry. This is particularly so when the functions being performed are matters of general knowledge and an explanation of why those functions are being undertaken is the purpose of the inquiry.

6. In considering the Estimates, the Committee was, as in previous years, greatly advantaged by the provision of explanatory notes from Departments. It is suggested that consideration be given to a procedure that the explanatory notes be tabled in the Senate so that they may become public parliamentary documents. The important question of availabili ty and distribution of the notes appears to be a matter initially for the consideration of Senate Ministers.

7. In conclusion, the Committee expresses its appreciation of the assistance given by the President of the Senate, the Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise and the officers who attended with them before the Committee. The particular matters investiga ted by Committee members, and the detailed answers given in response are contained in the Hansard reports of the five sittings of the Committee (dated 9, 18 and 22 October, and 6 and 13 November), which are recommended to Honourable Senators for their consideration prior to the Senate debating the Appropriation Bills.

15 November 1973

4

J. R. McCLELLAND Chairman

Estimates Committee A

Appendix

My dear Senator,

Attorney-General of Australia Canberra 14 November 1973

When the Committee was examining the Estimates of the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet on 6 November, I undertook to supply further informa " tion to the Committee.

Attached for the Committee's information are statements on: Dr Coombs' Remuneration The Tariff Reduction Assistance Scheme Australian National University Centre for Research on Federal Financial

Relations

Senator J. McClelland, Chairman, Estimates Committee A, The Senate,

Parliament House, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

7

Yours sincerely, LIONEL MURPHY

DR COOMBS' REMUNERATION

Prior to December 1972 Dr Coombs occupied two part-time positions -Chairman of the Council for Aboriginal Affairs and Chairman of the Council for the Arts. Taking account of both positions, his remuneration was $14,800 plus an allowance of $1,000 p.a. paid by the Department of the Environment, Abori " gines and the Arts. Since December 1972 Dr Coombs has, in addition, been appointed as adviser to the Prime Minister. In recognition of his now full-time service, Dr Coombs' salary, with effect from 1 April 1973, is $25,000 plus an allowance of $1,200 p.a. paid by the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet.

Although Dr Coombs has continued as Chairman of the Council for Aboriginal Affairs and any fees in respect of his position would otherwise be paid now by the Department of Aboriginal Affairs, it has not been the practice to recover part payment of salary between departments and Treasury has, in the past, endorsed the view that a salary payment of this nature should not be subdivided over a number of Appropriations items.

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SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A- DIVISION No. 922-ITEM 02:

ADJUSTMENT ASSISTANCE FOR TARIFF REDUCTIONS

During the examination of the vote for tariff reduction assistance Senator Guilfoyle sought information on the numb er of officers in Departments who were detailed to administer the scheme; any further available information of the scheme; and the way in which the public concerned was advised of the possibility of assistance from these Departments (page 421 Senate Hansard Estimates Com " mittee A- 6 November 1973)-copy attached.

With regard to the number of officers involved in the administration of the scheme the Departments of Labour, Social Security and Secondary Industry have advised that no additional staff has been employed in the administrat ion of the scheme as the necessary procedures are covered by the normal workings of the departments. This is also the case for the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet.

Available details of the scheme and the way in which it is to be administered are given in some detail in the joint announcing statements by the Prime Minister and Minister for Overseas Trade and Secondary Industry on 18 July 1973 which received wide publicity, the Tribunal's statement of 1 Augu st 1973 and in a speech on 15 August 1973 by Dr Cairns as Minister for Overseas Trade and Minister for Secondary Industry. Copies of these statements are attached and

represent the Government's formal publicity of the scheme. In addition officers of the relevant departments would answer queries on the scheme as they arise. Senator Wright's comments have been noted regarding the desirability of rules being laid down for the administration of adjustment assistance for tariff reduc "

tions. Departments for some time have been preparing a detailed report for the Government's consideration on such rules as well as on principles which might be applied more generally. It is expected that the necessary report will be finalised soon.

Protection Policy Division

13 November 1973

9

STATEMENT BY THE PRIME MINISTER, MR E. G. WHITLAM, Q.C.,

M.P., AND BY THE MINISTER FOR OVERSEAS TRADE AND

SECONDARY INDUSTRY, DR J. F. CAIRNS, M.P.,

WEDNESDAY, 18 JULY 1973 AT 7.00 P.M.

TARIFF REDUCTION

1. The Prime Minister and the Minister for Overseas Trade and for Second " ary Industry today announced a decision taken by the Australian Government for a reduction of 25% in all tariffs - each tariff will be reduced by one-quarter of what it is now - excluding revenue items and anti-dumping duties. This reduction wh ich will apply forthwith, is designed to restrain price increases by increased competition and by stimulating in the short run a sufficiently large inflow of additional imports to help meet pressing demand. Action to combat price inflation through tariff action was. clearly forecast in the Prime Minister's policy speech and has recently been urged upon the Government by trade union, primary production, commercial and industrial groups. The Government has also decided

that in future by-law administration will be more flexible . The reduction is to be combined with an ambitious program of assistance to employees and firms who may be adversely affected by the tariff reduction.

2. The decision followed unanimous advice from a Committee which was appointed on 27 June and reported on 15 July. It was chaired by Mr G. A. Rattigan, Chairman of the Tariff Board and comprised Professor F. H. Gruen, Consultant to the Prime Minister; Mr B. Brogan, Consultant to the Minister for Overseas Trade and for Secondary Industry ; Dr S. F. Harris, Deputy Secretary, Department of Overseas Trade; Mr J. C. Taylor, First Assistant Secretary, Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet; and Mr F. A. Bennett, First Assist " ant Secretary, Department of Secondary Industry. The Committee's report will not be released at present because it also deals with matters affecting our trading relations and makes some comments on budgetary strategy. It will be released with the Budget papers.

3. The justification for the general reduction of tariffs is the excessive rate of inflation which now prevails. Inflation is harmful to every Australian . Action must be taken to reduce its harmful effects with the least delay. Inflation can be offset by an increase of supply of goods in Australia. The most readily available source of supply of goods is imports from overseas. Whilst it is expected that imports will increase in the next few months, because of the high level of tariffs the increase would be insufficient to help combat inflation. Consequently the Gov " ernment has decided to reduce tariffs so that imports may increase in the short term to help meet inflationary pressures in Australia.

4. The tariff changes will have a direct impact on import prices of approxi " mately the same order of magnitude as a revaluation of slightly less than 6%. Increased competition in Australia will have a salutary effect upon those who have taken advantage of shortages by unjustified price increases which have exploited the public. The Joint Committee on Prices will be asked to ensure that consumers get the full benefit of these reductions as it is already doing by its present inquiry on import prices. The earlier reference to the Committee related to the revaluation of the Australian dollar in December, 1972 and other relevant

10

currency changes in 1973. The Government is similarly determined that import prices respond to the tariff reduction.

5. The increased imports may affect production and employment in Australia. A Tribunal is being established to immediately hear appeals from any firm or company which may be seriously affected by imports. The Tribunal will be author " ised to immediately recommend appropriate assistance either to bring about changes for a firm or company or to restore the tariff level which previously protected it. Any person who may lose his job as a result of these changes will be entitled to receive, as special readjustment assistance, a weekly amount equal

to his average wage in the previous six months until he obtains or is found suit " able alternative employment. Such persons will be offered retraining for new and better occupations if they so desire. The Government has provided $25m to cover assistance which may be necessary as a result of the tariff changes. The procedures for providing assistance required as a result of these changes are set out in a separate statement which is attached.

6. While these changes can be expected to require some workers to move from one employment to another this must be seen against the existing high level of unfilled vacancies and rising employment opportunities. The Government is confident that most of the employees who may be affected will gain from the assistance provided and from the new opportunities which will be created. In

making this decision the Government is conscious of the urgent need for some major steps to deal with inflation. It has adopted these changes as part of a com " plex of measures some of which have already been taken and others will follow. These tariff changes will assist in the fight against inflation in the interest of

the nation as a whole and at the same time the Government is confident that losses which may affect individuals will be adequately offset by readily available assistance.

7. This decision represents a major step towards implementing the Govern " men t's objective of support for moves to liberalise international trade - moves which in the long term can only strengthen the economies of the trading countries of the world. Consistent with these objectives the Government intends to imple " ment its international commitments, which are of principal concern to New Zealand and Canada, in the context of the new tariff structure . Furthermore, the scheme to aid developing countries, announced by the M inister for Overseas Trade and for Secondary Industry on 3 July, will be implemented and existing and future preference margins will be lowered from the new general tariff rate.

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PROCEDURES ESTABLISHED FOR PROVIDING ANY SPECIAL

ASSISTANCE REQUIRED AS A RESULT OF THE MEASURES TAKEN

TO INCREASE IMPORTS

On the recommendation of the Prime Minister and Minister for Overseas Trade and for Secondary Industry, the Governm ent has established a Tribunal to examine and report on requests for relief for the measures taken to increase the demand for imports where a domestic industry is being seriously damaged by the tariff reduction. The tribunal will be guided by two basic principles; its recom " mendations should be compatible with the long-term objectives of assistance to industr ies, and it should not provide relief as a matter of course - that is, simply because the question of relief had been referred to it. The Government has also decided that there should be established an effective range of adjustment assistance measures which would be available to assist in those cases where the Tribunal felt that some assistance was required but that restoration of the duties in whole or in part was not a suitable means of assistance.

If the Tribunal were to recommend relief too readily by rai3ing, perhaps to their former level, individual tariffs which have just been reduced as part of a general tariff cut, the purpose of the initial tariff cut would be largely frustrated. The desired increase in imports resulting from the tariff reduction would not occur, and the desired increase in aggregate domestic supplies would not be achieved. In other words, the anti-inflationary impact of the original measure would be serious ly weakened.

If the Tribunal were to provide relief (particularly in more highly protected industries) not by raising tariffs previously reduced, but by other measures -such as compensation payments - the problems described above could be partly avoided. But compensation payments or other direct subsidies to a particular industry could have undesirable side effects, particularly if those payments were not made conditional on some adjustment by the industry concerned to the new situation. For example, compensation payments, if they are equivalent to the tariff 'subsidy' they replace, could continue to support the use of resources in activities which are high cost; in these circumstances the gain to consumers of the action proposed would be at the expense of taxpayers. In cases where it is evident that the industry could, with assistance, adjust to the changed circum " stances of import competition (and of protection), it would clearly be in the interests of the community as a whole to prefer adjustment assistance to restoring the high rates of duty.

In summary, therefore, if relief from any effects of the general tariff reduc " tion is provided readily by partially or wholly restoring the tariffs previously reduced, particularly where the previous tariff was high, the objectives of the initial tariff reduction will tend to be frustrated; and if the relief is readily provided in ways which do not induce some adjustment to the new situation by highly protected domestic manufacturers, that relief will tend to be inconsistent with the long-term objectives of protection policy.

Adjustment Assistance

Events such as a currency appreciation or a tariff reduction can be to the overall benefit of the nation as a whole by making more goods and services available to the Australian people, by helping to restrain price increases and by improving the allocation of our resources and efficiency of our industries. These

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benefits, however, may involve some cost in the form of reduced business oppor " tunities for some firms and the need for changes in employment and perhaps location for some individuals. Whilst the benefits are enjoyed generally through " out the economy, the costs may tend to fall on a small minority in the community.

In such circumstances, it is inequitable to allow the cost to fall on any par " ticular group - especially when the changes are brought about by a conscious Government decision. More importantly, it is socially undesirable for the cost to fall on groups in the community which are likely to be less privileged than the

majority or on to individual s which do not have the opportunity or the capa " bility to adapt readily to the change in circumstances. A positive approach is needed for these human and economic problems of structural and technological change which reflects a genuine understanding of the

non-economic as well as the economic costs to those affected and which in con " sequence cannot be too finely calculated. In the absence of effective action to counter them, they will continue to represent a real impediment to desirable and beneficial changes.

With these points in mind, the Ministers for Secondary Industry, Labour and Social Security established an inter-departmental committee to study measures needed to facilitate desirable structural changes in the Australian economy. This inter-departmental committee will be recommending a long-term approach to

structural change. This will include: assistance to employees; social security measures; assistance to firms. The short-term tariff changes now taken will precipitate the need for im " mediate adjustment assistance. Because of the importance which this Govern " ment attaches to the availability of adjustment assistance it has anticipated those elements of the long-term program that could be developed quickly to assist in

adjustment to the proposed tariff changes.

Assistance to Employees

Such assistance will be given through the existing services such as the Com " monwealth Employment Service with appropriate strengthening and augmenta " tion - such as the proposals already outlined by the Minister for Labour in his statement on manpower policy.

The measures which will be applied include: Grants to individuals to meet relocation expenses where the C.E.S. is able to offer employment at a different location . Re-training assistance to those suited by age, health, etc., including

guaranteed minimum wages during re-training, payment of training fees and related transport costs including living-away from home allowances where necessary. Incentives to firms to train or re-train staff rendered redundant by tariff

changes.

The Government has decided that an initial allocation of $5 million could properly be made for these purposes.

Social Security Measures

Additional social security measures ma y also be needed for several purposes. In order to ensure adequate incomes for those temporarily displaced by the tariff

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change, the Government has decided it would be desirable for them ∑ to be paid their average weekly wage over the preceding six months for a period of up to six months - or until they are offered suitable alternative employment. Where special local unemployment problems are caused by the tariff changes, special local unemployment relief grants will be given in a form similar to the rural and urban unemployment relief schemes now being phased out.

To provide adequate incomes for those members of the work force who become redundant in advance of normal retiring age as a result of the tariff change and are unlikely to find suitable employment because of age, health or physical handicaps, the Government will make provision for early retirement bene " fits such as full superannuation entitlements, retirement grants and early retire " ment allowance.

To minimise social problems for workers and families affected by the tariff changes, family counselling services will be provided. These measures will be implemented through the Department of Social Security. The Government has decided that an initial allocation of $10 million will be made for this purpose.

Assistance to Industries and Firms

Forms of adjustment assistance which should be considered by the Tribunal in relation to industries affected by the proposed tariff reduction include: Rationalization assistance to encourage, when appropriate: - changes in an industry's structure (i.e. numbers of enterprises or estab "

lishments) ; changes in patterns of production (e.g. greater product specialisation or diversification into new areas of production); investment in new equipment; changes in the locational structure of an industry and changes in the indus " trial structure of an affected region. Such assistance may be provided in the form of grants, loans, Joan guaran " tees, or a combination of these. Once its new legislation has been passed, the Australian Industry Development Corporation may be able to assist mergers within industries. Compensation to firms for closure, given when particular establishments cannot remain in production through some form of rationalisation or other adjustment. When production cannot be continued efficiently, the establish " ments concerned should be closed, or the inefficient processes should cease. The long-term scheme under development for adjustment assistance to indus " tries and firms will be administered by an Adjustment Assistance Board empowered to grant specified forms of assistance from a pool of funds appropriated for the purpose. Applications for assistance arising out of tariff changes are expected to be an important part of the Board's activities .

The Government has decided that an effective means of handling this aspect, pending further development of the longer term proposals, is for the Interdepart " mental Committee on Structural Adjustment (acting in concert with the Tribunal responsible for recommending when adjustment assistance is appropriate) to administer assistance to firms affected by the proposed tariff changes. It has decided further that an initial allocation of $10 million will be included in the

197 3/7 4 budget for this purpose.

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A prima facie case for reference to the Tribunal could be established if an industry claiming to be affected by the tariff change can demonstrate: that the firms comprising the industry were viable prior to the effects or likely effects of the tariff change being recommended; and

that tariff change is causing or has caused serious injury affecting viability of the firms or the jobs of their employees in such a way as to cause hard " ship or 'high' social cost; the effects of the tariff change cannot be avoided or offset by action which the industry itself might reasonably be expected to take; the affected firms within the industry are unable to obtain financing needed to make necessary changes on reasonable terms and conditions from com " mercial sources without Government backing.

Procedures for Reviewing Requests for Assistance The following general procedures have been established for reviewing requests for assistance from industries or persons employed in them: ( 1) Requests for assistance should be submitted by organisations representa "

tive of the affected employers and employees. It would be unrealistic to allow for the submission of requests from individuals or single firms, and at the same time to expect careful but speedy review of those requests. (2) To ensure expedition and consistency of approach and result, the exist "

ing inter-departmental machinery for servicing Cabinet's consideration of assistance to industries will be the vehicle for co-ordinating the work of the relevant departments on requests for referral to the Tribunal. ( 3) Requests for assistance should be accompanied by the data which would

be required by the Tribunal to assess damage, and by the Inter-depart " mental Committee on Structural Adjustment to deal with questions of adjustment assistance. The data required will be specified in a question " naire. ( 4) The Tribunal should submit a report on a reference within 60 days of

receiving it. This report should contain advice on: whether the industry or persons employed in it have been, or are likely to be, seriously damaged by the general reduction of tariffs; and, if so, the form of assistance (that is, by tariff action or adjustment assist " ance) which should be given to the industry or employees. (5) If, on the evidence available, the Tribunal considers that adjustment

assistance should be recommended, the general nature, extent and likely cost (to public revenue) of the adjustment assistance will be identified by the Inter-departmental Committee on Structural Adjustment. If tariff action is recommended, the Tribunal's report will recommend its form

and level. ( 6) The Tribunal will submit its reports to the Prime Minister, and they will be published at the same time as the decisions are announced on their recommendations - including the general nature of the decisions on

adjustment assistance , if that form of relief is recommended. It will be noted that this timetable will require the Tribunal to decide on the question of damage within about three weeks of receiving the request for assistance and, if adjustment assistance is to be recommended, will require the Inter-departmental Committee to identify its general nature and extent within the

15

next three weeks. This general and preliminary evaluation of the adjustment assistance required would then be examined by the Tribunal in relation to the question of damage and the alternative forms, and costs, of assistance. The examination and the finalization of its report would have to be completed during the last eighteen days of the sixty-day period.

Composition of Tribunal

The purpose of these procedures for the operation of the Tribunal and related Government institutions is to provide effective machinery for employees and proprietors who feel they may be affected by the action to communicate with the Government; and to provide an advisory system which is at once independent, speedy and informed by the co-ordinated efforts of relevant Government institu " tions. These matters have relevance for the question of the composition of the Tribunal. It has been decided that, with the sharing of institutional responsibility for servicing the Tribunal's work suggested above, one person should comprise the Tribunal - with the provision that, on the recommendation of that person and based on his assessment of the need, the membership of the Tribunal may be expanded to cope with any unforeseen increase in its workload. It is important that the person initially constituting the Tribunal be generally accepted, by employees and proprietors as well as the community at large, as having the neces " sary balance of relevant experience, an understanding of the human problems

(for individuals) which may result from the proposed course of action as well as the potential economic benefits (for the community), and the capacity to use the resources of relevant Government institutions to service the Tribunal's advice. With these considerations in mind, it has been decided that Mr D. McBride has the required balance of skills and experience and would provide disinterested advice on the potentially divisive issues confronting the Tribunal. He will there " fore be appointed as the Tribunal.

As mentioned earlier, the Tribunal will report on whether there is any need for assistance. If it considers that assistance is required, it will recommend either a restoration in part or whole of the original duties or that relief should take the form of adjustment assistance.

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Statement by the Tribunal appointed to examine claims of damage from the tariff reduction announced on 18 .July 1973

Mr D. L. McBride, the Tribunal appointed by the Prime Minister to examine claims of damage from the general tariff reduction, after consultation with the Departments concerned today gave details of the procedures to be followed by those wishing to make such claims.

Employees

Any person who has lost his job or has received notice of dismissal since 18 July 1973 and considers this is a direct result of the general tariff reduction announced on that date, should immediately contact an office of the Common " wealth Employment Service and claim assistance. The officer of the CES will register the applicant for employment and will supply him with a form of statutory declaration for completion by his ex employer to (a) certify that he dismissed

the employee because of the need to economise arising out of the tariff reduc " tions of 18 July 1973; (b) specify the employer's products which have been affected and the tariff item numbers concerned; (c) declare that the ex employee was engaged in work in relation to those products and (d) set out his average weekly earnings over the last six months immediately prior to his dismissal. On

receipt of the statutory declaration the officer of the CES will, unless satis " factory employment can be provided, satisfy himself from information avail " able to him that the statutory declaration is in order and then arrange for the applicant to be paid a weekly amount equal to his average weekly earnings over

the previous six months. Such assistance will commence from the date the appli " cant makes himself available for employment. If suitable employment cannot be found in the town or city concerned, the applicant will be eligible for re-training or re-location assistance with a view to employment elsewhere. As outlined in the press release of the Prime Minister and

the Minister for Overseas Trade and for Secondary Industry, additional social security measures may also be provided. The CES will submit regular reports to the Tribunal as required of the persons claiming and receiving special assistance due to the tariff reduction, and the amounts paid out in such assistance. It will also regularly provide the Tribunal with other relevant statistical information of the labour market. If, in the light

of this information, changes seem desirable in the arrangements outlined above, the Tribunal will vary them.

Firms

Any firm that considers it is being seriously damaged as a direct result of the general tariff reduction announced on 18 July should contact the Department of Secondary Industry or Primary Industry. The Department concerned will then supply the firm with a questionnaire which bas been designed to obtain evidence of the nature and extent of the damage, and provide information about action

taken by the firm to meet or adjust to increased competition from imports. A copy of this questionnaire will be available after Monday, 6 Augu st 1973. When it has been completed, the questionnaire shouid be submitted to either the Department of Secondary Industry or Primary Industry. Wh ere a prima facie case has been established, the Inter-departm ental Committee on Assistance to

Industries will then refer the request to the Tribunal.

17

The nature of the inquiry which will be conducted by the Tribunal, after a request for assistance has been formally referred to it, will depend on the nature of the request. Only in exceptional circumstances will assistance be recommended for a firm without an examination of the industry of which the firm is a part; and because of the general nature of a tariff, increases in particular tariffs will be considered only on an industry basis. Whenever possible, the Tribunal's inquiries will include a public hearing.

Before submitting his recommendations to the Prime Minister on the matters referred to him, the Tribunal will obtain the advice of the Inter-departmental Committee on Structural Change on any adjustment assistance he proposes to recommend. As was indicated in the statements released by the Prime Minister and the Minister for Overseas Trade and for Secondary Industry when the tariff reduction was announced, the Tribunal is to submit his report to the Prime Minister within 60 days of a request for assistance being formally referred to him.

The above statement should be read in conjunction with the statements released by the Prime Minister and the Minister for Overseas Trade and for Secondary Industry on 18 July 1973.

I August 1973

18

FOR PRESS:

STATEMENT ON TARIFF REDUCTION

(Statement by the Hon. J. F. Cairns, Minister for Overseas Trade and Minister for Secondary Industry)

There cannot be one person in Australia who would not feel that inflation is our biggest problem and that the Government must do everything it possibly can to deal with it. Inflation - rapid increases in the cost of living - adversely affects every

worker and person in Australia. The lower his income the worse he is affected. No Government can remain inactive about inflation . But our Australian National Government has very limited power to deal with inflation. Private enterprise, especially the banking system, got off the mark quickly and vastly increased its spending since Labor became the Government in December 1972. The banks and financial institutions alone must have lent well over $2,500 million more in the last 9 months. This has been a significant inflation " ary factor. Most of our inflation, however - more than half the increase in the cost of living - has been caused by extra-ordinary world demand for Australian produced food and raw materials. Inflation now is caused mainly by forces out " side Australia. Price control or justification can help deal with inflation but it

represents no significant or extensive power. And so the Australian National Government recently found itself confined almost alone to further currency appreciation or to tariff reductions to deal with inflation.

We chose a 25% across-the-board tariff reduction as a more relevant, selective and effective means of increasing the supply of goods in Australia than would be currency appreciation. We would have liked to have had the increase in the goods and services we need, come more from Australian production, but what was the position?

Unemployment was falling rapidly and it has continued to fall. Unfilled vacancies in the economy as a whole, and in every industry , were at a record level; delivery times for cars, refrigerators , oil heaters , and many other items were at record long delays. There was a shortage of clothing and textiles. Most of this was a world shortage, and supplies from Hong Kong, Taiwan, and other

similar places were not readily available at current tariff levels. A large increase in domestic spending was expected and we could not hope to increase production in Australia anywhere near the amount that was needed to meet anticipated demand. And so there was a strong and unequivocal case to increase imports. This we could do by a reduction in tariffs .

Of course we may not get the imports we need. Of course importers and retailers in Australia may not reduce the prices of their cars, clothing, textiles, footwear and everything else by the full amount they should to give effect to the tariff reduction . The Prime Minister and I have never suggested they will.

But an increase in supply must have some effect on inflation and must cause some pressure against price increases. What is more, the Government will use the Parliamentary Joint Committee on Prices and the Prices Justification Tribunal

19

to expose those who either fix extravagant margins on imported goods, or who fail to pass on the lower cost brought about by the tariff reduction . Tariff reduction is not a cure-all for inflation, but it's one thing that can be done.

What then about its effects? Very little reduction in production and employ " ment in Australia might take place, but the Government was advised that the reduction of employment available for transfer to other occupations might be as much as about 29,000.

But the vital condition that has been laid down as a pre-requisite to the reduction of tariff was the provision of assistance to both industry and to the workers directly affected by the tariff reductions . Anyone in trouble should immediately notify the Government and they ma y notify me as Minister for Secondary Industry at Parliament House, Canberra, or at the Department of Overseas Trade, 424 St Kilda Road, Melbourne, and action will immediately be taken. No stone will be left unturned.

The Government has appointed a well qualified man, Mr David McBride, to be the Tribunal to whom those affected may immediately appeal. Mr McBride may either give assistance, restore protection, or, of course, dismiss the appeal. The Government has provided $25 million immediately to cover the cost of an operation that it considers is of immediate importance and of long-term sig " nificance, as a humane and sensible way of encouraging beneficial change in the economy. It should have been adopted long since, and if it had been, it would be much more ready for use than it is now.

Any and every person, man or woman, who loses their job will be entitled to Adjustment Assistance of a weekly payment at least equal to their average weekly earnings in the last six months. There will be a limit of $250 a week for each person.

Persons affected by the tariff reduction when they have lost their job, or even when they have not, will have made available to them Retraining Assistance. They may have the benefit of this with the firm with which they are already working, with a view to keeping them there, or they may have the benefit of retraining to go to some other job, where, in most cases, because of their retrain " ing, they would be expected to earn more than for the employment they had lost.

The Government is well aware that most of the difficulty may lie in country towns, and for female workers. Special attention is being given to factories in these towns and to female employment, and assistance will be made available either to bring about transfers, or if necessary, to maintain things as they are. It is to be hoped the Trade Union movement will thoroughly involve itself in the economic and social machinery that will be developing, and if necessary, the Government will provide professional staff to assist the Unions handle problems.

Finally , the Department of Secondary Industry and the Department of Customs and Excise have developed an effective system of import watch which will give early warning of any increases in imports, and in some cases like that of the People's Republic of China, undertakings have been given by the Government that exports to Australia will be limited to gradual increase s; and will be stopped if necessary; and in other cases voluntary arrangements exist between our Gov " ernment and overseas Governments and companies to achieve this purpose.

The reduction of tariffs made by the Government is the most significant reduction of tariffs in Australian history . It bas been done in a genuine effort

20

to deal with inflation and there will be an equally genuine effort to make sure that Government, trade union and business co-operation takes place to ensure that no cost of this will fall only upon those affected, and every effort will be made to see that the position of those who may lose their jobs will actually be

improved.

Canberra, A.C.T.

15 August 1973

21

DIVISION 430/3

ITEM 05: AUSTRALIAN NATIONAL UNIVERSITY - CENTRE FOR

RESEARCH ON FEDERAL FINANCIAL RELATIONS

Supplementary Statement

The Australian National University Centre for Research on Federal Financial Relations was established by agreement between the Australian Government and the Australian National University. The statement on 28 August 1973 by the Attorney-General in the Senate out " lines details of the Centre and its proposed avenues of research. Research relating to the problems of the small States and local government authorities comes within the province of the work of the Centre. A paper 'Fiscal Equalisation for Local Government' by Russell Mathews has recently been produced.

The Director of the Centre, Professor R. L. Mathews , does not receive any income from the funds of the Centre; his salary is met by the University out of its normal funds.

22

Estimates Committee A

Minutes of Proceedings

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.4

TUESDAY, 9 OCT O BER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 3.45 p.m. The Chairman (Senator James McClelland) took the Chair.

2. CONSIDERATION OF PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE: Pursuant to Order of the Senate, the Committee proceeded to consider the particulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the Year ending 30 June 1974, relating to the following departmental estimates:

Document* Page

Division

Department Amount No.

$

A 13-21 120-145 Attorney-General's .. .. 0 " 37,851,000

B 7 810-811 Attorney-General's . . .. 0 " 6,344,100

A 28-29 180 Custom s and Excise .. 0 " 00 43,128,000

B 8 825 Customs and Excise .. . . .. 2,396,000

A 6-9 101-109 Parliament .. 0 0 .. .. 6,741,000

B 6 800 Parliament .. . . 0 0 0. 9,000

A 86-91 430-450 Prime Minister and Cabinet .. 0 . 48,935,000

B 17 920-922 Prime Minister and C abinet 0 0 .. 25,158,100

A 95-101 475-494 Science .. . . .. .. 100,421,000

B 18 930-934 Science 0 . .. . . .. 15,362,000

'' Document A-'Particul ars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the year ending on 30 June 1974'. * Document B-'Particul ars of Certain Proposed Expenditur e in respect of the year ending on 30 June 1974'.

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74-ATTORNEY " GENERAL'S DEPARTMENT - The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration : Divisions 120-145-Attorney-General's Department (Docum ent A ). Divisions 810-811 - Attorney-General's D epartment (Document B).

Appearing: Senator the Hon . L. K. Murphy, the Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officer s: Attorney-General 's Department: Mr C . W . H arders, Secretar y

Mr C . K. Comans, First Parliamentary Coun sel, Office of Parliamentary Counsel Mr G. J. Yuill, Acting First Assistant Secretary, Bu siness Affairs Division

25

Mr N. T. Sexton, Acting First Assistant Secretary, Legislative Drafting Division Mr J. P. Harkins, Acting First Assistant Secretary, Justice and Family Law Division Mr R. L. Harrison, Deputy Commissioner, Office of the Commissioner

of Trade Practices Mr J. M. Davis, Commissioner, Commonwealth Police Force Mr J. T. Johnstone, Inspector-General in Bankruptcy Mr R. A. Wilson, M.V.O., Q.P.M., Commissioner, A.C.T. Police Force Mr K. M . Crotty, Acting Senior Assistant Secretary, Management and

Executive Services Division Mr K. Geary, Acting Director, Finance Section Mr P. A. Seith, Administrative Assistant Department of the Treasury:

Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch The Committee considered Division 120 - Administrative .

4. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 9.45 p.m.

5. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senator James McClelland (Chairman) and Senators Georges, Greenwood, Guilfoyle, McLaren and Wright. Senators Gietzelt, Jessop, Laucke, Milliner, O'Byrne, Townley, Withers and Wood also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

\-J. McCLELLAND

Chairman

26

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.5

THURSDAY, 18 OCTOBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 3.30 p.m. The Chairman (Senator James McClelland) took the Chair.

2. REPLIES TO REQUESTS FOR INFORMATION:

The Chairman tabled a letter from the Attorney-General forwarding to the Committee replie s to questions asked at the previous sitting of the Committee. On the motion of Senator Greenwood the Committee agreed that the material be incorporated in the record of proceedings.

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74-ATTORNEY " GENERAL'S DEPARTMENT: Appearing: Senator the Hon. L. K. Murphy , Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers:

Attorney-General's Department: Mr C. W. Harders, Secretary Mr C. K. Comans , First Parliamentary Counsel Mr L. J. Curtis, First Assistant Secretary, Federal Courts, Intellectual

Property, Territories and Law Reform Division Mr G. J. Yuill, Acting First Assistant Secretary , Business Affairs Division Mr N. T. Sexton, Acting First Assistant Secretary, Legislative Drafting Division Mr J. P . Harkins, Acting First Assistant Secretary, Justice and Family

Law Division Mr R. L. Harrison, Deputy Commissioner, Office of the Commissioner of Trade Practices Mr L. S. J. Harper, Q.P.M., Deputy Commissioner, Administration and

Technical Services, Commonwealth Police Force Superintendent B. A. Rochford, Q.P.M., Au stralian Capital Territory Police Force Mr K. M. Crotty, Acting Senior Assistant Secretary, Management and

Executive Services Division Mr K. Geary, Acting Director, Finance Section Mr P. A. Seith, Administrative Assistant Department of the Treasury:

Mr S. G . Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch

27

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 120-145 - Attorney-General's Department (Document A). Divisions 810-811 - Attorney-General's Department (Document B).

The Committee concluded its consideration of the following Divisions: Division 120 - Administrative, Division 121 - Office of Parliamentary Counsel, Division 123 - Reporting Branch, Division 124 - Crown Solicitor's Offices, Division 126 - High Court, and Division 128 - Bankruptcy Administration. The Committee proceeded to consider Division 129 - Conciliation and Arbitration.

4. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 5.50 p.m.

5. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senator James McClelland (Chairman) and Senators Gair, Georges, Green " wood, Guilfoyle, McLaren and Wright. Senators Sir Kenneth Anderson, Byrne, Laucke, Milliner and Wood also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

J. McCLELLAND

Chairman

28

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.6

MONDAY, 22 OCTOBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 2 p.m. The Chairman (Senator James McClelland) took the Chair.

2. REPLIES TO REQUESTS FOR INFORMATION: The Chairman tabled a letter from the Attorney-General forwarding to the Committee replies to questions asked at the previous sitting of the Committee. On the motion of Senator Georges the Committee agreed that the material be incorporated in the record of proceedings.

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE - ATTORNEY "

GENERAL'S DEP ARTMENT: Appearing: Senator the Hon. L. K. Murphy, Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers : Attorney-General 's Department:

Mr C. W. Harders, Secretary Mr L. J. Curtis, First Assistant Secretary, Federal Courts, Intellectual Property, Territories and Law Reform Division Mr G. J. Yuill, Acting First Assistant Secretary , Business Affairs Division Mr N. T. Sexton, Acting First Assistant Secretary, Legislative Drafting

Division Mr R. L. Harrison, Deputy Commissioner, Office of the Commissioner of Trade Practices Mr J. T. Johnstone, Inspector-General in Bankruptcy Mr L. S. J. Harper, Q.P.M ., Deputy Commissioner, Administration and

Technical Services, Commonwealth Police Force Superintendent B. A. Rochford, Q .P.M ., Au stralian Capital Territory Police Force Mr W. J. McLaren, Commissioner, Northern Territory Police Force Mr K. M. Crotty, Acting Senior Assistant Secretary , Management and

Executive Services Division Mr K. Geary, Acting Director, Finance Section Mr P. A. Seith, Administrative Assistant D epartm ent of the Treasury:

Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 129-145-Attorney-General's Department (Document A).

29

Divisions 810-811 -Attorney-General's Department (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Attorney-General's Department.

4. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-1974-DEPART " MENT OF CUSTOMS AND EXCISE:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. L. K. Murphy, Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers: Department of Customs and Excise: Mr V. Montgomery, First Assistant Comptroller-General (Management

and Technical Services) Mr G. E. Sheen, Assistant Comptroller-General, Imports/Exports Branch Mr F. I. Kelly, Assistant Comptroller-General, Special Services Branch Mr A. B. Luckman, Assistant Comptroller-General, Inland Services

Branch Mr D. G . Marshall, Assistant Comptroller-General, Tariff Branch Mr D. Reith, Assistant Comptroller-General, Automatic Data Processing Branch ∑ Mr D. K. Campbell, Assistant Comptroller-General, Appraisements

Mr D. J. Roche, Assistant Comptroller-General, Revenue Department of the Treasury: Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Division 180-Department of Customs and Excise (Document A). Division 825 - Department of Customs and Excise (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Customs and Excise.

5. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-1974-PARLIA " MENT: Appearing: The President of the Senate, Senator the Hon. Sir Magnus Cormack, and Senator the Hon. L. K. Murphy, Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers:

Department of the Senate: Mr J. R. Odgers, Clerk of the Senate Mr A. R. Cumming Thorn, Clerk-Assistant Mr H. G. Smith, Usher of the Black Rod Mr R. G. Mair, Senior Parliamentary Officer (Administration) Department of the Parliamentary Reporting Staff:

Mr W. C. Bridgman, Principal Parliamentary Reporter Mr F. W. Temperly, Administrative Officer Department of the Parliamentary Library: Mr A. L. Moore, Parliamentary Librarian

Mr H. Knight, Finance Officer Joint House Department: Mr R. W. Hillyer, Secretary Mr R. L. Burrell, Ch ief Executive Officer Department of the Treasury:

Mr S. G . Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch

30

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 101-109 - Parliament (Document A). Division 800 - Parliament (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Parliament.

6. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-1974-DEPART " MENT OF THE PRIME MINISTER AND CABINET:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. L. K. Murphy, Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers: Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet: Mr G. J. Yeend, Deputy Secretary

Mr J. G. Hinton, Assistant Secretary, Services Branch Mr W. N. Weidner, Senior Executive Officer (Finance and Accounts), Services Branch Acquisition of Works of Art and National Gallery: Mr B. E. W. Kelson, Assistant Secretary, Arts and Media Branch

Film and Television School: Mr John Martin-Jones, Assistant Director , Film and Television School Australian Council for the Arts: Dr Jean Battersby , Executive Officer Tariff Reduction Assistance:

Mr T. G. Boag, Senior Adviser, Tariff Operations Branch Mr R. L. Gray, Director, Policy Branch, Secondary Industry Policy Division, Department of Secondary Industry Mr P. J. Beveridge, Assistant Executive Officer, Planning and Research

Division, Department of Labour

Prices Justification Tribunal: Mr N . Brown, Registrar, Prices Justification Tribunal Tariff Board: Mr G. C. Hauff, Chief Executive Officer

Mr A. G. Koukoulas, Director, Management Services Auditor-General 's Office: Mr L. G. D. Farmer, First Assistant Auditor-General. Mr D. W. Burdett, Controller, Auditor-General 's Office

Public Service Board: Mr H . B . MacDonald , Secretary Mr B. P. Harvey, Assistant Commissioner, Organisations Division Mr R. N. Allen, Senior Inspector, Secretar y's Division Department of the Treasury:

Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary , Accounting Operations Branch

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration : Divisions 430-450 - Department of the Prime Minister and C abinet (Docu " ment A). Divisions 920-922 - Department of the Prime Minister and C abinet (Docu "

ment B).

31

The Committee agreed that it should postpone consideration of interviewing Divisions until after consideration of the following: Divisions 430/3/07 and 920/1/02, relating to the Film and Television School.

Division 422 - Australian Council for the Arts. Division 922/01 - Australian National Anthem Quest. Division 922/02 - Adjustment assistance for Tariff Reduction. Division 44 7 - Prices Justification Tribunal. The Committee concluded its consideration of the following:

Division 430/3/07 Division 920/1/02 Division 442.

7. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 11.05 p.m.

8. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senator James McClelland (Chairman), and Senators Georges, Guilfoyle, McLaren and Wright. Senators Milliner, O'Byrne and Prowse also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

J. McCLELLAND

Chairman

32

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.7

TUESDAY, 6 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 8.30 p.m. The Chairman (Senator James McClelland) took the Chair.

2. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-1974-DEPART " MENT OF THE PRIME MINISTER AND CABINET:

Appearing: Senator the Hon . L. K. Murphy, Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers: Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet: Mr G. J. Yeend, Deputy Secretary

Mr J. G. Hinton, Assistant Secretary, Services Branch Mr W. N. Weidner, Senior Executive Officer (Finance and Accounts), Services Branch Acquisition of Works of Art and National Gallery: Mr B. E. W. Kelson, Assistant Secretary, Arts and Media Branch Tariff Reduction Assistance:

Mr T. G. Boag, Senior Adviser, Tariff Operations Branch Mr R. L. Gray, Director, Policy Branch, Secondary Industry Policy Division, Department of Secondary Industry Mr P. J. Beveridge, Assistant Executive Officer, Planning and Research

Division, Department of Labour

Prices Justification Tribunal: Mr N. Brown, Registrar , Prices Justification Tribunal

Tariff Board: Mr G. C. Hauff, Chief Executive Officer Mr A . G. Koukoulas, Director, Management Services Auditor-General 's Office:

Mr L. G. D. Farmer, First Assistant Auditor-General Mr D. W. Burdett, Controller Public Service Board: Mr H. B. MacDonald, Secretary

Mr B. P. Harvey, Assistant Commissioner, Organisation Division Mr R . N. Allen, Senior Inspector, Secretar y's Division Department of the Treasury: Mr C. J. Louttit, Senior Finance Officer, Accounting and Supply Division

33

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 430-450 (other than 430/3/07 and 442) - Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet (Document A). Divisions 920-922 (other than 920/1/02)-Department of the Prime Minister

and Cabinet (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the following Divisions: Division 922 - Other Services. Division 430 - sub-divisions 1 and 2.

Division 44 7 - Prices Justification Tribunal. (Further consideration of Division 430, sub-division 3 was postponed until after consideration of Division 44 7.)

3. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.30 p.m.

4. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senator James McClelland (Chairman) and Senators Georges, Guilfoyle , McLaren and Wright. Senators Durack, Gietzelt, Milliner and O'Byrne also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

J. McCLELLAND

Chairman

34

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.8

TUESDAY, 13 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETIN(J: The Committee met at 8.30 p.m. The Chairman (Senator James McClelland) took the Chair.

2. REPLIES TO REQUESTS FOR INFORMATION: The Chairman tabled letters from the Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise forwarding to the Committee replies to questions asked at previous sittings. On the motion of Senator McLaren the Committee agreed

that the material be incorporated in the record of proceedings.

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 -DEPART " MENT OF THE PRIME MINISTER AND CABINET:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. L. K. Murphy, Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers: Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet: Mr G. J. Yeend, Deputy Secretary

Mr J. G. Hinton, Assistant Secretary, Services Branch Mr W. N. Weidner, Senior Executive Officer, Finance and Accounts, Services Branch Acquisition of Works of Art and National Gallery:

Mr B. E. W. Kelson, Assistant Secretary, Arts and Media Branch Tariff Board: Mr G. C. Hauff, Chief Executive Officer Mr A. G. Koukoulas, Director , Management Services

Auditor-General's Office: Mr L. G. D. Farmer, First Assistant Auditor-General Mr D. W . Burdett, Controller Public Service Board:

Mr H. B. MacDonald, Secretary Mr B. P. Harvey, Assistant Commissioner, Organisation Division Mr R. N. Allen, Senior Inspector, Secretary 's Division Department of the Treasury:

Mr A. L. Ray, Senior Finance Officer, Accounting and Supply Division The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration : Divisions 430-450 - Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet (Docu " ment A) .

35

Division 920-Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet.

4. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-1974-DEPART " MENT OF SCIENCE:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. L. K. Murphy, Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, accompanied by the following officers: Department of Science: Mr J. P. Lonergan, First Assistant Secretary, Policy Division

Mr P. B. Free, Senior Assistant Secretary, General Services Division Mr W. D'E. Lockwood, Finance Officer, National Standards Commission, Sydney Mr K. J. Walshe, Executive Officer, Finance, Bureau of Meteorology,

Head Office, Melbourne Mr C. A. Webster, Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch Mr F. P. McMahon, Administrative Officer, Antarctica Division Mr N. C. Macmullen, Executive Officer, Metric Conversion Board C.S.I.R.O.:

Dr J. A. Allen, Executive Officer Mr P. F. Butler, Senior Assistant Secretary, Agricultural and Biological Sciences Mr S. Lattimore, Senior Assistant Secretary, Industrial and Physical

Sciences Branch Mr R. W. Viney, Senior Assistant Secretary, Finance and Properties Mr H. Kwong, Senior Finance Officer Department of the Treasury:

Mr A. L. Ray, Senior Finance Officer, Accounting and Supply Division

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 475-494-Department of Science (Document A). Divisions 930-934 - Department of Science (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Science.

5. DRAFT REPORT: It was agreed that a draft report to the Senate be prepared for consideration by the Committee.

6. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 9.45 p.m.

7. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senator James McClelland (Chairman), Senators McLaren, Wheeldon and Wright. Senators Cotton, Devitt and Wood also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

J. McCLELLAND Chairman

36

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE A

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.9

TUESDAY 15 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 10.30 a.m. The Chairman (Senator J. McClelland) took the Chair.

2. MINUTES: The Minutes of the meetings held on 9, 18 and 22 October and 6 and 13 November were read and confirmed.

3. REPLIES TO REQUESTS FOR INFORMATION: The Chairman tabled a letter from the Attorney-General and Minister for Customs and Excise, dated 14 November, forwarding information relating to questions asked at a previous sitting of the Committee. It was agreed that the information should be included as an Appendix to the Committee's Report to the Senate.

4. REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE: The Chairman presented a Draft Report for the Committee's consideration. The Draft Report was agreed to, with amendments.

5. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.55 a.m.

6. ATTENDANCE The following members of the Committee were present: Senator James McClelland (Chairman), Senators Gair, Greenwood, Guilfoyle, McLaren, Wheeldon and Wright.

J. McCLELLAND

Chairman

37

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE B

REPORT TO THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE B

REPORT TO THE SENATE

Estimates Committee B has the honour to present its Report to the Senate.

1. On 13 September 1973, the Senate referred to the Committee the Estimates for the year 1973-74 relating to the following Departments: Department of the Special Minister of State Department of Foreign Affairs

Department of the Treasury Department of Services and Property Department of the Capital Territory Department of External Territories

2. The Committee has considered these Estimates and has received explana " tions of them from the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and officers of the Depart " ments concerned. A copy of the Minutes of Proceedings and Hansard reports of the evidence taken by the Committee are tabled for the information of the Senate in connection with Appropriation Bill (No. 1) 1973-74 and Appropriation Bill (No.2) 1973-74.

3. After the completion of the Committee hearings additional information was received in reply to questions asked by Senators and this is included as an Appendix to the Report.

4. The Committee records its appreciation of the explanations provided by the Minister and the officers of the various Departments who assisted him during the examination.

A. J. DRURY

Chairman

13 November 1973

41

Estimates Committee B

Appendix

The Secretary, Estimates Committee B, The Senate, Parliament House, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

COMMISSIONER OF TAXATION Canberra, A.C.T. 2600 Telephone 63 9111 Telex 62187

19 October 1973

Estimates of Expenditure 1973-74 Division Number 582 - Australian Taxation Office Sub-Division 3 - Other Services Item 01 - Taxes and Fines - Remission

Under Special Circumstances

During the Committee's consideration of Division 582, I undertook to supply additional information in response to questions raised by Senator the Hon. R. C. Wright on 11 October 1973.

2. Although some of the specific details requested are not readily available, I trust that the information supplied hereunder will satisfy the questions raised.

3. The decisions of the Relief Board, constituted under Section 265 of the Income Tax Assessment Act 1936-1972, involved a total number of 479 cases during the year ended 30 June 1973. The total amount of relief granted in respect of income tax (477 cases) was $499,506 and in respect of pay-roll tax (2 cases) was $3,459. As I indicated subsequently to Senator Wright, those amounts are not

included in Item 01, not being amounts expended, but rather tax for which release was granted in terms of the Act.

4. Insofar as amounts provided under Item 582-3-01 for remissions of taxes in special circumstances , it is expected that the amount of $5,423,000 will be expended as follows in 1973-1974:

Office Number of Ca ses A verage Cost($)

Canberra 4 275

Sydney 5,400 574

Melbourne 2,018 436

Brisbane 2,053 314

Adelaide 1,210 326

Perth 1,000 320

Hobart 443 185

12,128

45

In 1972-1973, expenditure of $4,985,975 was incurred as follows:

Office Number of Ca ses Average Cost($)

Canberra 3 123

Sydney 4,782 565

Melbourne 1,789 515

Brisbane 2,047 316

Adelaide 1,215 280

Perth 990 311

Hobart 325 206

11,151

5. Remissions of tax under this item broadly cover the following categories of Australian taxpayer stationed overseas - servicemen, Australian Government employees and employees of other Governments and Statutory Authorities.

6. In processing these cases, the function of the Taxation Office is purely administrative . In accordance with firmly settled policy along lines initially deter " mined by Cabinet in 1941 and maintained by successive governments since, the Australian Government and other governmental agencies accept the responsibility for the taxes attributable to allowances granted to compensate employees for higher living costs incurred on overseas postings. The Australian Treasury on the authority of the Treasurer bears that part of the tax that is applicable to allowances paid to servicemen or members of the Australian Public Service. However the tax attribu " table to such allowances paid to members of the State Public Services or employees of governmental agencies or statutory authorities is borne by the Australian Treasury on condition that it is reimbursed by the employer concerned. The amounts reimbursed are credited to this Vote.

J. J. DALY

Acting Director, Establishments Branch

46

The Secretary, Senate Estimates Committee B, Parliament House, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

THE TREASURY, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

24 October 1973

Appropriation Bills No's 1 and 2-Department of the Treasury

On 11 October 1973 during the Committee's examination of Treasury esti " mates, Senators Sim, Cotton, Maunsell and Wright requested further information relating to certain estimates. The information is as follows:

Division 580-2 -Consultants fees-Overseas loan matters The expenditure of $15,296 in 1972-73 represented a payment to a consultant for advice on the raising of overseas loans during a five year period from October 1966. No provision has been made for the year 1973-74.

Division 581-2-04 - Taxation Review Committee-Remuneration to Committee Members, Advisers and personal Staff. Provision has been included in this item to meet the costs of remuneration to Advisers engaged by the Taxation Review Committee as follows:

Mr A. H. Boxer Mr Davis Mr H . G. Brennan Mr N. Cameron Dr N. Fodder Mr G . S. Ray

Assistant to Dr Fodder Accommodation /Housing Allowance (Messrs Davis, Brennan, Ray and Dr Fodder)

$

21,240 12,120 12,336 14,697 12,000 10,100

8,000

7,750

100,000

Division 967-01 - Payments to or for the States - Loan to Queensland for community services- Townsville This loan, which will total $301,000 ($241,000 in 1973-74) is to be made available to Queensland in the form of advances on dates to be arranged by the

Australian and Queensland Governments. Interest is charged on each advance at the long-term bond rate in force at the time of the advance.

Divisions 590 and 970 - Advance to the Treasurer The amounts included in the Appropriation Bills under 'Advance to the Treasurer' since 1963-64 are:

47

1963-64 1964-65 1965-66 1966-67 1967-68 1968-69 1969-70 1970-71 1971-72 1972-73 1973-74

Appropriation Bill No. 1 $m

32

32

20

20

20

20

20

20

25

30

50

Appropriation Bill No. 2 $m

N /A*

N /A*

20

20

20

20

20

20

25

30

50

* Separate Appropriations for Ad vance to the Treasurer were not introduced until 1965-66.

In a further question under this heading Senator Wright requested details of expenditure of $678,910 from the Advance to the Treasurer under Division 875-0-05. In a written submission to the Joint Parliamentary Committee of Public Accounts on the need to seek funds from the Advance to the Treasurer in 1972-73 the Department of Primary Industry supplied the following explanation:

In February 1973 the Government authorised the payment of emergency adjust " ment assistance to the growers of export apples and pears and canning fruit (peaches, pears and apricots) following consideration of the position of rural industries seriously affected by the revaluation of the Australian dollar in December 1972.

The m ain features of the arrangements were: (i) For export apples and pears adjustment assistance of up to $1,500 per grower to be paid, at the rate of 30 cents per bushel on up to 5,000 bushels, on average annual exports of these

fruits in the two years 1971 and 1972;

(ii) For canning apricots , peaches and pears adjustment assistance to be paid to growers on the basis of their deliveries of these fruits to canneries for canning in the 1972-73 season, of up to $1,500 per supplier, at a rate of $12 per ton on up to 25 tons of such fruits. The $678,910 represents the amount paid in 1972-73. An additional amoun t of $2.0 million is being sought under Division 420-3-11 for 1973-74.

Revaluation losses- Reserve Bank and Commonwealth Banking Corporation The information sought by Senator Wright appears on the Notice Paper (Question No. 4 72) and an answer will be provided as soon as details are available.

C. F. GRANT

Assistant Secretary Mana gement Services

48

SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE B

ADDITIONAL ANSWER TO QUESTION AT

HEARING ON 11 OCTOBER 1973

Division 516/1/01

SENATOR WRIGHT Hansard Reference-Page 94

Question I ask the Minister whether he would ask the officers, in conjunction with the Department of Works, to make an assessment of the relevant cost of the same services carried out under the old arrangement by the Department of Works and

now carried out by the new Bureau - however general they like to be. I ask the officers to direct their attention to a comparative study from the point of view of economy.

Answer The Overseas Property Bureau is the authority responsible for all property activities overseas including the provision of office and residential accommodation for all Departments represented overseas, the supply of furniture and equipment, provision of motor vehicles etc. The Bureau will not undertake the detailed design of major projects and will continue to rely for professional advice on the Depart "

ment of Works. It is expected that in turn the Department of Works would engage consultants for a proportion of the projects sponsored by the Bureau. The Overseas Property Bureau will assume responsibility for the administration of property functions formerly the concern of the Departments of Foreign Affairs, Overseas Trade and Immigration. The Department of Works will continue to pro "

vide a service to the Bureau: there is no relationship between the provision for salaries for Bureau staff under Division 516/1 and the eventual provisions under Division 942/1 which provides for capital expenditure on behalf of the Bureau on various projects. The only provision in Appropriation Bill No. 2 is for capital

expenditure at Wellington, New Zealand. The provision will increase quite markedly as the Bureau progressively takes responsibility for additional posts and projects.

49

Estimates Committee B

Minutes of Proceedings

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE B

MINUTES O F PRO CEEDINGS

N O. 3

THURSDAY, 11 OCTOBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 11.30 a.m. The Chairman (Senator Drury) took the Chair.

2. STATEMENT BY CHAIRMAN: The Chairman made a statement relating to the procedure to be followed by the Committee in its examination of the Particulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the year ending 30 June 1973, and stated that, pursuant to the Order of the Senate of 13 Sep " tember 1973, the Committee would consider the following departmental estimates:

Docu- Division Department ment* Page No. Amount

$

A 111-117 540-549 Special Minister of State .. .. 14,570,000

B 20 950 Special Minister of State .. .. 5,200

A 43--48 255-259 Foreign Affairs . . . . .. 124,736,000

B 11 860-862 Foreign Affairs .. .. . . 7,548,800

A 124-128 580-589 Treasury . . .. .. . . 157,723,000

B 22-23 965-967 Treasury . . .. .. .. 40,604,500

A 129 590 Advance to the Treasurer .. .. 50,000,000

B 23 970 Advance to the Treasurer .. .. 50,000,000

A 104-107 515-523 Services and Property . . .. .. 60,284,000

B 18-19 940-942 Services and Property .. .. . . 19,396,100

A 22-24 152-155 Capital Territory .. .. .. 22,880,000

B 7-8 815 Capital Territor y .. .. .. 25,118,000

A 39--42 240-248 External Territories .. .. .. 193,932,000

B 10 855-856 External Territories . . .. .. 21,895,000

* Document A - 'Particulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the year ending on 30 June 1974'. * Document .S - 'Particulars of Certain Proposed Expenditure in respect of the year ending on 30 June 1974'.

Ordered - That consideration of the Estimates for the Departments of Special Minister of State and Foreign Affairs be postponed, and that con " sideration commence with the Estimates for the Department of the Treasury.

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 -DEPART " MENT OF THE TREASURY:

Appearing: Senator the Hon J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs , accompanied by the following officer s:

53

Mr J. R. Bennett, Acting Director (Finance and General Services) Mr B. D. Bell, Acting Finance Officer Miss K. Gleeson, Chief Finance Officer (General Finance and Economic Policy Division) Mr J. J. Daly, Acting Director (Establishments Branch), Australian

Taxation Office Mr D. D. Hume, Director (Services Section), Office of the Superannuation and Defence Forces Retirement Benefits Boards Mr J. G. Miller, Deputy-Commonwealth Statistician, Bureau of Census and

Statistics Mr J. E. Mackay, Acting Assistant Director, General Services, Bureau of Census and Statistics

Treasury Official: MrS. G. Herring. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 580-589-Department of the Treasury (Document A) Divisions 965-967 - Department of the Treasury (Document B) Division 590-Advance to the Treasurer (Document A) Division 970-Advance to the Treasurer (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of the Treasury.

4. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF SERVICES AND PROPERTY:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers: Mr D. M. Lalor, Assistant Secretary (Finance and Supply) Mr J. K. Taylor, Assistant Surveyor-General (Australian Capital Territory

Operations) Mr C. G. Van Senden, Assistant Surveyor-General (Interstate Operations) Mr N. A. Richardson, Acting Principal Executive Officer (Overseas Property Bureau) Mr A. D. White, Director (Programming and Projects) Mr J. J. Skinner, Acting Chief Property Officer (Australian Capital

Territory) Mr C. J. Rowe, Executive Officer (Electoral Branch) Mr P. G. Woodham, Executive Assistant (Parliamentary) Mr R. J. Whalen, Assistant Secretary (Management Services) Mr B. W. Palmer, Director (Management Consultancy) Mr C. S. Hamilton, Acting Finance Officer (Budgeting and Works Pro "

gramming) Mr J. H. MacDonnell, Acting Director (Office Construction)

Treasury Official: MrS . G. Herring. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 515-523 - Department of Services and Property (Document A) Divisions 940-942 - Department of Services and Property (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Services and Property.

54

5. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 -DEPART " MENT OF THE CAPITAL TERRITORY:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers: Mr D. M. Lalor, Assistant Secretary (Finance and Supply) Mr M . W. Edgerley, Director (Forests)

Mr L. L. Gillespie, Assistant Secretary (Housing Operations) Mr N . Braidwood, Director (Public Relations) Mr J. M. Herner, Director (Welfare) Mr B. C. Darke, Assistant Secretary (Transport) Mr N. A Simpson, Manager (Transport Operations) Mr L. I. Crowe, Assistant Secretary (Commercial and Traffic Operations) Mr J. J. Huston, Director (Conservation and Agriculture)

Mr R. M. Smeaton, Senior Inspector (Personnel and Industrial) Mr J. H. Lowe, Acting Assistant Secretary (Public Finance) Mr J. S. Brigg, Acting Assistant Secretary (City Services) Mr C. S. Hamilton, Acting Finance Officer (Budgeting and Works Pro-

gramming)

Treasury Official: MrS. G. Herring. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 152-155 - Department of the Capital Territory (Document A) Division 815 - Department of the Capital Territory (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of the Capital Territory.

6. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF EXTERNAL TERRITORIES:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers: Mr L. W. Temby, Assistant Secretary (Finance) Mr C. E. Reseigh, Assistant Secretary (Special Projects)

Mr M. H. Jolliffe, Acting Assistant Secretary (Public Employment) Mr N. W. Hunt, Officer-in-charge (Finance and Works Programming) Miss A. L. Douglas, Officer-in-charge (Government and Constitutional) Mr G. E. Mannall, Officer-in-charge (Training and General)

Treasury Official: Mr S. G . Herring.

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 240-248 - Department of External Territories (Document A) Divisions 855-856 - Department of External Territories (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of External Territories .

7. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers : Mr J. E. Ryan, First Assistant Secretary (Management Services) Mr P. C . J. Curtis, Assistant Secretary (Personnel Branch)

Mr. R. G. Spratt, Assistant Secretary (Aid Branch)

55

Mr R. Ashwin, Assistant Secretary (Information and Cultural Relations Branch) Mr R. Butler, Assistant Secretary (United Nations Branch) Mr A. L. Fogg, Assistant Secretary (Services Branch) Mr. F. C. Murray, Director (Overseas Property Section) Mr R. J. McCoy, Acting Director (Finance Section) Treasury Official: MrS. G. Herring. The Minister for Aboriginal Affairs (Senator Cavanagh) made a statement to the Committee on Estimates for the Department of Foreign Affairs 1973-74. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 255-259 - Department of Foreign Affairs (Document A) Divisions 860-862-Department of Foreign Affairs (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Foreign Affairs.

8. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART " MENT OF THE SPECIAL MINISTER OF STATE: Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers:

Mr F. C. Boyle, Assistant Secretary (General Branch) Mr J. Gavin, Director (Establishments and Finance Branch) Mr I. Gillespie, Officer-in-charge (Finance and Personnel Section) Mr W. D. Richardson, Acting National Librarian, Australian National

Library Mr G. Clark, Director (Management Services) Mr J. Dunner, Director, Commonwealth Archives Office Mr P. Priestly, Administrative Officer, Commonwealth Archives Office Mr D. Moye, Secretary, Grants Commission Treasury Official : Mr S. G. Herring.

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 540-549-Department of the Special Minister of State (Document A) Division 950 - Department of the Special Minister of State (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of the Special Minister of State.

8. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 5.59 p.m. till a date and hour to be fixed.

9. ATTENDANCE : The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cotton, Drury, McManus , Maunsell, Milliner, Primmer and Sim (7). Senators Sir Kenneth Anderson, Devitt, Georges, O 'Byrne, Withers and Wright also took part in the Committee's proceedings .

56

A J. DRURY

Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE B

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

NO. 4

TUESDAY, 13 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 8.15 p.m.

2. MINUTES: The Minutes of the previous meeting were confirmed on the motion of Senator Cotton.

3. REPORT: On the motion of Senator Milliner, the draft report of the Com " mittee was approved.

4. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Drury (in the Chair), Cotton. Milliner and Primmer.

57

A. J. DRURY Chairman

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE C

REPORT TO THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE C

REPORT TO THE ~ENATE

Estimates Committee C has the honour to present its report to the Senate.

1. On 13 September 1973, the Senate referred to the Committee the Estimates for the year 1973-74 relating to the following Departments: Media Social Security

Education Tourism and Recroofum Immigration Postmaster-General's Health

2. The Committee has considered these Estimates and has received explana " tions of them from the Minister for the Media, and, during his absence, from the Minister for Primary Industry. A copy of the Hansard report of the evidence is tabled for the information of the Senate in connection with the Appropriation Bill (No. 1) 1973-74 and the Appropriation Bill (No. 2) 1973-74.

3. Subsequent to the hearing of evidence and in accordance with undertakings given during the hearings, additional information was forwarded to the Committee in reply to certain questions asked during the proceedings. Copies of these replies are attached as an Appendix to the Report.

4. During its examination of the Estimates for the Department of Social Security, Members of the Committee queried whether it was appropriate that proposed expenditure for the National Health Insurance Plan and the National Commission on Social Welfare should be included in Appropriation Bill (No. 1)

1973-74, a bill which, under s.53 of the Constitution, the Senate may not amend, rather than Appropriation Bill (No.2) 1973-74, a bill which the Senate may amend.

5. The Committee was concerned to ensure that the 1965 compact announced by the then Treasurer, Mr Holt, on 13 May 1965 had been complied with. The Minister for Primary Industry, Senator Wriedt, undertook to have the matter referred to the Treasurer. The reply of the Treasurer, Mr Crean, dated 19 October

1973, reads, in part, as follows:

In determining bids to be included in Bill No . 2 (Document B) for these Commissions l have observed the undertaking given by the then Treasurer , Mr Holt, which was expressed in Hansard, Volume 46 pp. 1484-1485 of 13 May 1965 as follows:

'the Government has now decided that henceforth there will be a separate Bill .... , subject to amendment by the Senate, containing appropriations for expenditure on -(a) the construction of public works and building s;

(b) the acquisition of sites and building s; (c) items of plant and equipment which are clearly definable as capital expenditure; (d) grants to the States under section 96 of the Co nstitution ; and

(e) new policies not authorised by special legislation.'

61

This undertaking followed Mr Holt's separate discussions with a Committee of Government Senators and representative Members of the House of Repre " sentatives in May 1965 in order to reach agreement on how to proceed on the recommendations of a Committee appointed by Government Senators on 'Appropriation Bills and the Ordinary Annual Services of the Government'.

The undertaking (e) above in relation to new policies was in fact a precis of recommendation ( 8) contained in that Committee's Report of 28 October 1964: '(8) New policie s: As far as possible , the first provision for new policies

which have not been authorised by special legislation , and for which the only Government authorisation proposed is an annual Appropria " tion Act, should be included in a Bill for other than the ordinary annual services of the Government.' The underlining has been added because it highlights the crux of the issue which distinguishes the provisions to which your Committee took exception, from other provisions for new policy included for the first time in Document B. It seems to me that the proposed expenditures questioned by members of Com " mittee C conform in that the Social Welfare Commission Bill 1973 is now before the Senate and I understand that the Minister for Social Security intends to introduce the Health Insurance Commission Bill 1973 during the current sittings.

Moreover, the practice followed this year is consistent with that adopted in the past, e.g., the provision for the Australian Commission on Advanced Educa " tion, Division 237, Appropriation Act (No. 1) 1971-72 (the enabling legislation was assented to on 9 December 1971) and the provision for the administrative expenses of the Anglo-Australian Telescope Board, Division 234, Appropria " tion Act (No.1) 1970-71 (the enabling legislation was assented to on 4 November

1970).

6. While noting the Treasurer's reply, the Committee expresses some concern as to whether this interpretation is strictly in accordance with the spirit of the 1965 compact.

7. The Committee is aware that problems of a similar nature may, from time to time, confront the other five Estimates Committees and could ultimately be of concern to the Senate.

8. The Committee therefore recommends - That the matter of the inter " pretation of the 1965 compact insofar as it relates to new policies should be referred to the Senate Standing Committee on Constitutional and Legal Affairs.

9. The Committee is also of the opinion that, for the future consideration of particulars of proposed expenditure by Estimates Committees, it would be most helpful if the estimates for all such schemes as the National Health Insurance Plan were separated out from a department's normal proposed administrative expenditure.

J. A. MULVIHILL

Chairman

13 November 1973

62

Estimates Committee C

Appendix

DEPARTMENT OF SOCIAL SECURITY

17 October 1973

The Chairman, Senate Estimates Committee C, Parliament House, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

At the meeting on 11 October 1973 the Committee requested further informa " tion appertaining to this Department's Estimates of Expenditure.

The statements required are: Functional Classification of Estimates of Staff Establishment on a Divisional Basis Functional Disposition of Staff Poverty Enquiry Research Projects 30 copies of each are attached.

Expenditure - Attachment A - Attachment B -Attachment C - Attachment D

It should be noted that the estimates for Salaries and Allowances, Item 530-1-01 in Appropriation Bill No. 1, is based on the establishment as at 30 June 1973 as shown in Attachment Bless the National Welfare Fund component. The establishment as at 31 August 1973 is shown as additional information.

65

L. J. DANIELS Director-General

ATTACHMENT A

D EPARTMENT OF SOCIAL SECURITY

ESTIMATES OF EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - FUNCTIONAL CLASSIFICATION APPROPRIATION BILL No. 1

Other

Health Other Social

Insurance Health Security

Plan Functions Functions Total

$ $ $ $

DIVISION 530 - ADMINISTRATIVE 1. Salaries and Payments in the Nature of Salary 01 Salaries and Allowances 140,000 3,536,000 28,529,000 32,205,000

02 Overtime 4,000 121,000 991,000 1,116,000

144,000 3,657,000 29,520,000 33,321,000

2. Administrative Expenses 01 Travelling and subsistence 20,000 90,000 924,000 1,034,000

02 Office requisites and equipment, stationery and printing 1,175,000 310,000 1,196,000 2,681,000

03 Postage, telegrams and telephone services .. .. 5,110,000 5,110,000

04 Office services 00 10,000 210,000 220,000

05 Payments for services of Registrars and Agents 00 0 0 115,000 115,000

06 Payments to Postmaster-General's Department for services 00 20,000 180,000 200,000

07 Medical examinations 00 0 0 237,000 237,000

08 Computer services . 37,000 10,000 603,000 650,000

09 Publi<;ity 1,725,000 30,000 280,000 2,035,000

10 Incident al and other expenditure 77,000 50,000 511,000 638,000

3,034,000 520,000 9,366,000 12,920,000

l. Other Services 0 0 .. 39,492,000 39,492,000

Total Division 530 3,178,000 4,177,000 78,378,000 85,733,000

DIVISION 532 - NATIONAL COMMISSION ON SOCIAL WELFARE 00 .. 351,000 351,000

APPROPRIATION BILL No . 2

DIVISION 945-CAPITAL WORKS AND SERVICES 2. Plant and Equipment 01 Computing equipment 7,400,000 .. 5,900,000 13,300,000

02 Rehabilitation Service 00 0 0 57,000 57,000

7,400,000 0 0 5,957,000 13,357,000

DIVISION 947 - PAYMENTS TO OR FOR THE

STATES 00 .. 2,075,000 2,075,000

DIVISION 948 - OTHER SERVICES . 0 0 .. 1,720,000 1,720,000

66

ATTACHMENT B

E ST A BLI SHMEN T FIGU RES

30.6.72

Cwlth N.S.W . Vic. Q ld. S.A. W .A. Tas. Total

----- - ------------------ 1st Division . 1 .. .. .. . . .. .. 1 Compensation Tribunal 1 .. .. .. .. .. . . 1 Commissioner for Employees' Compensation 1 .. .. .. .. . . .. 1 2nd Division . 9 1 1 1 .. .. .. 12 3rd Division . 326 701 530 309 255 178 73 2,372 4th Division . 80 823 520 292 194 146 57 2,042 Part-time 1 .. .. .. .. .. . . 1 NWF 3rd .. 39 45 17 16 15 .. 132 4th .. 88 80 46 40 38 .. 292 ----------- - ------------ Total 419 1,652 1,176 665 505 377 130 .. 4,924 30.6.73 Cwlth N .S.W. Vic. Qld. S.A. W .A. Tas. Total ------ - .---- - ------------ 1st Division 1 . . .. .. . . . . .. 1 Compensation Tribunal 1 .. .. .. . . . . .. 1 Commissioner for Employees' 1 Compensation 1 .. . . .. .. . . . . 2nd Division . 14 1 1 1 .. .. . . 17 3rd Division . 562 952 711 482 462 306 108 3,583 4th Division . 151 975 686 389 297 209 71 2,778 Part-time 1 .. .. .. . . .. . . 1 NWF 3rd .. 39 66 17 18 21 .. 161 4th .. 89 118 48 40 43 .. 338 -- - --------------------- Total 731 2,056 1,582 937 817 579 179 .. 6,881 31.8.73 Cw lth N .S.W. Vic. Q ld. S.A. W.A. Tas. Total ----- - -------- - --------- 1st Division 1 .. .. .. .. .. . . 1 Compen sation Tribunal 1 .. .. .. .. .. . . 1 Commi ssioner for Employees' Compensation 1 . . .. .. .. .. . . 1 2nd Division . 30 1 1 1 .. .. . . 33 3rd Division . 616 969 749 501 490 344 140 3,809 4th Division . 176 990 680 435 330 220 87 2,918 Part-time 1 .. .. . . .. .. . . 1 NWF 3rd . . 39 66 18 18 21 .. 162 4th .. 89 118 50 40 44 .. 341 -------- - -- - --- ----- - --- Total 826 2,088 1,614 1,005 878 629 227 .. 7,267 NWF 424 J 30.6.72 OTH ER 4,500 N WF 499 J 30.6.73 OTHER 6,382 N WF 503 J 31.8.73 OTHER 6,764 67

D EPA RT MENT O F SOCI AL SE CURIT Y

FUN CTIO NA L DISP O SITIO N O F STAFF BY STATES - 30 JUNE 1972 AND 30 JUNE 1973

Cwlth N.S.W. Vic. Qld.

30.6.72 30.6.73 Balance 30.6.72 30.6.73 Balance 30.6.72 30.6.73 Balance 30.6.72 30.6.73 Balai -- --------- -------- - -- - -- - - ----- 1- Management 228 338 +110 356 492 +136 265 370 +105 160 271 +111L C.O. Soc. Sec. Division 60 78 + 18 Pensions . 243 243 197 233 + 36 96 114 +1 Family Allowances 166 153 -13 114 119 + 5 43 56 + n U.&S .B . 113 88 - 25 119 116 - 3 49 62 + 1 Outdoor Inquiry 31 31 24 23 - 1 17 17 Regional Offices 519 640 +121 251 324 + 73 173 216 + 4: Compensation Division 58 58 H .I.B. Division I 127 +127 144 +144 102 +102 60 + 6(∑ Social Work and Welfare 36 36 22 47 + 25 19 43 + 24 22 28 + f Other Welfare Services 37 45 + 8 75 90 + 15 62 68 + 6 42 48 + t Commissions and Committees of I Inquiry 49 + 49 ------ -------------- - -------- ------ Totals 419 731 + 312 1,525 1,928 +403 1,051 1,398 + 347 602 872 + 270 -------------------- --------- - - ---- Staff employed at R ehabilitation centres and paid + il from the N .W .F. 127 128 + 1 125 184 + 59 63 65 -- - - ---- --------------- ---------- Totals 419 731 + 361 1,652 2,056 + 404 1,176 1,582 +406 665 937 + 272 68

ATTACHMENT C

S.A. W.A. Tas. Total

30.6.72 30.6.73 Balance 30.6.72 30.6.73 Balance 30.6.72 30.6.73 Balance 30.6.72 30.6.73 B alance - ------- - ------ - ---- --- --- - --- - -----

144 324 + 180 101 192 + 91 46 59 +13 1,300 2,046 + 746

60 78 + 18

96 151 + 55 72 95 + 23 28 40 +12 732 876 + 144

37 36 - 1 35 36 + 1 10 7 - 3 405 407 + 2

59 59 60 72 + 12 11 18 +7 411 415 + 4

9 9 8 8 3 3 92 91 - 1

54 68 + 14 15 24 + 9 18 22 +4 1,030 1,294 + 264

58 58

I

49 + 49 43 + 43 15 +15 540 + 540

12 19 + 7 9 14 + 5 5 5 125 192 + 67

I 38 44 + 6 24 31 + 7 9 10 + 1 287 328 + 49

I

49 + 49

- - - - -- - - - - ----------------- ---------

449 759 + 310 324 515 + 191 130 179 +49 4,500 6,382 + 1,882

----------- ------- - ----------- --- - - -

56 58 + 2 53 64 + 11 424 499 + 75

------ - - --- - - ---- - --- - ----- ----- ---- 505 817 + 312 377 579 +202 130 179 +49 4,924 6,881 + 1,957

69

ATT A C H MENT D

CO M MONWEA LTH COMMISSION O F EN QUIR Y IN TO PO VE RT Y

PRO FE SSOR R. F. H EN DERSO N : RE SEA RCH PROJE CTS

Date of Person or body to conduct Brief description of Estimated Approval No. letter from Commission the research project project cost status

--- 1. 6/10/72 Victorian Council of Development of a model $ 9,600 Approved (ff1-2, Social Services for service planning and 23/10/72 A9307) delivery. (A9307, f7) --- 2. 26/10/72 Mr D. Adams and Availability of social wei- $ 1,000 Approved (ff9-12, Mrs C. F . Tilse, fare services in different 14/11/72 A9307) University of Queensland parts of Brisbane. (A9307, fl4) --- 3. 27/10/72 Mr D. Scott and Mrs C . Evaluation of an income $10,000 Approved (ff20-23, Benn, Brotherhood of St support scheme for a 14/11 /72 A9307) Laurence sample of poor families. (A9307, f27) - -- 4. 3/11/72 Mr A. J. Peddlesden and Factors which influence $ 4,255 Approved (ff28-29, Miss Strachan, Victorian the decision by elderly 15/11/72 A9307) Council on the Ageing people to seek accommo- (A9307, f30) dation in an institu tion. 5. 15/11/72 Part I Poverty among farmers $12,768 Approved (ff33-36, Prof. A. Lloyd and and graziers in Shelford, 20/11/72 A9307) Dr A . Watson D undas, and Wimmera. (A9307, f37) Effectiveness of govern-me nt programmes: ---------------- --------- ------- ------ ∑ Part II Study of incomes and $ 8,318 P. W . Salmon, Dr H . S. social problems of inhabi-Hawkins and w. K. !ants of small rural town-Bartlett, School of Agri- ships. culture, Department of Psychology, University of Melbourne 6. 21 /11 /72 Dr F . Gale, University of Poverty among Aborigines $ 7,000 Approved (f38, Adelaide, Rev. G. Martin, in South Australia . 24/11 /72 A9307) Pt. Adelaide Methodist (A9307, f51) Mission 7. 21 /ll/72 Prof. J. S. Nalson, Uni- Poverty in the rural sector $ 8,169 Approved (ff39-40, versity of New Eng.Jand and possible welfare 24/11 /72 A9307) measures to allevia te this. (A9307, F52) - -- 8. 18/12/72 Directing Committee: Study of social and econ- $13,000 Approved (f74-75, Prof. R. C . Gates, Mrs E. omic conditions of urban 21 /12/72 A9307) R. Cham berlain, M. J. Aborigines. (A9307, F78) Gibbings, Dr J. Stuart, Miss R . A . Hirschfield , Economics and Social Work Departments of the University of Queensland --- 9. 18/12/72 N.S.W . Division of Aus- Indepth study of thirty $ 2,000 Approved (ff76-77, tralian Red Cross Society families drawn from its 21 /12/72 A9307) metropolitan caseload. (A9307, f79) 10. 18/12/72 Vic. Division of Austra- Jndepth study of thirty $ 2,360 Approved (ff76-77, !ian Red Cross Society families drawn from coun- 21 /12;72 A9307) try caseloads. (A9307, f79) --- 11. 19/12/72 Steering Committee: Dr L. Research study on home- $ 8,000 Approved (ff80-81, Mann, Rev. K . Seaman, less men and alcoholics. 29/12/72 A9307) Prof. R. Brown, Adelaide (A9307, F88) Central Methodist Mis-sion and Flinders Univer-sity 70

Date of Person or body to conduct No . letter from Commi ssion the research project - --

12. 19/12/72 Prof. w . F. Musgrave,

(ff82-83, Prof. J. Nalson, Assoc. A9307) Prof. P. G. James, Mr B.

Hardaker, Mr R . Powell, Mr P. A . Rickards, Uni-versity of New England

13. 18/12/72 Council of social service (ff84-85, of N .S.W. A9307)

14. 19/12/72 Mr P . Payne, Dr Clements, (ff86-87. Smith Family N.S.W. A9307)

15. 24/l/73 Prof. A. H . Pollard , Prof. (ff96-97. C . B. Kerr, Dr H. Lucas, A9307) Mr F . D. Hayes, Dr T .

Vinson, and the N.S.W . Bureau of Crime Statistic s and Research

16. 25/1/73 Rev. D. Cox, Victorian

(ff102-103, Council of Churches, Ecu-A9307) menical Migration Centre

17. 26/1/73 Hindmarsh Area Research (ffl04-106, Committee (including Rev. A9307) I. L. Gaskill, Chairman)

18. 5/2/73 Australian Council of (ff111-112, Social Service A9307)

- --

19. 7/3/73 Prof. J. Martin, Sociology (ff134-135, Department, La Trobe A9307) University

20. 14/3!73 Mr R. Francis,

(ff137-139, Anthropology Department, A9307) University of Western Australia

21. 29/3/73 Dr K . Hill, Social Work

(ff142-143, Department, University of A9307) Western Australia

22. 7/5!73 Fi t~ ro y Ecumenical Centre

(ffl60-162 , A9 307)

Brief description of project

Extent of poverty in rural sectors of N .S.W . and Queensland. Examination of existing data.

An examination of the ser-vices provided by Com-munity Aid Centres in N .S.W.

Dietary patterns of a sample of Smith Family clients.

Extent to which govern-mental and voluntary ser-vices penetrate areas of concentrated need in New -castle; also attitudes of persons in these areas to welfare and health ser-vices.

Role of ethnic groups in migrant welfare.

Broad study of aspects of poverty in the Hindmarsh Area of Adelaide where there is a high concentra-

tion of migrants and un-employment.

Provision of funds to assist 'client groups' to fully participate in the inquiry.

Study of community ser-vices in the Heidelberg area of Melbourne.

Study of socio-physical environment of the City of Fremantle, W.A.

Study of Aboriginal poverty in the towns of Gnow angerup and Quaira-ding in We stern Australia.

Study of the extent to which the Victorian Hous-ing Commi ssion meets the needs of low income groups.

71

ATTACHMENT D

- continued

Estimated Approval cost status

$11,500 Approved 29/12/72 (A9307, F90)

$ 8,450 Approved 29/12/72 (A9307, f89)

$10,700 Approved 29/12/72 (A9307, f91)

$ 8,000 Approved 16/2!73 (A9307, f99)

$ 4,780 Approved 16/2!73 (A9307, £107)

$10,000 Approved 16/2/73 (A9307, f1 08)

$12,000 Approved 16/2/73 (A9307, fl19)

$ 9,250 Approved 15/3!73 (A9307, £136)

$ 700 Approved

23/3/73 (A9307 , fl40)

$12,850 Approved 11 /4/73 (A9307 , fl44)

$ 6,225 Approved 14/5/73 (A93 07, fl63)

Date of Person or body to conduct Brief description of No. letter from Commi ssion the research project project

23. 7/5/73 Fitzroy Ecumenical Centre A study of the financial (ffl60-162 and social problems of

A9307) tenants in the private

rental market.

24. l/6/73 Au stralian A ssociation of (A) (ffl66-168, Social Workers Content analysis of atti-A9307) tudes towards the poor in

federal welfare legislation. ---------------- (B) Documentation on the trainin g and education of social work personnel, to-gether with material on welfare manpower gener-ally. --- 25. 13/7/73 Mr R. Jolly, Australian A survey of the circum- (ff194-195, Council of Trade Unions stances of juveniles, especi-A9307) ally those in low income occupations . 26. 23/8/73 Miss V . Routley, Fitzroy A study of the needs of (ff217-218, Communit y Youth Centre youth in an inner subur-A9307) ban area, and of a service attempting to meet those needs. --- 27. 31/8/73 Agricultural Business Re- Survey of dairy farmers on (ff278-279, search Institute, University the north coast of New A9307) of N ew England South Wales. 72

ATTACHMENT D

-continued

Estimated Approval cost status

$ 7,900 Approved 14/5/73 (A9307 , f163)

$ 5,600 Approved 19/6/73 (A9307, fl8l)

- ----- ∑

$ 500

$ 6,600 Approved 3/8/73 (A9307, fl97)

$ 350 Approved

3/9!73 (A9307, f236)

$ 800 Under

Consideration

COMMONWEALTH COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY INTO POVERTY

MR R. T. FITZGERALD: RESEARCH PROJECTS

Date of Person or body to conduct Brief description of Estimated Approval No. letter from Commission the research project project cost status

1. 12/6/73 Australian Council for An investigation of the $44,750* Approved ( ff184-186, Educational Research. special problems of edu- 20/6/73 A9308) cational and cultural dis- (A9308, fl91)

advantage among adoles-cents.

2. 27/6/73 Prof. P. w. Musgrave, A sociological study of at- $18,690 Approved (ff214-217. Faculty of Education, titudes towards education 18/9/73 A9308) Monash University . and related services in (A9308, f238)

rural communities.

3. 13/7 !73 Mr P. Thomson, A us- An investigation of the $ 1,000 Approved

(ff219-222, tralian Council of Edu- extent of, and remedies 21 /8/73 A9308) cational Research. for, the handicaps imposed (A9308, f230)

on secondary students from low income families by inadequate knowledge of career opportunities.

" An increase of $6,007 in the budget for this research project was approved on 27/8/73 (A9308, f233).

73

COMMONWEALTH COMMISSI O N OF EN Q UIRY INTO POVERTY

REVEREND G. MARTIN : RESEARCH PR O JECTS

Date of Person or body to conduct Brief description of Estimated Approval No. letter from Commi ssion the research project project cost status

--- 1. 9/2/73 Miss J. Carside (A us- R elationship between pov- $ 7,500 Approved (fl21, tralian Council for Re- erty and the handicapped 16/2/73 A9307) habilitation of Disabled). with particular attention (A9 307, fl22) to the needs of the handi- Revision capped. (This project was approved originally requested by 28/8/73 Prof. Henderson but is (A9309, f82). now under the control of Inc. of $1 00. Rev. Martin.) 2. 22/3/73 Dr T . Murrell, Reader in A study of the utilisation $ 9,950 Approved (ff20-21, Community M e d i c i n e , of health services in the 4/4/73 A9309) University of Adelaide. Hind marsh area of A de- (A9309, f23) !aide. 3. 22/5/73 Dr C . Kerr, Professor of A study of the socio-eco- $ 4,500 Approved (ff35-36, Preventive and Social nomic and cultural as- 20/6/73 A9309) Medicine, University of pects of health insurance (A9309 , f52) Sydney. and medical care utili sa-tion in relation to Greek immigrants. 4. 22/5/73 Dr A. C . Harper, Director An examination of the $ 9,000 A pproved (ff37-38, of Research and Training, effectivene ss of the Glebe 20/6/73 A9309) Community C are Teach- Community Service in (A9309 , f52) ing Unit, Royal Prince AI- meeting the needs of fred Hospital; Dr T. R. underprivile ged persons. King, Director Medical Services, Royal Prince AI-fred Hospital; Prof. T . Brennan, Department of Social Work , University of Sydney. 5. 24/8/73 Australian Council of An analysis of a survey of $ 500 Approved (ff83-84, Social Service. homemaker services in 27/9/73 A9309) Au stralia (A9309/99) 6. 17/8/73 Dr J. Krupinski, Insti-Preliminary stage of a re- $ 400 Approved (ff74-75, tute of Mental Health search project on 'The 14/9/73 A9309) Research. Impact of Psychiatric Ill- (A9309 , f89) ness upon Low Status Persons'. 7. 26/9/73 Family Planning Associa- A study of the utilisation $ 3,455 Under (ff101-103, tion (S.A .) Incorporated. of family planning services C onsideration A9309) by the poor. 74

CO MM O NWE ALTH C O MM ISSION OF EN Q U ffiY INT O PO VE RTY

PRO FESS O R R . GA TES : RESEAR C H PROJ ECTS

Date of Person or body to conduct Brief description of Estimated Approval No. letter from the research project project cost status Commi ssion I. 18/5/73 Prof. C. P. Harris, James Role of Local Government $10,000* Approved (ff10-ll' Cook University of North Authorities in the pro- 19/6/73 A9310) Queensland. vision of welfare services . (A9310, f16)

2. 27/7/73 Australian Institute of A comparative survey and $11,800 Under (ff24-26, Urban Studies. analysis of the supply, fin- Consideration

A9310) ancing and administration

of personal welfare ser-vices in metropolitan areas throughout Australia.

3. 27 !7 /73 br N. Podder, Depart- A study of the economic $11,250 Approved (ff27-30, ment of Economics, Aus- circumstances of the poor 10/10/73 A93 10) tralian National Univer- (an indepth analysis of in- (A9310, f82) sity. formation gathered in the

Australian Survey of Con-sum er Expenditures and Finances, 1966-68).

4. 29/8/73 Professor Western and D r An examination of the in- $10,956 Unde r (ff40-45, Wilson, Department of cidence of consumer diffi- Consideration A9310) Anthropology and Socio- culties. logy, University of Queens-

land.

* An increase of $4,400 in the budget for this project was approved on 19/9/73 (A9310, f53).

75

COMMONWEALTH COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY INTO POVERTY

PROFESSOR R. SACKVILLE: RESEARCH PROJECTS (AS AT 20-7-73)

Date of Person or body to conduct Brief description of Estimated Approval No. letter from Commission

the research project project cost status

1. 2/2/73 Mr M . Cass, University An investigation of the $14,000 Approved ( ff1 09-110, of New South Wales relationship between pov- 16/2/73

A9307) erty and its related vari- (A9307, f118)

abies of education and oc-cupation to knowledge and experience of the legal system. (This project was originally requested by Prof. Henderson but is now under the control of Prof. Sack ville.)

2. 24/4/73 Mr A. Jakubowicz An examination of the $ 8,o35 Approved

(ff10-12, (School of Sociology, contacts of migrants with 3/5/73

A9311) Univ. of N.S.W.). the legal system in both (A9311, f19)

Rev. D. Cox (Victorian criminal and civil pro-Council of Churches Ecu- ceedings. menical Migrant Centre, Melbourne). Mr A. Jamrozik (School of Social Sciences, Flin-ders University) .

3. 24/4!73 Prof. R. Baxt, Faculty of An examination of the $10,875 Approved (ffl3-14, Law, Monash University. problems posed for the 3/5/73

A9311) poor by the consumer (A9311, f19)

credit law.

4. 24/4/73 Mr A . Bradbrook, Faculty An examination of the $10,075 Approved (ff15-17, of Law, Univ. of Mel- impact of tenancy law 3/5/73

A9311) bourne. Miss J. Brown, upon the poor in both the (A9311, f19)

A.C.O.S.S. Miss J. Wil- public and private hous-Iiams, Faculty of Law , ing sectors Monash University .

5. 21 /5/73 Prof. D. Roebuck, Law An examination and ev- $ 350 Approved

(f23, School, University of Tas- aluation of existing legal 19/6/73 A9311) mania. aid facilities in Tasmania. (A9311, f35)

6. 28/6/73 Mr D. St. L. Kelly, De- An examination of the $10,250 Approved

(ff42-44) partment of Law, Uni- procedures for enforce- 30/8/73

versity of Adelaide. ment of judgment debts (A9311, f98)

and the impact of those procedures on the poor.

--- 7. 9/7/73 Dr T. Vinson, N .S.W. A study of the geo- $ 1,500 Approved (ff45-47) Bureau of Crime Statistics graphical distribution of 30/8/73 and Research. legal services in New (A9311, f98) South Wales. 8. 27/8/73 Mr W. B. Fisse, Faculty An examination of certain $ 9,490 Under (ff89-95, of Law, University of aspects of bail for ac- Consideration A9311) Adelaide. cused persons of limited means. 76

Dear Senator Mulvihill,

TREASURER

Parliament House. Canberra 2600 19 October 1973

At the meeting of Senate Estimates Committee C on 11 October 1973, questions were asked about the inclusion of appropriations for the National Com " mission on Social Welfare, to be established by the Social Welfare Commission Bill 1973, in Document A (Particulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the Year ending on 30 June 1974) rather than in Document B (Particulars of Certain Proposed Expenditure in respect of the Year ending on 30 June 1974). Questions were also asked about the inclusion of certain provisions in the general

administrative votes of the Department of Social Security ∑ for expenditures associated with advertising, stationery and other costs to be incurred in respect of the National Health Insurance Plan to be established under the Health Insur " ance Commission Bill 1973. The Social Welfare Commission Bill 1973 is now with the Senate at Second Reading stage and the Health Insurance Commission Bill 1973 is proposed for early introduction into Parliament.

In determining bids to be included in Bill No. 2 (Document B) for these Commissions I have observed the undertaking given by the then Treasurer, Mr Holt, which was expressed in Hansard, Volume 46 pp. 1484-1485 of 13 May 1965 as follows:

the Government has now decided that henceforth there will be a separate Bill . . . , subject to amendment by the Senate, containing appropriations for expenditure on -(a) the construction of public works and buildings;

(b) the acquisition of sites and buildings; (c) items of plant and equipment which are clearly definable as capital expenditure; (d) grants to the States under section 96 of the Constitution; and (e) new policies not authorised by special legislation. This undertaking followed Mr Holt's separate discussions with a Committee of Government Senators and representative Members of the House of Representatives in May 1965 in order to reach agreement on how to proceed on the recom " mendations of a Committee appointed by Government Senators on 'Appropria " tions Bills and the Ordinary Annual Services of the Government'.

The undertaking (e) above in relation to new policies was in fact a precis of recommendation ( 8) contained in that Committee's Report on 28 October 1964: ( 8) New policies: As far as possible , the first provision for new policies which

have not been authorised by special legislation , and for which the only Parliamentary authorisation proposed is an annual Appropriation Act, should be included in a Bill for other than the ordinary annual services of the Government. The underlining has been added because it highlights the crux of the issue which distinguishes the provisions to which your Committee took exception, from other provisions for new policy included for the first time in Document B. It seems

to me that the proposed expenditure s questioned by members of Committee C conform in that the Social Welfare Commission Bill 1973 is now before the

77

Senate and I understand that the Minister for Social Security intends to introduce the Health Insurance Commission Bill 1973 during the current sittings . Moreover, the practice followed this year is consistent with that adopted in the past, e.g., the provision for the Australian Commission on Advanced Educa " tion, Division 237, Appropriation Act (No. 1) 1971-72 (the enabling legislation was assented to on 9 December 1971) and the provision for the administrative expenses of the Anglo-Australian Telescope Board, Division 234, Appropriation Act (No. 1) 1970-71 (the enabling legislation, was assented to on 4 November

1970). I trust that the above explanation is satisfactory to the Committee.

Senator J. A. Mulvihill, Chairman, Senate Estimates Committee C, Parliament House, CANBERRA, A.C.T. 2600

78

Yours sincerely, FRANK CREAN

STATEMENT FOR SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE 'C'

During the Committee's hearing on 11 October 1973, a request was made for information concerning the number of people who have written concerning the administration of health insurance . and the amount of overtime devoted by the Department of Social Security to answering these letters.

During the previous hearings an undertaking was given to refer the matter to the Minister for Social Security who has provided the following statement: There is a large number of letters received from contributors to health insurance organisations in relation to the voluntary health insurance scheme, and others

from persons commenting on the Government's proposed universal health insurance plan. As an indication of the numbers of letters being received -during the fortnight ended 12 October, 642 ministerial representations alone were made regarding various matters relating to both schemes. Senators requested details of the amount of overtime worked in answering these letters.

A proportion of these represent requests for information or complaints relating to the present voluntary health insurance scheme, for example, from contributors to health insurance organisations claiming unsatisfactory benefit payments. Other letters are by way of support or opposition to the Government's

proposed universal health insurance plan. It is certainly true that a significant proportion of letters received by me after the publication of the Health Insurance Planning Committee's report w ere from persons who were opposed to the recommendations. In many instances , however, their opposition stemmed from incomplete understanding of the pro "

posals. For example, letters were received expressing opposition to the removal of the patient's right to choose his own doctor. Replies were sent to these people explaining that there was no proposal by the Health Insurance Planning Committee or by the Government to remove a patient's right to choose his

doctor. The preparation of replies to these representations and other routine corres " pondence associated with the work of the responsible Division are included in the day to day duties of officers concerned with correspondence. The volume of correspondence necessitates overtime being worked by these officers . Letters

are replied to in order of priority and no attempt is made to categorise them into the areas in relation to which information has been requested. It would be appreciated therefore that it wou ld not be practicable to determine whether the reply to a particular letter is prepared during normal office hours or on an overtime basis.

To analyse the letters into categories relating to the present scheme, or support for or opposition to the proposed universal health insurance plan, would be a lengthy task for a body of officers which is already working under considerable pressure, and 1 have not felt that it would be of much value. It would certainly necessitate officers working considerable overtime in addition

to the overtime which is necessary for other reasons.

79

DEPARTMENT OF IMMIGRATION

Canberra, A. C. T. 2600

The Chairman, Senate Estimates Committee 'C'

D ivision 300-4-02

Embarkation and Passage Costs - Special Passage Assistance Programme (S.P.A.P.)

In answer to Senator Townley's question on 6 November 1973, hereunder are details of arrivals under D ivision 300-4-02 for 1972-73 compared with the programme for each country or group of countries for 1973-74:

Arrivals 1972-73

Argentine 1,131

Uruguay 509

Brazil . 195

Chile 375

Peru (includes Ecuador and Colombia) 171 O ther South America 172

Belgium 74

D enmark 288

France 1,317

Germany 532

Ireland 964

Italy 67

Portugal 501

Scandinavia (Finland, Norway, Sweden) . 1,018 Switzerland 352

United Kingdom 553

United States 1,454

South Africa 428

Other Africa 163

Middle East (Lebanon, Cyprus, Israel, Egypt) Asia Yugoslavs ex Austria *

Other 185

Total 10,449t

* Yugoslav migrants ex Austria were moved under Division 300-4-03 in 1972-73. t 9,490 paid for in 1972-73.

D epartment of Immigration

13 November 1973

80

Programme 1973-74 1,600 1,800

300

600 800 200

100 600 2,000 700

900 60

500 1,050 500

600 3,000 500

200 2,000 1,000 2,300

290

21,600

Estimates Committee C

Minutes of Proceedings

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMIT fEE C

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.4

THU R SD AY, 11 OCf O BE R 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 11.30 a.m. The Chairman (Senator Mul " vihill) took the Chair.

2. STATEMENT BY CHAIRMAN: The Chairman made a statement regretting the absence, through illness, of the Minister for the Media, Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland and welcomed the Minister for Primary Industry, Senator the Hon. K. S. Wriedt. The Chairman also made a statement relating to the

procedure to be followed by the Committee in its examination of the Par " ticulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the year ending 30 June 1974 and stated that, pursuant to the Order of the Senate of 13 September 1973, the Committee wou ld consider the following departmental estimates:

Document''' Page

Division

Department Amount

No.

$

A 63-66 330-342 Media 90,040,000

B 13-14 885 Media 12,887,000

A 108-110 530-532 Social Security 86,084,000

B 19-20 945-948 Social Security 17,152,000

A 30--36 200-214 Education 145,351,000

B 9 845-848 Education 52,932,000

A 152 775 Vocational Training-University Courses 659,000

A 118-119 535-558 Tourism and Recreation 4,758,000

B 20-21 958-959 Tourism and Recreation 7,520,000

A 56-59 300-304 Immigration 63,079,000

B 13 875-878 Immigration I ,021,000

A 80-81 400-406 Postmaster-General's 18,170,000

B 16 910-914 Postmaster-Genera l's 325,860,000

A 49-53 270-279 Health 65,797,000

B 11-12 865-869 Health 32,156,000

* Document A - 'Partic ulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the year ending on 30 June 1974'. * Document B - 'Particulars of Certain Proposed Expenditure in respect of the year ending on 30 June 1974'.

Ordered - That consideration of estimates for the Departments of Media and Tourism and Recreation and of the Postmaster-General's Department be postponed until the next day of sitting .

83

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF SOCIAL SECURITY:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. K. S. Wriedt, Minister for Primary Industry, accompanied by the following officers: Mr K. T. Kimball, Acting First Assistant Director-General (Management) Mr J. W. A. Waugh, Acting Assistant Director-General (Establishments and

Finance) Mr R. T. Coffey, Acting Director (Establishments) Mr D. A. Harragan, Assistant Director-General (Automatic Data Processing) Mr A. K.. Henderson, Acting Chief Statistical Officer Mr J. B. Lleonart, Acting Assistant Director-General (Secretariat and

Information) Mr D. Corrigan, First Assistant Director-General (Hospitals Insurance and Nursing) Mr V. E. Pickering, Acting Assistant Director-General (Health Insurance

Development and Review) Mr R. C. Kaiser, Acting Assistant Director-General (Rehabilitation Services) Mr J. de Berigny Wall, Acting Assistant Director-General (Community and

Professional Services) Mr J. A. Lucas, Director (Aged Persons Welfare) Mr K. W. Kelly, Assistant Director-General (Planning and Research) Mr F. J. Roberts, Acting Director (Policy) Mr K. Mead, Acting Director (Finance) Mr J. L. Gibson, Secretary (Commonwealth Commission of Enquiry into

Poverty) Mr B. F. Luby, Acting Director (Social Welfare Commission) Mr J. F. Brewer, Acting Director (Special Projects, assisting Interim Executive Australian Health Insurance Commission) Mr P. J. Doolan, Acting Senior Inspector (Special Projects, assisting Interim

Executive Australian Health Insurance Commission)

Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 530-532 - Department of Social Security (Document A) Divisions 945-948 - Department of Social Security (Document B). The Committee considered Division 530-Administrative . And the Committee considering Division 532 - National Commission on Social Welfare -

Short Adjournment

Consideration of Division 532 - National Commission on Social Welfare resumed. Ordered-That consideration of the remaining Divisions relating to the Depart " ment of Social Securit y be postponed until information relating to the

National Health Insurance Plan and the inclusion of proposed expenditure for certain new policy items in Document A be received, and that, if necessary, on resumption, reference may be made to the Divisions previously considered by the Committee.

84

4. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF EDUCATION:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. K. S. Wriedt, Minister for Primary Industry, accompanied by the following officers: Mr D . M . Morrison, First Assistant Secretary, Policy Mr J. B. Machin, Assistant Secretary, Pre-School and Child Care Branch

Mr J. W. Mather, Acting Assistant Secretary, Special Programs Branch Mr J. C. Cobb, Acting Assistant Secretary, Facilities Branch Mr D. W. Hood, Assistant Secretary, Territorial Liaison Branch Mr R. M. Cox, Executive Officer, Schools Commission Branch Mr P. C. Maher, Acting Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch Mrs J. K. Hadzi-Popovic, Executive Assistant, Territorial and Facilities

Division Mr N. R. Edwards, Acting Assistant Secretary, Territorial Planning and Building Branch Mr J. D. Gallacher, Acting Assistant Secretary, Special Projects Branch, N.T. Mr C. L. Beltz, Acting Assistant Secretary, Education Research Branch Mr R. M. Gillett, Operations Officer, Australian Universities Commission Mr L. P. Fricker, Secretary, Australian Commission on Advanced Education Mr W. F. Koller, Head, Project Management Section, Australian Commission

on Advanced Education Treasury Official : Mr A M. Finch. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 200-214 - Department of Education (Document A) Divisions 845-848 - Department of Education (Document B) Division 775-Vocational Training-University Courses (Document A). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of Education.

5. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF IMMIGRATION: Appearing: Senator the Hon . K. S. Wriedt, Minister for Primary Industry, accompanied by the following officers: Mr S. J. Dempsey, First Assistant Secretary, Planning, Programme and

Review Division Mr A . L. Barclay, Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch Mr J. Moylan, Director, Establishments Section, Management Services Branch Mr T . T. McElroy, Director , Finance and General Services Section, Manage "

ment Services Branch Mr K. J. Goodall, Acting Director, Systems Development Section, Manage " ment Services Branch Mr A. W . Burt, Finance Officer, Management Services Branch

Mr R. U . Metcalfe, Assistant Secretary , Programme Control and Develop " ment Branch Mr H . G . Brooks, Chief Migration Officer, Programme Control and Develop-ment Branch Mr E. L. Charles, As sistant Secretary , Citizenship Development Branch Mr K. E. Kern, Acting A ssistant Secretary, Settlement Services Branch Mr W . E . Law , Director, Migrant Accommodation Section

85

Mr C. Stanilewicz, Statistical Officer, Planning and Research Branch Mr B. Freedman, Director, Information Branch Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 300-304 - Department of Immigration (Document A) Divisions 875-878 - Department of Immigration (Document B). The Committee considered the following Sub-Divisions: Division 300 - Administrative (Document A)

Sub-Division 1-Salaries and Payments in the Nature of Salary Sub-Division 2-Administrative Expenses Sub-Division 3 - Other Services. Further consideration of Sub-Division 4 - Embarkation and Passage Costs - adjourned till the next day of sitting.

6. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 5.45 p.m. till a date to be fixed.

7. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Carrick, Laucke, Lawrie, McAuliffe, Mulvihill, Townley and Wilkinson (7). Senator Sir Kenneth Anderson also took part in the Committee's pro " ceedings.

86

J. A. MULVIHILL Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE C

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.5

MONDAY, 22 OCTOBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 2.00 p.m. The Chairman (Senator Mul " vihill) took the Chair.

2. STATEMENT BY CHAIRMAN : The Chairman made a statement welcom " ing the Minister for the Media, Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland and indicating the order in which it wa s proposed to examine departmental estimates. ∑

Ordered - That the Committee proceed to examine departmental estimates in the following order: Department of the Media Postmaster-General's D epartment

Department of Tourism and Recreation Department of Immigration Department of Health Department of Social Security.

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 -DEPART " MENT OF THE MEDIA:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland, Minister for the Media, accompanied by the following officer s: Mr J. H . Oswin, Secretary Mr R. Lord, First A ssistant Secretary , Film, TV and Radio

Mr L. Macdonald, Assistant Secretary, Planning and Finance Mr N. Monshall, Ministerial Liaison Officer Mr D . E. Brown, Producer-in-Chief, Film Au stralia MrS. M. Jay, Executive Officer, Film Australia Mr N. Malaxos, Administrati ve Officer, Film Au stralia Mrs N. Hollow, A ssistant Executive Officer, Au stralian Film D evelopment

Corporation Mr R. Howard , Accountant, Australian Film D evelopment Corporation Mr P. A. Dorrian, A ssistant G eneral Man ager, Administration, Au stralian Broadcasting Commi ssion Mr R . G . Gifford, Assistant Controller M anagem ent Services (Finance),

Australian Broadcastin g Commi ssion Mr D. Miley, Federal Director, Radio Programm es, Au stralian Broadcasting Commission

87

Mr C. Dean, Assistant Federal Director, Television Programmes, Australian Broadcasting Commission Mr B. J. Connolly, Secretary, Australian Broadcasting Control Board Mr J. R. Cowen, Assistant Secretary, Australian Broadcasting Control

Board Mr. P. A. Nott, First Assistant Secretary, Australian Information Service Mr N. M. B oyle, Assistant Controller, Australian Information Service Mr T. Woodcock, Finance Officer, Australian Information Service Mr I. Hamilton, Director, Australian Information Service Mr L. J. Hickey, Executive Officer , Australian Information Service

Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 330-342 - Department of the Media (Document A) Division 885 - Department of the Media (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of the Media.

4. DELIBERATIVE MEETING: For the purpose of considering a letter from the Treasurer relati ng to the estimates for the Department of Social Security and documents from that Department, the Committee went into deliberative session. Discussion ensued. Ordered - That consideration of the letter and documents be postponed till the next day of sitting:

5. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - POST "

MASTER-GENERAL'S DEPARTMENT: Appearing: Senator the Hon. Douglas McCl elland, Minister for the Media, accompanied by the following officers : Mr J. R. Smith (Co-ordinator of Group) Senior Assistant Director-General

(Finance Accounting), Management Services Division Mr D. M. Coleman, First Assistant Director-General , Telecommunications Division Mr J. E. Freeman, Senior Assistant Director-General (Works Program Co "

ordination), Engineering Works Division Mr. E. A. Ditchfield , Deputy Assistant Director-General (Commercial), Postal Services Division Mr L. D . Sebire, Senior Supervising Engineer (Sound and Vision Broad "

casting), Engineering Works Division Mr G. P. Hudson, Deputy Assistant D irector -General (Financial Planning and Management Accounting), Managem ent Services Division Mr A. B. French, Chief Finance Officer (Financial and Management

Accounting), Mana gement Services Division Mr J. J. Murphy, Controller-Special Investigatio ns (Industrial Relations), Director-General's Office. Treasury O fficia l: Mr A.M. Finch. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 400-406 - Postmaster-General 's Department (Document A) Divisions 910-914 - Postmaster-General's D epartment (Document B).

88

The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Postmaster-General 's Department.

6. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.00 p.m. till a date to be fixed.

7. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cant, Carrick, Laucke, Lawrie, Mulvihill and Wilkinson ( 6). Senator Milliner also took part in the Committee's proceedings .

89

J. A. MULVIHILL

Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE C

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.6

TUESDAY, 6 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 8.30 p.m. The Chairman (Senator Mul " vihill) took the Chair.

2. STATEMENT BY CHAIRMAN: The Chairman made a statement relating to the procedure to be followed by the Committee.

3. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74-DEPART " MENT OF TOURISM AND RECREATION:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland, Minister for the Media, accompanied by the following officers: Mr N. N. Ellis, First Assistant Secretary, Recreation Division Mr L. G. Stroud, Assistant Secretary, Tourism Projects and Operations

Branch Mr W. Done, Assistant Director, Finance Management Services Branch, Department of Overseas Trade Mr N.C. K. Evers, Deputy General Manager, Australian Tourist Commission Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 555-558 -Department of Tourism and Recreation (Document A) Divisions 958-959-Department of Tourism and Recreation (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Tourism and Recreation .

4. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF IMMIGRATION: Appearing: Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland, Minister for the Media, accompanied by the following officers: Mr S. J. Dempsey, First Assistant Secretary, Planning, Program and Review

Division Mr A . L. Barclay, Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch Mr J. Moylan, Director , Establishments Section, Management Services Branch Mr A. W. Burt, Finance Officer, Management Services Branch Mr R. U. Metcalfe, Assistant Secretary , Program Control and Development

Branch

90

Mr E. L. Charles, Assistant Secretary, Citizenship Development Branch Mr W. E. Law, Director, Migrant Accommodation Section Mr C. Stanilewicz, Statistical Officer, Planning and Research Branch Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch. The Committee resumed consideration of Division 300 - Department of Immigration (Document A) Sub-Division 4 - Embarkation and Passage Costs. Further consideration of Sub-Division 4 adjourned till the next day of sitting.

5. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.31 p.m. till a date to be fixed.

6. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cant, Carrick, Laucke, Lawrie, McAuliffe, Mulvihill, Townley and Wilkinson ( 8).

91

J. A. MULVIHILL Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE C

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.7

TUESDAY, 13 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met in deliberative session at 8.00 p.m. The Chairman (Senator Mulvihill) took the Chair.

2. MINUTES: The Minutes of the meetings held on 11 and 22 October and 6 November were read and confirmed.

3. DRAFT DEPORT : The Committee discussed matters which may be included in the Report. On the motion of Senator Laucke, it was agreed that the question of the interpretation of the 1965 compact relating to the Ordinary Annual Services

of the Government should be included in the Report and that the Com " mittee recommend its reference to the Standing Committee on Constitutional and Legal Affairs.

4. RESUMPTION OF PUBLIC HEARINGS: The Committee resumed its pub " lic hearings, and the Chairman made a statement of the particulars of pro " posed expenditure remaining to be considered by the Committee.

5. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF IMMIGRATION: Appearing: Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland, Minister for the Media, accompanied by the following officers: Mr S. J. Dempsey , First Assistant Secretary, Planning, Programme and

Review Division Mr J. Moylan, Director, Establishments Section, Management Services Branch Mr T. T. McElroy, Director , Finance and General Services Section, Manage-

ment Services Branch Mr A W. Burt, Finance Officer, Management Services Branch Mr E. L. Charles, Assistant Secretary , Citizenship Development Branch Mr W. E. Law , Director, Migrant Accommodation Section Mr C. Stanilewic z, Statistical Officer, Planning and Research Branch Treasury Official: Mr A. M . Finch. The Committee resumed consideration of the particulars of proposed expendi " ture for the Department of Imm igration and considered the following: Division 200 - Administrative (Document A)

Sub-Division 4 - Embarkation and Passage Costs

92

Sub-Division 5 - Migrant Education Services Division 304 - Overseas Service (Document A) Divisions 875-878 - Department of Immigration (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of Immigration.

6. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74-DEPART " MENT OF SOCIAL SECURITY:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland, Minister for the Media, accompanied by the following officers : Mr K. T. Kimball, Acting First Assistant Director-General (Management) Mr J. W. A. Waugh, Acting Director (Finance)

Mr C. Calvert, Acting Assistant Director-General (Establishments and Finance) Mr R. T. Coffey, Acting Director (Personnel and Services) Mr D. A. Harragan, Assistant Director -General (Automatic Data Pro "

cessing) Mr A. J. Whittington, Acting Chief Statistical Officer Mr J. B. Lleonart, Acting Assistant Director-General (Secretariat and Information) Mr R. B. Rofe, Assistant Director-General (Nursing Homes B enefits) Mr V. E. Pickering, Acting Assistant Director-General (Health Insurance

Development and Review) Mr R. C. Kaiser, Acting Assistant Director-General (Rehabilitation Services) Mr J. de Berigny Wall, Acting Assistant Director-General (Community and Professional Services) Mr J. A. Lucas, Director (Aged Persons Welfare) Mr K. W. Kelly, Assistant D irector-General (Planning and Research)

Mr F. J. Roberts, Acting Director (Policy) Mr B. F. Luby, Acting Director (Social Welfare Commission) Mr B. Strutt, Acting Senior Inspector (Special Projects, assisting Interim Executive, Australian Health Insurance Commission) Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch. The Committee resumed consideration of the particulars of proposed expendi " ture for the Department of Social Security and considered the following: Division 532 - National Commission on Social Welfare (Docum ent A) D ivisions 945-948 - Department of Social Security (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the

Department of Social Security.

7. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 -DEPART " MENT OF HEALTH:

Appearing: Senator the Hon . Douglas McClelland, Minister for the Media, accompanied by the following officer s: Dr A. D. Spears, Deputy Director-General Mr M. Carroll , First Assistant Director-General , Policy Planning and Co "

ordination Branch. Mr R . W. Gee, First A ssistan t Director-General, Quarantine Division Mr R. E. M. Wilson, Assistant Director-G eneral, Pharmaceutical Benefits Branch

93

Mr L. M. Carr, Assistant Director-General, Dental Health Branch Dr A S. Cumming- Thorn, Assistant Director-General, Environmental Health Branch Dr J. S. Richardson, Medical Officer, Aboriginal Health Branch Mr R. G. Walton, Director, Finance Section Mr P. R. Griffin, Chief Accountant, Finance Section Mr B. V. McKay, Assistant Director, Planning and Executive Services

Branch, AC.T. Health Services Mr H. C. Harrison, Senior Assistant Director, Management Services, North-ern Territory Health Services Treasury Official: Mr A M. Finch. Senator McClelland made a statement to the Committee on Estimates for the Department of Health 1973-74. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 270-279 - Department of Health (Document A) Divisions 865-869 - Department of Health (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Health.

8. REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE: The Chairman presented a Draft Report for the Committee's consideration. The Draft Report was agreed to, with amendment.

9. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.17 p.m.

10. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cant, Carrick, Laucke, Lawrie, McAuliffe, Mulvihill and Wilkinson ( 7 ) . Senators Davidson and Young also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

94

J. A MULVIHILL Chairman

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE D

REPORT TO THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE D

REPORT TO THE SENATE

Estimates Committee D has the honour to present its Report to the Senate.

1. On 13 September 1973 the Senate referred to the Committee the Par " ticulars of Proposed Expenditure for the year 1973-74 relating to the following Departments: Repatriation

Defence Navy Army Air

Supply Labour

2. The Committee has considered these Estimates and has received explana " tions of them from the Minister for Primary Industry (Senator W riedt) , the Minister for the Media (Senator Douglas McClelland) and departmental officers. The Committee places on record its appreciation of the assistance given by the Ministers in the absence through ill-health of the Minister for Repatriation

(Senator Bishop). The Ministers were accompanied at the Committee hearings by some 28 officers representing the Departments concerned, and the Committee records its appreciation of the assistance given to the Committee by those officers.

3. Subsequent to the hearing of evidence and in accordance with the under " taking given during the hearings, further information was forwarded to the Com " mittee in reply to a specific question raised during the proceedings . A copy of the document containing this further information is included as an appendix to this Report.

4. The Minutes of the Committee's Proceedings is tabled with this Report for the information of honourable Senators, together with the Hansard reports of the Committee's hearings.

14 November 1973

97

D. N. CAMERON Chairman

Estimates Committee D

Appendix

∑ .

Chairman, Senate Estimates Committee D, Parliament House, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

Dear Sir,

DEPARTMENT OF SUPPLY

12 November 1973

During the consideration of this Department's 1973-7 4 Estimates by Senate Estimates Committee Don 15 October 1973, Senator Byrne asked for an explana " tion concerning the comment provided in the explanatory notes for Division 773, Buildings, Works, Fittings and Furnitur e that 'The under-expenditure is spread over Victoria, N.S.W. and South Australia and is considered to be within normal variable limits of Department of Works operations under this vote'. (In 1972-73 expenditure of $4,800,613 was incurred against an appropriation of $5,300,000).

As the comment was attributed in evidence to the Department of Works, it was agreed that a further explanation should be obtained. Department of Works have now advised that, in providing this comment, they were under the impression that we were seeking an explanation for the under " expenditure against their revised estimate of $4,900,000 provided in May 1973.

Department of Works have now advised that the under-expenditure of $499,387 against the appropriation was due mainly to a request from this Department to reduce the cost of the new RDX facility at Albion Explosives Factory. The result " ing administrative action delayed the calling of tenders which, when received, proved to be unacceptable and had to be re-invited.

The result of these delays was that, by the time the contract was let, little expenditure could be achieved in the financial year. Expenditure of $1,000 only was achieved by 30 June 1973 against an original budgeted expenditure of $350,000.

101

Yours faithfully,

D . J. O 'CONNOR Deputy Secretary Management and Supply

Estimates Committee D

Minutes of Proceedings

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE D

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.2

MONDAY, 15 OCTOBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 3 p.m. The Chairman (Senator Cameron) took the Chair.

2. MEMBERSHIP O F THE C OMMITTEE: The entry in the Journals of the Senate of 13 September 1973, recording that Senator Dame Nancy Buttfield had been appointed a memb er of the Committee in place of Senator Sir Kenneth Anderson, discharged, wa s reported.

3. STATEMENT BY CHAIRMAN: The Chairman mad e a statement relating to the procedure to be followed by the Committee in its examination of the Particulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the year ending 30 June 197 4, and stated that, pursuant to Order of the Senate of 13 September

1973, the Committee would consider the following departmental estimates :

Document* Page

Division

D epartment Amount No.

$

A 92-94 460-466 Repatriation 507,387,000

B 17 925 Repatriation 2,304,000

A 138-140 620-639 D efence 36,837,000

A 141-143 645-675 Navy 319,933,000

A 144-146 680-704 Army 460,239,000

A 147-148 705-732 A ir 3 52,284,000

A 149-151 735-774 Supply 129,457,000

A 60-62 310-312 Labour 35,726,000

B 13 882-883 Labour 462,000

A 152 781 Post Discharge Resettlement Training . 8,000

A 152 782 Vocational Training-Technical Training 2,210,000

'' D ocument A - 'Particul ars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the year ending on 30 June 1974'. ''' Document B - 'Particulars of Ce rtain Proposed Expenditur e in respect of the year ending on 30 June 1974'.

The Chairman further stated that, in the absence through illness of the Minister for Repatriation (Senator Bishop) the Minister for Primary Industry (Senator Wriedt) would represent the departments being examined by the Committee during its first meeting.

105

4. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74-REPA1RIA " TION DEPARTMENT: Appearing: Senator the Honourable K. S. Wriedt (Minister for Primary Industry and Minister representing the Minister for Repatriation), accompanied

by the following officers: Mr R. G. Kelly, Secretary, Repatriation Commission and First Assistant Commissioner (Management Services) Dr J. H . Hurt, Chief Director (Medical Services) Mr G. R. Cadd, First Assistant Commissioner (Benefits and Legislation) Mr M. Garland, Director (Institutions) Mr G. Woodward , Director (Finance) Treasury Official: Mr A. M . Finch. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration : Divisions 460-466 - Repatriation Department (Document A) Division 925 - Repatriation Department (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Repatriation Department.

5. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF DEFENCE: Appearing: Senator the Honourable K. S. Wriedt (Minister for Primary Industry and Minister representing the Minister for Defence), accompanied by the following officers:

Mr C. A Nettle, First Assistant Secretary, Programme Management and Defence Facilities Mr M. N. Woolley, Assistant Secretary , Programme Management Mr R. A Jenkins, Director, Finance Property and General Services, Manage "

ment Services Mr M. W. Smithies, Assistant Secretary, Defence Planning Brigadier R. K. Roseblade, Director of Recruiting. Treasury Official: Mr A. M . Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 620-639 -Department of Defence (Document A) The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of Defence.

6. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 -DEPART " MENT OF THE NAVY:

Appearing: Senator the Honourable K. S. Wriedt (Minister for Primary Industry and Minister representing the Minister for the Navy), accompanied by the following officer s: Department of Defence:

Mr C. A. Nettle, First Assistant Secretar y, Programme Management and Defence Facilities D epartment of theN avy: Mr M. T. Hyland, First Assistant Secretary, Finance and Material

Mr T. Sullivan, Assistant Secretary , Finance. Mr B. McDevitt, A ssistant Director, Supply Administration Mr G. Nichols, Principal Executive Officer, Naval Technical Services

106

Mr C. Hill, Assistant Secretary, Civil Establishments Mr R. Martin, Head of Naval Personnel Branch Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 645-675 - Department of the Navy (Document A) The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of the Navy.

7. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF THE ARMY.

Appearing: Senator the Honourable K. S. Wriedt (Minister for Primary Industry and Minister representing the Minister for the Army); accompanied by the following officers: Department of Defence:

Mr C . A. Nettle, First Assistant Secretary, Programme Management and Defence Facilities. Department of the Army: Mr J. W. Nunn, First Assistant Secretary, Finance and Logistics

Mr K. W. Major, First Assistant Secretary, Establishments and General Mr H. Ford, Chief Finance Officer Mr G. Forbes-Ewan, Chief Executive Officer Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 680-704 -Department of the Army (Document A) The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of the Army.

8. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF AIR.

Appearing: Senator the Honourable K. S. Wriedt (Minister for Primary Industry and Minister representing the Minister for Air) accompanied by the following officers: Department of Defence:

Mr C. A. Nettle, First Assistant Secretary, Programme Management and Defence Facilities Department of Air: Mr M. J. Madden, First Assistant Secretary, Finance and Logistics Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 705-732 - Department of Air (Document A) The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of Air.

9. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 -DEPART " MENT OF SUPPLY:

Appearing: Senator the Honourable K. S. Wriedt (Minister for Primary Industry and Minister representing the Minister for Supply), accompanied by the following officers : Department of Defence:

107

Mr C. A. Nettle, First Assistant Secretary , Programme Management and Defence Facilities Mr I. M. Reid, Assistant Secretary , Defence Facilities Department of Supply:

Mr D. J. O'Connor, Deputy Secretary, Management and Supply Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 735-774 -Department of Supply (Document A) The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Supply.

10. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 9.54 p.m. till a day and hour to be fixed.

11. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senator Cameron (Chairman) and Senators Dame Nancy Buttfield, Byrne, Devitt, Georges and Marriott. Senators Lawrie and O'Byrne also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

108

D. N. CAMERON Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE D

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.3

THURSDAY, 8 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 8.30 p.m. The Chairman (Senator Cameron) took the Chair.

2. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - D EPA RT "

MENT OF LABOUR:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. Douglas McClelland (Minister for the Media and Minister representing the Minister for Labour), accompanied by the following officers: D epartment of L abour:

Mr K. C. Mc Ken zie, D eputy Secretary Mr V . J. White, Assistant Secretary, Training Mr D. H. Warner, Senior Executive Officer Mr J. T . Ryder, Finance Officer Treasury Official: Mr A . M . Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 310-312 - Department of L abour (Document A) Divisions 882-883 - Department of Labour (D ocument B )

Divisions 781-782-Department of Labour (Document A) The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the Department of Labour.

3. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 9.45 p.m.

4. ATTENDANCE: The following member s of the Committee were present: Senator Cameron (Chairman) and Senators Dam e Nancy Buttfield , Byrne, Georges and Marriott. Senator O 'Byrne also took part in the Committee's proceedings.

lOY

D . N. CAMERON Chairman

ESTIMATES COMMITIEE E

REPORT TO THE SENAT 'E

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE E

REPORT TO THE SENATE

Estimates Committee E has the honour to present its Report to the Senate.

2. On 13 September 1973 the Senate referred to the Committee the Par " ticulars of Proposed Expenditure for the Service of the Year Ending 30 June 1974, and the Particulars of Certain Proposed Expenditure in respect of the Year Ending 30 June 197 4, relating to the following Departments:

Department of Wo rks Department of Urban and Regional Development Department of Transport Department of Civil Aviation Department of Aboriginal Affairs

Department of Housing Department of the Environment and Conservation

3. The Committee has considered these estimates of expenditure and has received explanations of them from the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and officers of the Departments concerned. The Committee records its appreciation of the explanations of the estimates contained in the answers given before the Committee and in the explanatory memoranda prepared by the Departments and circulated

to Senators prior to the sittings of the Committee.

4. The Minutes of Proceedings of the Committee are included in this Report and the Hansard report of the evidence given before the Committee is presented herewith for the information of the Senate.

5. The Committee was not able to conclude its consideration of the estimates of expenditure for the Department of Aboriginal Affairs because of the great number of questions which Senators wished to ask on Document A, Division 112, sub-division 3, line 01, an amount of $70,050,000 for payment to the Aboriginal Advancement Trust Account. This included an item of $700,000 for support of turtle and crocodile farms, which were the subject of Senators' interest. Without expressing any opinion on these projects , the Committee recommend s that this item be subject to continuing scrutiny.

6. The particular s of proposed expenditure not considered by the Committee are: in Document A , Division 112, the remainder of sub-division 3, and Division 114; and in Document B, Division 805.

13 Nov ember 1973

113

R. E. McAULIFF E

Chairman

Estimates Committee E

Minutes of Proceedings

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE E

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.2

MONDAY 15 OCTOBER 1973

1. MEETING OF THE COMMITTEE: The Committee met at 2 p.m. in Senate Committee Room No. 1 The Chairman (Senator McAuliffe) took the Chair.

2 ESTIMATES OF EXPEN DITURE : The Chairman made a statement relating to the order of consideration of the particulars of proposed expenditure to be considered pursuant to the order of the Senate, viz:

Document* Page

Division

Department Amount No.

$

A 132-137 610-614 W orks 104,801,000

B 24-26 975 Works 106,211,500

A 130-132 600-606 Urban and Regional Development 10,800,000

B 24 971-972 U rban and Regional D evelopment 104,000,000

A 120-123 565-575 Transport 131 '172,000

B 21-22 960-964 Transport 30,830,000

A 25-27 170-172 Civil Aviation 115,643,000

B 8 820 Civil Aviation 10,000,000

A 10-12 112-114 Aboriginal Affairs 89,326,000

B 6 805 Aboriginal Affairs 1,489,000

A 54-55 285-289 Hou sing 9,149,000

B 12 870 Hou sing I 02,540,000

A 152 777 Commonwealth Hostels Limited-Build-

ing Work s and Equipment- Exmouth Guest Hou se 61,000

A 37-38 230 Environment and Conservation I ,729,000

B tO 850-852 Environm ent and Conservation 1,431,300

'' Document A - 'Particul ars of Proposed E xpenditure for the Service of the year ending on 30 June 1974'. Document B - 'Particulars of Certain Proposed Expenditure in respect of the year ending∑ on 30 June 1974'.

3. Department of Works Appearing: Senator the Ron. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by Mr A. J. Stevenson, Acting Deputy Director-General, Mr A. W. Miles, Acting Deputy Assistant Director-General (Works),

and Mr W. D. Hamilton, Acting Deputy Assistant Director-Gener al (Finance), Department of Works , and Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch, De " partment of the Treasury.

1 17

The following particulars of proposed expenditure were called upon by the Chairman and considered: Document A Division 610-Administrative

Division 612-Furniture and Fittings Division 614-Repairs and Maintenance Document B Division 975-Capital Works and Services Consideration concluded.

4. DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORT:

$

59,689,000 7,370,000 37,742,000

106,211,500

Appearing: Senat.or the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by Mr G. Unkles, First Assistant Secretary, Coastal Services Division, Mr S. Smith, Assistant Secretary, Sea Transport Policy Division, Mr R. Barling, Assistant Secretary, Road Transport, Mr N. Matthews, Assistant Secretary, Rail Transport, Mr T. Williams, First Assistant Secretary, Marine Standards Division, MrS. Clarke, First Assistant Secretary, Shipbuilding Division, Mr K. Murton, Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch and Mr E. Ballard, Controller, Finance, Department of Transport; Mr T. Velten, Controller (Management Accounting Division), Australian

Coastal Shipping Commission, Mr R. McCormack, Secretary, Bureau of Roads, Mr B. Hogan, Assistant Secretary, Commonwealth Railways, Mr S. Bolam, Budget Officer, Commonwealth Railways, and Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch,

Department of the Treasury. The following particulars of proposed expenditure were called upon by the Chairman and considered: Document A

Division 565 - Administrative Division 567-Commonwealth Bureau of Roads Division 569-Shipbuilding Division Division 575-Commonwealth Railways Document B

Division 960-Capital Works and Services Division 963 -Payments to or for the States Division 964 - Other Services Consideration concluded.

5. DEPARTMENT OF CIVIL AVIATION

$

15,806,000 1,000,000 85,387,000 28,979,000

23,883,000 5,947,000 1,000,000

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by Mr G. R. Woodward, Assistant Director-General (Finance), Mr R. B. Wiggins, Acting Director (Financial Studies and Assistance), and

Mr G. T. O'Halloran, Finance Officer (Budget), Department of Civil Aviation, and Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch, Department of the Treasury. The following particulars of proposed expenditure were called upon by the Chairman and considered:

118

Document A Division 170 -Administrative and Operational Division 172-Development of Civil Aviation Document B

Division 820-Capital Works and Services Consideration concluded.

$

110,574,000 5,069,000

10,000,000

6. DEPARTMENT OF URBAN AND REGIONAL DEVELOPMENT

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by Mr R. B. Lansdown, Secretary, Mr L. R. Killeen, First Assistant Secretary, Management Division,

Mr G. R. Andrew, Acting Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch, Mr P. N. Troy, First Assistant Secretary, Land Commissions and Projects, Mr G. F. Craig, First Assistant Secretary, Development Projects and Task

Forces, Mr B. P. Sheedy, Director, National Urban Development Strategy Division, Mr M. E. Eyers, Project Officer, Land Commissions and Projects, Depart-ment of Urban and Regional Development;

Mr C. G. Willcox, Acting General Manager, Mr D. W. Hain, First Assistant Commissioner, Professional Division, and Mr R. Wilson, Executive Officer, Management Division, Cities Commission; Mr G. C. Shannon, Acting Associate Commissioner, Mr K. A. Myers, Acting Secretary and Manager, Mr K. J. Curtis, Acting Senior Assistant Secretary, Administration, National

Capital Development Commission, Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch, De-partment of the Treasury. The following particulars of proposed expenditure were called upon by the

Chairman and considered: Document A Division 600 - Administrative Division 604 -National Capital Development Commission

Division 606 - Cities Commission Document B Division 971-Capital Works and Services Division 972 - Payments to or for the States

Consideration concluded.

7. DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING

$

2,293,000 4,000,000 4,507,000

93,500,000 10,500,000

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by Mr K. D. A. Medbury, Acting Secretary, Mr A. J. Selleck, First Assistant Secretary, Operations,

Dr R. Mendelsohn, First Assistant Secretary, Policy and Research, Mr J. B. Elliott, Acting Assistant Secretary, Management Services, Depart " ment of Housing, Mr S. G . Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch, De "

partment of the Treasury.

119

The following particulars of proposed expenditure were called upon by the Chairman and considered: Document A Division 285-Administrative

Division 289 - Commonwealth Hostels Limited Division 777 - Commonwealth Hostels Limited -Building, Works and Equipment Document B

Division 870-Capital Works and Services Consideration concluded.

$

9,126,000 23,000

61,000

102,540,000

8. DEPARTMENT OF THE ENVIRONMENT AND CONSERVATION

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by Mr A. I. McCutchan, First Assistant Secretary, Water and Soil Resources Division,

Mr A. J. Ayers, Acting First Assistant Secretary, Environmental Protection Division, Mr K. Hocking, Director, Establishments and Finance Branch, Mr B. Wisener, Finance Officer, Department of the Environment and Con "

servation, Mr S. G. Herring, Assistant Secretary, Accounting Operations Branch, De " partment of the Treasury. The following particulars of proposed expenditure were called upon by the

Chairman and considered: Document A Division 230 - Administrative Document B

Division 850-Capital Works and Services Division 852 - Other Services Consideration concluded.

9. Adjournment The Committee adjourned at 10.10 p.m.

10. Attendance

$

1,729,000

772,500 658,800

The . following members of the Committee attended the meeting: Senator McAuliffe (in the Chair), Senators Bonner, Davidson, Jessop, Keeffe, Little, McLaren, and Poyser. Senators Laucke, Wright and Young also attended.

120

R. E. McAULIFFE Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE E

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.3

THURSDAY, 8 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 8.30 p.m. in Senate Committee Room No. 1. The Chairman (Senator McAuliffe) took the chair.

2. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART " MENT OF ABORIGINAL AFFAIRS:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers:

DEPARTMENT OF ABORIGINAL AFFAIRS

Mr B. G. Dexter, Secretary Mr P.M. Mackenzie, Assistant Secretary, Policy Branch Mr L. A J. Malone, Assistant Secretary, Management Projects and Services Branch Mr D. J. O'Rourke, Acting Assistant Secretary, Economic Development

Branch Mr C. N. Perkins, Assistant Secretary, Liaison and Consultation Branch Mr M. Ford, Acting Assistant Director, Northern Territory Division Mr B. Powell, Acting Director, Health Services Section Mr R. Huey, Director, Social and Cultural Section Mr F. Judge, Finance Officer

Mr B. K. Thomas, Director, Economic Development Branch

INSTITUTE OF ABORIGINAL STUDIES Dr P. J. Ucko, Principal Mr R. Edwards, Deputy Principal Mr D. R. Sheppard, Executive Officer

DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY

Mr C. J. Louttit, Senior Finance Officer, Accounting and Supply Division The Committee concluded its consideration of the following particulars of proposed expenditure: Document A, Division 112, sub-divisions 1 and 2. Consideration of Document A, Division 112, sub-division 3, line 01 was

adjourned.

3. NEXT MEETING: It was agreed, Senator McLaren dissenting, that unless otherwise ordered the Committee meet again at 8.30 p.m. on Tuesday next, 13 November 1973.

121

4. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.35 p.m.

5. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Bonner, Davidson, Keeffe, Jessop, McAuliffe, McLaren and Poyser. Senators Cant, Sir Magnus Cormack, Georges, Laucke, Lawrie, Milliner, O'Byrne, Sim, Wright and Young also attended.

122

R. E. McAULIFFE Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE E

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.4

TUESDAY, 13 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 8.30 p.m. in Senate Committee Room No . 3. The Chairman (Senator McAuliffe) took the chair.

2. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF ABORIGINAL AFFAIRS:

App earing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers:

DEPARTMENT OF ABORIGINAL AFFAIRS

Mr B. G . Dexter, Secretary Mr P. M. Mackenzie, Assistant Secretary, Policy Branch Mr K. C. Martin, Acting Assistant Secretary, Community Affairs Branch

Mr D. J. O'Rourke, Acting Assistant Secretary, Economic Development Branch Mr C. N. Perkins, Assistant Secretary, Liaison and Consultation Branch Mr M . Ford, Acting Assistant Director, Northern Territory Division Mr B. Powell, Acting Director, Health Services Section Mr N . Jansz, Senior Project Officer, Communit y Affairs Branch Mr P. C. Bourke, Acting Director, C ommunity Affair s Branch Miss J. Cooper, Senior Project Officer, Community Affairs Branch Mr T . L. Jobling, Director , E stabli shments and Finance Branch Mr R. Huey, Director, Social and Cultural Section

Mr F. Judge, Finance Officer Mr B. K. Thomas , Director , Economic Development Branch

INSTITUTE OF ABORIGINAL STUDIES Dr P. J. Ucko, Principal Mr R . Edwards, Deputy Principal Mr D . R. Sheppard, Executive Officer

DEPARTMENT OF THE TREASURY

Mr C. J. Louttit , Senior Finance O fficer, Accounting and Supply D ivision. The Committee consider ed Document A , Division 112, sub-division 3, line 01. It w as agreed, the time being 10.30 p.m ., that the consideration of the estimates of expenditure for this Department be adjourned.

123

3. REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE: The Committee then met in private session. It was agreed that the Committee not proceed with further consideration of the estimates of expenditure for the Department of Aboriginal Affairs. It was agreed that the Committee report to the Senate that it was unable to complete its examination of the particulars of proposed expenditure referred to it because of its detailed examination of the item considered this day. It was further agreed that the Committee recommend that this item be subject to continuing scrutiny.

4. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.40 p.m.

5. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Bonner, Davidson, Keeffe, Jessop, Little, McAuliffe, McLaren and Poyser. Senators Georges, Laucke, O'Byrne, Wright and Young also attended.

124

R. E. McAULIFFE Chairman

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

REPORT TO THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

REPORT TO THE SENATE

Estimates Committee F has the honour to present its Report to the Senate. 1. On 13 September 1973, the Senate referred to the Committee the Par-ticulars of Proposed Expenditure for the year 1973-7 4 relating to the following: The Department of Primary Industry

The Department of Overseas Trade The Department of Secondary Industry The Department of Northern Development The Department of Minerals and Energy The Department of the Northern Territory.

2. The Committee has considered these Estimates and has received explana " tions of them from the Minister for Primary Industry, Senator the Hon. K. S. Wriedt and, during his unavoidable absence, the Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, and the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Special Minister of State, Senator the Hon. Don Willesee and officers of the Departments concerned.

3. The Committee further reports that it was unable to complete its examination of the Particulars of Certain Proposed E xpenditure in respect of the Year ending on 30 June 1974 for the Department of Minerals and Energy, Division 890, sub " division 1. - Plant and Equipment - Item 04 (purchase of pipes and associated equipment for the Moomba-Sydney pipeline) $54,000,000; sub-division 2. - (for expenditure under the Snowy Mountains Hydro-electric Power Act) $13,100,000; sub-division 3.-(for expenditure under the Atomic Energy Act) $1,388,000; sub " division 4. - (for expenditure under the Pipeline Authority Act) $107,000,000; and Division 891.-Other Services- Item 01. (Coal Exploration) $1,000,000.

4. In accordance with undertakings given by the Minister for Primary Industry juring the hearings, further information was forwarded to the Committee in reply to specific questions raised during the proceedings. Copies of the documents con " taining this further information are included as an Appendix to this Report.

5. A copy of the Minutes of Proceedings is tabled with this Report for the information of the Senate, together with the Hansard record of the evidence.

6. The Committee records its appreciat ion of the assistance given by the Ministers and officers of the several departments whose estimates the Committee considered.

14 November 1973

127

H. G. J. CANT

Chairman

Estimates Committee F

Appendix

COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA

Dear Laurie,

MINISTER FOR PRIMARY INDUSTRY Canberra, A.C.T. 2600 8 November 1973

Estimates of Department of Primary Industry

During your Committee's examination of the draft estimates for 1973-74 of my Department, the Committee sought supplementary information in respect of six items. Statements containing the requested information have been prepared and are

attached. Sufficient copies are included to enable distribution to the members of the Committee.

Senator L. D . Wilkinson, Acting Chairman, Senate Estimates Committee F Parliament House, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

K. S. WRIEDT

131

SENATE ESTIMATES COMMJTIEE F

TUESDAY 9 OCTOBER 1973

During the examination of Item 420-1-01: Department of Primary Industry " Salaries and payments in the nature of salary, Senator Durack requested informa " tion concerning the increase in the number of staff in 1973-7 4 compared with that employed in 1972-73. The following information is offered ∑ in response to that request.

Statistics relating to employment

Staff employed at 1. 7. 72 Staff employed at 1. 7. 73 Staff employed at 30.6.74 Average number of staff employed during 1972-73 Average number of staff employed during 1973-7 4

504

603* 683 537 666

(Actual) (Actual) (Estimated) (Actual)

(Estimated)

*In the explanatory notes this figure was incorrectly shown as 633 due to a typographical error.

The expected increase of 80 staff in 1973-7 4 is attributable to: ( 1 ) restructuring of the Department - 35 positions formerly costed to Appropriation Division 422 now costed to Appropriation Division 420 35

- 16 new positions created in Fisheries Division . 16 - 11 new positions created throughout other Industry Divisions 11

(2) filling of 18 positions vacant at 1 July 1973 . 18

62

80

The expected increase of 129 in the average number of staff employed in 1973-74 as against an increase of only 80 in the actual number of staff, is due to the timing of recruitment. In 1972-73 most recruitment did not take place until the middle of the financial year which significantly reduced the average. However, in 1973-74 most recruitment wiii be early in the year with at least 35 positions being occupied for the full year.

132

SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

TUESDAY 9 OCI'OBER 1973

During the examination of Item 420-2-03 : Postage, telegrams and telephone services, Senator Webster sought information as to what amount of the draft estimate of $480,000 was allocated to telephone services. The amount allocated is $390,000. A full dissection of the draft estimate is as follows:

1972-73 1973-74

Actual Estimate

Postage 69,381 72,000

Telegraph services 17,256 18,000

Telephone services 291,203 390,000

377,840 480,000

The increase in 1973-7 4 is mainly attributable to installation costs of telephone services as follows: - Installation of new N.S.U. equipment in the new Trade Complex building

- Installation of additional N.S.U. equipment in N.R.M.A. House - Extension to existing switching equipment in N.R.M.A. House - Installation of new telephone services in premises in Sydney following relocation of the Regional Office .

Less estimated rental rebate in respect of Barton offices following removal of the Department to the Trade Complex building

133

90,000 10,000 15,000

8,000

123,000

20,000

103,000

SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

TUESDAY 9 OCTOBER 1973

During the examination of Item 420-3 - Other Services-Australian Wool Commission - Payments against loss in 1970-71 in accordance with section 25 of the Australian Wool Commission Act, Senator Young sought information as to the nature of expenditure under this Item, and wh ether provision was made separately for the availability of financial resources, to the extent this may be required, to the Australian Wool Corporation .

In amplification of the explanation provided during the examination, the position is that in the course of pursuing its wool marketing responsibilities in 1970-71, the Australian Wool Commission incurred a loss totalling $1,379,146. Section 25 of the Wool Commission Act provided that where the Commission incurred a loss as a result of its trading operations, and had insufficient funds

to meet the loss, the Government would pay to the Commission an amount equal to the loss. An initial advance of $1,040,000 was paid to the Corporation in 1970-71, and the balance of $339,146 was paid in 1972-73.

Section 25 of the Act also provided that any profits earned by the Commission as a result of its trading operations would be applied firstly in repaying any amounts paid to the Commission by the Government to meet previous trading losses. During the course of 1972-73, as the wool market improved, the Commission eventually accrued a substantial profit from its wool trading operations, and the full amount of $1,379,146 was repaid to the Government during that year.

The substantial profits made by the Commission during 1972-73 were passed on to the Australian Wool Corporation when the Commission ceased to exist on 31 December 1972. In addition, the Corporation has call on credit facilities, backed by a Government guarantee of repayment, to the extent of $34 million.

There is also $13 million available to the Corporation for the purposes of working capital. These funds are held in the Australian Wool Corporation (Work " ing Capital) Trust Fund which was established under the Wool Industry Act 1972. They are available to make advances by way of loan to the Corporation. The credit balance of the Fund was created by

- An appropriation of $1 million in 1972-73; and - Repayment by the Commission of $12 million m 1972/73 of loans pre-viously made by the Government. The Corporation has not sought additional funds for its trading operations and has access to adequate funds for any immediate purposes.

134

.....

w

V\

SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

TUESDAY 9 OCTOBER 1973

During the examination of Item 420-3-06: Payments to State Authorities in connection with War Service Land Settlement, Senator Webster requested a break " up of where the allocation of the estimate of $690,000 would be expended. The following table gives this information together with actual expenditure in 1972-73.

New South W ales South Australia Western Australia Tasm ania

1972-73 1973-74 1972-73 1973-74 1972-73 1973-74 1972-73 1973-74

Actual Estimate Actual Estimate Actual Estimate Actual Estimate

(1) Living allowa nce 87 1,426 8,000

(2) Gov ernment contribution s to writing off excess costs of acquisition and develop-ment 57,236

(3) Governm ent contributions to writing off losses on ad-vances to setUers 44,075 10,000

( 4) Administration costs (credit faciliti es) 108,874 100,000 65,792 55,000 64,386 66,000

(5) Op eration and maintenance of irri gation and other pro-jects 339,458 435,000 967 4,000

(6) King Island concessions and assessment rebates 1,600 11,200

(7) Ha emo globin experiment K angaroo Island 5,574

101,311 10,000 448,419 535,000 65,792 55,000 73,953 89,200

Total

1972-73 1973-74

Actual Estimate

1,513 8,000

57,236

44,075 10,000

239,052 221,000

340,425 439,000

1,600 11,200

5,574 *

689,475 689,200

* No provision was made in 1973-74 for this item when the draft estimates were prepared as it was expected that future expenditure would be funded from another source.

SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

TUESDAY 9 OCTOBER 1973

During the examination of Item 420-3-10: Payments under the Dairying Industry Act-Butter and Cheese Bounties, Senator Web ster sought information concerning Thermoduric testing of raw milk. In response to this request the fol " lowing information is offered.

Background

1. The Thermoduric Test is one of a number of tests which can be used to give an idea of the microbiological quality of raw m ilk as it comes from a farm dairy. Other tests are the Standard Plate Count and the M ethylene Blue Reduc " tuel Test, and also the Laboratory Pasteurization Count. The Laboratory Pasteuriz a " tion Count and the Thermoduric Test are similar in principle in that the milk is heated before the count is done, to give an estimate of the number of bacteria in the milk likely to survive pasteurization. In the other two tests, no pre-treatment of the milk is carried out.

2. Research, carried out at the Gilbert Chandler Institute of Dairy Tech " nology at Werribee, has shown that the Thermoduric Test is the best of a number of tests for the microbiological quality of raw milk.

3. Thermoduric testing will be introduced as a statutory test for raw milk supplied to factories in Victoria from December 1 1973. Financial penalties for poor results will be introduced from 1 March 1974. The grades will be:

Choice 1st Grade . 2nd Grade .

Less than 10,000 colonies per mi. 10,000-30,000 per ml. Greater than 30,000 per ml.

4. In Queensland a thermoduric standard for town milk exists (not greater than 30,000 colonies per ml.) but if the count exceeds this level, the milk is diverted to manufacturing . There is no thermoduric count for manufacturing milk.

5. In N .S.W., the Thermoduric Standard is not greater than 30,000 colonies per ml. for market and manufacturing milk and if exceeded, the supplier is suspended for one month.

6. In Tasmania the limit is not greater than 50,000 colonies per mi. for refrigerated bulk milk.

7. South Australia is considering either a Lab. Pasteurization Count or a Standard Plate Count.

8. Western Australia has a market milk standard (not greater than 10,000 colonies per ml.) but no thermoduric standard for manu facturing milk except to do counts and advise farmers of results.

Answers to Senator Webster's Questions Q. Will setting standards for thermodurics result in increased exports?

136

A. If the factories receive milk of a better hygienic standard, their products will improve in quality. (At the same time, quality performance of the factory itself is also important.) Since the introduction of Thermoduric testing was mooted, Victoria's experience has been that the hygienic quality of raw milk has

improved considerably. Granting therefore that the quality of products will improve, this fact should enhance Australia's chances of selling dairy products, particularly cheese, on today's quality-conscious world market. This will depend of course on the

market situation.

Q. Is the Minister or the Department seeking a standard in regulations relating to Thermoduric content of milk?

A. No . This is a matter for State Governments seeking high hygienic standards on the farm. Australian Government regulations - Exports (Dairy Produce) Regulations - are concerned with setting standards for export products only. The Exports (Dairy Produce) Regulations already require that all dairy

products exported must be processed from pasteurised milk. However, the Australian Government regards favourably the action by State Governments aimed at minimising bacteriological content of the milk delivered to the dairy factories.

137

SENATE ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

TUESDAY 9 OCTOBER 1973

During the examination of Item 422-2-03: Paym ents to States for services in connection with inspect ions of fresh fruit, seeds, plants, vegetables and other items, Senator Webster sought details of 'the breakup in the various payments to the States in the various items'. In response to this request the following information is offered.

Arrangements with the State authorities carrying out export inspection services on behalf of the Department provide for charges for those services to be made on a broad commodity grouping basis in conformity with the divisional structure of the Department.

Export inspection of fruit and vegetables is a responsibility of Industry No. 4 (Horticultural Crops) Division. Charges are not dissected on an individual com " modity basis. Industry No. 3 (Field Crops) Division's inspection responsibilities include ships' holds, wheat, other grains, oilseeds, herbage plant seeds and timber.

Analytical services performed on behalf of both Divisions are not separately charged. The estimates of costs for inspection services under Item 03 for 1973-74 are:

Fresh fruit etc. Grain etc. Timber Analytical Services

Total

Say $1,200,000.

138

$

594,400 555,700 5,800 45,700

1,201,600

Senator the Hon. K. S. Wriedt, Minister of State for Primary Industry, Parliament House, Canberra, A.C.T. 2600

My dear Minister,

DEPARTMENT OF OVERSEAS TRADE

Canberra, A.C.T. 2 November 1973

Senate Estimates Committee F Department of Overseas Trade

During consideration of the estimates for the Department of Overseas Trade, Senate Estimates Committee F at the time sought additional information on several matters. The first of these questions was asked by Senator Lillico (Hansard, page 278,

col. 1, para. 6) who sought information relating to the trading balance with certain countries. Attachment A provides the information sought by Senator Lillico. The second question was asked by Senator Primmer (Hansard, page 279, col. 2, paras. 10 and 14) and concerns the sale of Australian dairy produce. The informa "

tion sought falls within the province of the Department of Primary Industry which will be advising you direct. The third question was asked by Senator W ilkinson (Hansard, page 282, col. 1, para. 8) and relates to staff employed at the Mission to the European Economic Community Permanent Mission to the European Office of the United Nations.

Attachment B provides the information sought by Senator Wilkinson. The fourth question was asked by Senator Young (Hansard, page 282, col. 2, para. 3) who sought information relating to the volume of trade between Australia and Taiwan in the year prior to that post being closed. Attachment C provides the information sought by Senator Young.

The fifth question was asked by Senator Young (Hansard, page 283, col. 2, para. 16) and concerns the procedure by which trade can be extended by opening up new markets in new countries. Attachment D provides the information sought by Senator Young.

The final question wa s also asked by Senator Young (Hansard, page 285, col. 1, para. 10) and related to the rent charge for flats in Canberra. Attachment E provides the information sought by Senator Young.

There are sufficient copies for the memb ers of the Committee but additional copies can be provided if necessary.

Yours sincerely,

139

R. MOORE A ssistant Secretary, Management Services.

Q UES TIO N ASKE D BY SENAT OR LILLIC O

(Hansard, page 278, col. 1, para. 6)

Question:

Attachment A

In most of those countries, is not the trading balance loaded fairly heavily in our favour? It used to be in South East Asian Countries.

Answer: TRAD E BALANCE: AUSTRALIA AND SELECTED SOUTH AN D

SO UTH EAST ASIAN CO UNTRIES

1972-73*

Australia's Australia's Trade balance

Country

exports to imports from in Australia's favour(+)

$A'OOO $A'OOO $A'OOO

India 37,399 31,952 + 5,447

Burma 2,146 219 + 1,927

Khmer, Rep. of . 984 127 + 857

Indonesia 74,629 13,586 +61,043

Laos 155 Nil + 155

Ma laysia 97,921 38,430 +59,491

Singapore 132,125 40,014 +92,111

Philippines 49,393 7,787 +41,606

Thailand 36,285 7,034 +29,251

Vietnam, R ep. of 8,823 34 + 8,789

" Preliminary figures .

140

QUESTION ASKED BY SENATOR WILKINSON

(Hansard, page 282, col. 1, para. 8)

Question:

Attachment B

Why do we employ more Australia-based than locally-engaged staff at the Mission to the European Economic Community and Permanent Mission to the European Office of the United Nations?

Answer: Two posts are involved-Brussels and Geneva. Geneva is solely a policy post and does not have an active interest in trade promotion. Brussels also is largely concerned with policy matters although it does have a small staff working directly on trade promotion activities.

Due to the special nature of the posts and their involvement in E.E.C. matters in particular, Australia-b ased stenographers have also been provided to ensure security of information. In other posts stenographers would be provided on the local staff establish " ment.

Because of the posts' concentration on policy matters the number of local staff engaged on pure trade promotion activities, e.g. marketing officers, is less than a 'normal' post.

141

QU ESTION ASKED BY SENATOR Y O UN G

(Hansard, page 282, col. 2, para. 3)

Question:

Attachment C

What was the volume of Trade between Australia and Taiwan in the year prior to that post being closed?

Answer:

AU STR ALIAN EXPORTS T O TAIWAN

$'000

July to Jan. to Year Year

Dec. 1972* June 1973* 1972/73* 1971/72

Au stralian produce Manufactures of which -Iron and Steel 813 984 1,797 1,820

Machines & Machinery (Non Elect.) 879 636 1,515 508

Chemicals 319 579 898 947

Other . 1,498 1,683 3,181 1,721

Primary Produce of which-Butter 220 239 459 457

Milk, preserved dried, etc . . 2,581 3,270 5,851 3,982

Meat meal, fish meal, etc . . 84 486 570 58

Wool 9,632 17,768 27,400 12,739

Tallow 433 575 1,008 2,438

Lead unwrought 552 552 1,104 620

Pig Iron 14 706 720 -

Zinc unwrought 1,687 2,914 4,601 3,120

Beef and Veal 197 226 423 335

Wheat . 3,869 4,304 8,173 7,052

Barley. 4,580 2,219 6,799 [6,129

Cattle & Calf hides 288 396 684 686

Other . 1,126 1,849 2,975 2,865

Unclassified (non-trade) 289 6 295 28

Re-Exports 1,277 107 1,384 175

Total 30,338 39,499 69,837 55,680

* Preliminary.

142

July 1973*

257

183 331 257

28

271

28

2,785 152 160 -375

--

873 31 84

2

8

5,825

Month

January February March April . May

June July August September October November December

Total.

Total 7 months . ,., Preliminary .

AUST R ALIAN EXP OR TS TO TAIWA N

(By calendar month 1972 and 1973)

1972 1973

Value Month

($'000) 4,173 January

6,454 February

5,152 March

3,465 April.

8,446 May

4,486 June

5,858* July

3,086* 4,481 * Total 7 months .

6,088* 4,436* 6,255*

62,380

38,034

143

Value ($'000) 8,371 * 5,787*

6,784* 6,236* 6,149* 6,306* 5,825*

45,458*

QUESTION ASKED BY SENATOR YOUNG

(Hansard, page 283, col. 2, para. 16)

Question

Attachment D

∑ I would also like the detail of the procedures by which trade can be extended by ,opening up new markets in new countries .

Answer There has been a continuing effort over the years by this Department to identify and develop new markets for Australian products in overseas countries. This is a constant process carried out by the Overseas Markets Division of the Department in conjunction with the Trade Commissioner Service. There is no country in the world which has not recently been examined in this regard, or is not currently under examination. Naturally, limitations in financial and personnel resources have led to concentration of effort on those overseas markets offering the best prospects for sales, or potential sales, of Australian exports.

Market opportunities, as identified, are publicised in trade journals which are widely circulated to Australian industry. In addition, the Department maintains regional offices in each of the State capitals which are in constant touch with local exporters and manufacturers. Inquiries from overseas for the supply of Australian products are rapidly

brought to the attention of appropriate Australian firms in this manner. The Department, through its central office in Canberra, regional offices in the States and Trade Commissioner personnel overseas, offers a wide range of facilities to assist Australian exporters. These include advice on market prospects, market requirements, import regulations, appropriate business contacts , etc., assistance with the handling of samples and customs clearance s, and any necessary follow-up action in the marke∑ t. The Department sponsors trade missions and trade displays in those markets where prospects so warrant, to provide maximum exposure of Australian businessmen and products to local businessmen. The foregoing are some examples of the facilities offered by the Department to Australian exporters seeking to develop new markets.

144

QUESTION ASKED BY SENATOR YOUNG

(Hansard, page 285, col. 1, para. 10) Question How are rents for Departmental fiats determined? Answer

Attachment E

Departmental fiats are provided to Trade Commissioners and other officers posted overseas, in the following order of priority: - Commissioners on mid-term briefing in Australia. - Commissioners and officers spending a short time in Australia between postings. - Commissioners and officers returning from posting. - Commissioners and officers proceeding on posting.

The demand on the fiats by the first two categories is such that Commissioners and officers in the latter two categories are generally only accommodated for short periods extending from two to seven days. The Department does however endeavour to maintain a high rate of occupancy for all the fiats and tenancy may be extended if circumstances

warrant such action. The Department's policy on fiat rents is that the fiats be self-supporting without being profit-making concerns. The location of the seven fiats mentioned in our estimates explanation and the rent

payable by the D epartment to the Department of the Capital Territory, are as follows: Flat 4 Block 1, Northbourne $16.30 per week 2 b.r.

Flat 4 Block 5, Northbourne $16.30 per week 2 b.r.

Flat 8 Block 5, Northbourne $16.30 per week 2 b.r.

Flat 4 Block 9, Northbourne $18.30 per week 3 b.r.

Flat 4 Block 12, Northboume $18.30 per week 3 b.r.

Flat H 6 Kitchener St., Hughes $10.25 per week - 2 b.r.

Flat C Block 7, Wisdom St., Hughes $13.15 per week - 3 b.r.

The rent we charge to the tenants of the fiats is designed to recover the rent charged to us by the Department of the Capital Territory, plus the following standing charges: ( 1 ) Telephone rental. (2) Radio licence.

( 3) Sewerage rates. ( 4) Heating (where applicable). (5) Water rates. ( 6) Amortisation of furniture and utensils provided in the fiats . The tenant of the fiat is responsible for the payment direct to the relevant authority, of electricity consumed, telephone calls made and cleaning charges when vacating the fiat.

Each tenant pays a basic rent contribution in accordance with a Scale of Normal Living Costs assessed by the Public Service Board, plus an assessed amount for each of the standing charges referred to above. Application of the Department's formula to a Trade Commissioner Grade C occupy "

ing Flat 4, Block 1, Northbourne Avenue, would produce the following weekly rental figure:

(i) Basic rental contribution (ii) Telephone rental (iii) Radio licence . (iv) Water rates

( v) Sewerage rates . (vi) Heating provided

Rent charged

145

$A

22.50 1.06 0.16 0.43 0.29 3.16

27.60

The rent paid to the Department of the Capital Territory is $16.30 p.w. and standing charges items (ii) to (vi) total $5.10-a combined sum of $21.40 per week. The difference between this figure and the rental (i.e. $6.20) represents the charge made for depreciation of furniture and utensils provided in the flat.

146

Estimates Committee F

Minutes of Proceedings

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No. 1

TUESDAY 9 OCTOBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 3.50 p.m .

2. ABSENCE OF CHAIRMAN: Senator Wilkinson took the Chair and informed the Committee that the Chairman (Senator Cant) was unable to attend the meeting due to ill-health. Senator Wilkinson further informed the Committee that, pursuant to paragraph (7) of the Resolution of the Senate agreed to on

14 March 1973, viz: (7) The Chairman ma y from time to time appoint another member of the Com " mittee to be Deputy-Chairman and the member so appointed shall act as Chairman of the Committee at any time when the Chairman is not present

at a meeting of the Committee. he had been appointed Deputy-Chairman of Estimates Committee F.

3. REFERENCE OF PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 TO ESTIMATES COMMITTEES: The Resolution of the Senate of 13 September 1973 referring the Particulars of Proposed Expenditure 1973-74 to Estimates Committees for examination and report wa s reported to the Com " mittee.

4. CONSIDERATION OF PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF PRIMARY INDUSTRY :

Appearing: Senator the Hon. K. S. Wriedt, Minister for Primary Industry , accompanied by: Mr J. Van Holst Pellekaan, Acting Director , Bureau of Agricultural Economics

Mr A G. Brown , Acting Director , Forestry Research Institute Mr J. R. Smith, A ssistant Secretary, Industry No . 1 (Meat and Meat Pro " ducts) Division Mr F. J. O 'Bryan, Assistant Secretary , Industr y No . 2 (Dairy Products)

Division, Marketing and Stabilisation Branch Mr A J. Bennett, Assistant Secretary , Industry No. 3 (Field Crops) Division, General Crops and Inspection Services B ranch Mr A W . Lloyd, A ssistant Secretary , Industry No.3 (Field Crops) Division,

Cereals and Vegetable Oilseeds Branch Mr A E. Wallace, First Assistant Secretary , Industr y No . 4 (Horticultural Crops) Division

149

Mr G. E. Fewster, Assistant Secretary, Industry No. 4 (Horticultural Crops) Division, Fruit, Wine and Inspection Services Branch Mr A. R. Kyburz, Assistant Secretary, Industry No. 4 (Horticultural Crops) Division, Sugar, Vegetables and Canned Fruit Branch Mr E. A. Purnell-Webb, Assistant Secretary, Industry No. 5 (Fisheries)

Division, Operations Branch Mr J. Z. Jelinek, Principal Executive Officer, Industry No. 6 (Wool) Division, Marketing Services Branch Mr G. G. Hirst, Assistant Secretary, Development Division Dr R. N. Farquhar, Assistant Secretary, Agriculture and Food Services

Division, Extension Services Branch Mr J. M. Bishop, Senior Executive Officer, Agriculture and Food Services Division, Grants Administration Branch Mr B. C. Barlow, Senior Executive Officer, Agriculture and Food Services

Division, War Services Land Settlement Branch Mr D. P. Cleary, Acting Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch Mr A. A. Cooley, Acting Director, Finance and General Services; and Mr J. L. Smith, Assistant Secretary, Industry No. 6 (Wool) Division,

Marketing Services Branch Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Deputy-Chairman called on the following Divisions: Divisions 420, 422, 424, 427, 785 - Department of Primary Industry

(Document A) Divisions 915, 918-Department of_Primary Industry (Document B).

The following particulars of proposed expenditure were considered: Document A Division 420 - Administrative Division 422 - Administration of the Commerce (Trade

Descriptions) Act

Division 424 - Bureau of Agricultural Economics Division 427 -Forestry and Timber Bureau Division 785 - Rural Occupations - Re-establishment Loans

$

29,151,000

15,867,000 2,928,000 2,445,000

and Vocational Training 960,000

Document B $

Division 915-Capital Works and Services 105,000

Division 918-Payments to or for the States 54,059,000

Consideration of proposed expenditure for the Department of Primary Industry concluded.

5. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at five minutes to ten p.m. until a day and hour to be fixed.

6. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Wilkinson (Deputy-Chairman), Devitt, Durack, Lillico, Primmer, Webster and Young .

150

H . G. J. CANT Chairman

-~

i '

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS .

No.2

THURSDAY, 18 OCTOBER 1973 ...,, ∑'.;

1. MEETING: The C6rnmittee met at 3.3S p' :m. The Chairman (Senator Cant) ∑ took the Chair. ∑

' .' ' '_ )~.'-: " f

2. CONSIDERATION OF PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF OVERSEAS TRADE:

Appearing: Senator the Hon K. S. Wriedt, Minister for. Primary Industry, accompanied by: ∑

Mr R. C. Moore, Assistant Secretary, Management Services Branch Mr W. J. Done, Assistant Director Finance, Management Services Branch Mr L. P ~ Duthie, First Assistant Secretary, Exports Services Division Mr D. Fitch, Assistant Secretary, Exports Promotion Branch

Mr R. J. Thomas , Assistant Secretary, Policy Development Division Mr P. S. Field, Assistant Secretary; Exports Services Division; _:md Mr J. P. Cahill, Assistant Director, Trade Commissioner ServiCe∑ s∑ ection, Overseas Markets Division

Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions: D ivisions 390, 394-Department of Overseas Trade (Document A) Divisions 905, 907-Department of Overseas Trade (Document B). The following particulars of proposed expenditure were considered:

Document A . Division 390 -Administrative Division 394 -Trade Commissioner Services

$

18,634,000 8,777,000

Document B ∑Division 905-Capital Works and Services Division 907 - Other Services

$

65,500 100,000

Consideration of proposed expenditure for the Department of Overseas Trade concluded.

3 .. CONSIDERATION OF PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF SECONDARY INDUSTRY:

Appearing:. Senator the Hon. K. S. Wriedt, Minister for Primary Industry, accompanied by":∑ . Mr R . C. Moore, Assista nt Secretary, Man agement Services Branch Mr W . J. Done, Assistant Director F inance, Management Services Branch

Mr G. E. Bowen, Principal Project Officer, Policy Secretariat

151

Mr F. N. Bennett, First Assistant Secretary, Secondary Industry Research Division Mr K . G. Purcell, Assistant Secretary, Industry Efficiency Branch, Secondary Industry Policy Division Mr E . W. Ryan, Executive Officer, Australian Industrial Research and

Development Grants Board; and J. N. Lane, Assistant Director, Industry Efficiency Section, Secondary Industry Policy Division Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions: Divisions 505, 507 - Department of Secondary Industry (Document A) The following particulars of proposed expenditure were considered: Document A Division 505 - Administrative Division 507 -Australian Industrial Research and Development

$

2,527,000

Grants Board 16,766,000

Consideration of proposed expenditure for the Department of Secondary Industry concluded.

4. CONSIDERATION OF .PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF NORTHERN DEVELOPMENT:

Appearing: Senator the Hon K. S. Wriedt, Minister for Primary Industry, accompanied by: Mr A. G. Bennett, First Assistant Secretary, Department of Northern Development

Mr R. A. Daly, Assistant Secretary, Commodities Division Mr A. Manderson, Assistant Secretary, Projects No.1 Branch Mr B. Smith, Assistant Secretary, Projects No. 2 Branch Mr C. G. Fereday, Director, Management and Special Services Branch Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Chief Finance Officer. The Chairman called on the following Divisions: Division 370-Department of Northern Development (Document A) Division 895-Department of Northern Development (Document B). The following particulars of proposed expenditure were considered: Document A Division 370-Administrative Document B Division 895-Payments to or for the States Consideration of proposed expenditure for the Department of Development concluded.

$

1,198,000 $

813,500 Northern

5. MINUTES: The Minutes of the me eting of 9 October 1973 were read and confirmed.

6. ADJOURNMENT : The Committee adjourned at 6.04 p.m. till a day and hour to be fixed.

7. ATTENDANCE : The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cant, Devitt, Durack, Lillico, Primmer, Wilkinson and Young.

152

H.G.J.CANT Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMIITEE F

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.3

MONDAY, 12 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 2.05 p.m. The Chairman (Senator Cant) took the Chair.

2. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF THE NORTHERN TERRITORY: Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, accompanied by the following officers: Mr N. Lynagh, Acting Director, Finance, Supply and Transport Branch,

Management, Legislation and Planning Division Mr W. J. F. Hull, Assistant Director, Estimates and Works Programming, Management, Legislation and Planning Division Mr B. Hart, Director , Animal Industry and Agriculture Branch (also repre "

senting Forestry /Fisheries Branch), Resources Development Division Mr P. Purich, Director, Mines Branch (also representing Water Resources Branch), Resources Development Division Mr D. P. Lampe, Acting Director, Local Government and Services Branch

(also representing Public Utilities and Housing Branch), Local Govern " ment and Community D evelopment Division Mr L. J. Warneminde, Estimates and Works Programming Officer, Manage-ment, Legislation and Planning Division Treasury Official: Mr A.M. Finch, Acting Assistant Secretary . The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 380-382 - Department of the Northern Territory (Document A) Division 900 - Department of the Northern Territory (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for the

Department of the Northern Territory. Suspension of Hearings: The hearings of the Committee were suspended at 4.29 p.m.

3. DELIBERATIVE MEETING : The Committee, for the purposes of consider " ing a matter raised by a member of the Committee relating to the Pipelines Authority legislation, met in deliberative session. The Committee also considered the time to be taken for the dinner suspension

this day. Ordered - That the sittings of the Committee be suspended between 6 p.m. and 7.30 p.m.

153

4. RESUMPTION OF PUBLIC HEARINGS: The Committee resumed its public hearings at 5.27 p.m.

5. PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE 1973-74 - DEPART "

MENT OF MINERALS AND ENERGY:

Appearing: Senator the Hon. J. L. Cavanagh, Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, until 6 p.m. and from 7.30 p.m. the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Special Minister of State, Senator the Hon. Don Willesee, accompanied by the fol " lowing officers:

Mr R. H. J. Thompson, Assistant Secretary Mr D. M . McAlister, Assistant Secretary Mr L. G. Turner, Assistant Director, National Mapping Mr M. J. Nicholson, Finance Officer Mr L. W. Williams, Assistant Director, Bureau of Mineral Resources,

Geology and Geophysics Mr A. D. Thomas, Deputy Head, Development Group, Australian Atomic Energy Commission Mr R. C. Coles, Director of Finance, Australian Atomic Energy Com "

mission Mr W. Woodward, Chief Finance Officer, Snowy Mountains Hydro-electric Authority Mr A. C. Girard, Chief Administrative Officer, Joint Coal Board Mr L. G. O'Brien, Assistant Chief Accountant, Joint Coal Board Mr J. K. Kaye, Secretary, Pipeline Authority. Treasury Official: Mr A. M. Finch, Acting Assistant Secretary.

The Chairman called on the following Divisions for consideration: Divisions 350-359-Department of Minerals and Energy (Document A) Divisions 890-891 -Department of Minerals and Energy (Document B). The Committee concluded its consideration of the following Divisions:

Document A

Division 350 - Administrative D ivision 352-Division of National Mapping Division 355-Bureau of Mineral Resources, Geology and Geophysics Division 357-Joint Coal Board Division 359-Australian Atomic Energy Commission

Document B

$

3,793,500 5,064,000

18,245,000 634,500 13,515,000

$

Division 890, Sub-division 1-being considered by the Committee 54,742,100

Ordered - That the Committee consider Item 04 - Purchase of pipes and associated equipment for the Moomba-Sydney pipeline $54,000,000 and sub " division 4-For expenditure under the Pipeline Authority Act $107,000,000 together.

6. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 10.34 p.m. until a day and hour to be fixed.

154

7. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cant, Devitt, Durack, Lillico, Primmer, Web ster, Wilkinson and Young. The President (Senator the Hon. Sir Magnus Cormack), Senators Carrick, McAuliffe, McLaren, Marriott , Milliner, O'Byrne and Poyser also took part

in the proceedings.

155

H.G.J.CANT Chairman

THE SENATE

ESTIMl\TES COMMITTEE F

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No.4

WEDNESDAY, 14 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 12.00 noon. The Chairman (Senator Cant) took the Chair.

2. DRAFT REPORT: The Chairman presented a Draft Report for the Com " mittee's consideration. The Draft Report was agreed to, without amendment.

3. CONSIDERATION OF REPLIES TO INFORMATION SOUGHT BY THE

COMMITTEE: The Committee considered replies to information sought relating to the Department of Primary Industry and the Department of Over " seas Trade. The Chairman informed the Committee that, although replies had not yet been received to information sought of the other Departments examined, efforts would be made to obtain it prior to the Appropriation Bills being con " sidered in Committee of the Whole.

4. MINUTES: The Minutes of the meetings held on 18 October 1973 and 12 November 1973 were read and confirmed.

5. A DJOURNME NT: The Committee adjourned at 12.23 p.m.

6. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cant, Devitt, Durack, Primmer, Webster, Wilkinson and Young.

An apology was received from Senator Lillico.

156

H.G .J.CANT Chairman

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

FURTHER REPORT TO THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

FURTHER REPORT TO THE SENATE

Estimates Committee F has the honour to present a further Report to the Senate on the Particulars of Proposed Expenditure 1973-74.

1. On 15 November 1973, in accordance with the Resolution of the Senate of 13 September 1973, a Report from the Committee was presented to the Senate relating to the Estimates for the Departments of Primary Industry, Overseas Trade, Secondary Industry, Northern Development, Minerals and Energy, and Northern Territory. The Committee, in its report informed the Senate that it had been able

to complete its examination of the Estimates of the aforementioned Departments, with the exception of the Department of Minerals and Energy.

2. The Report of the Committee was ordered to be printed by the Senate, which then agreed on the motion of Senator Durack, That the particulars of proposed expenditure contained in Division 890/1/04, Division 890, sub-divisions 2, 3 and 4, and Division 891, relating to the Depart "

ment of Minerals and Energy, be recommitted to Estimates Committee F for consideration and report to the Senate by 22 November 1973.

3. The Committee reports that it has considered the Particulars of Certain Proposed Expenditure in respect of the Year ending on 30 June 1974 for the Department of Minerals and Energy, Division 890, sub-division 1 - Plant and equipment - Item 04 (Purchase of pipes and associated equipment for the Moomba-Sydney pipeline) $54,000,000; sub-division 2 - (For expenditure under the Snowy Mountains Hydro-electric Power Act) $13,100,000; sub-division 3 -(For expenditure under the Atomic Energy Act) $1,388,000; sub-division 4 -

(For expenditure under the Pipeline Authority Act) $107,000,000; and Division 891 - Other Services - Item 01 - (Coal Exploration) $1,000,000, and has received explanations from the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Special Minister of State, Senator the Hon. Don Willesee and the officers of the Department of Minerals and Energy who appeared, with the exception of some items for which answers will be provided before the Appropriation Bills are considered in Committee of the Whole.

4. A copy of the Minutes of Proceedings is tabled with this Report for the information of the Senate, together with the Hansard record of the evidence.

5. The Committee records its appreciation of the assistance given by the Minister for Foreign Affairs and Special Minister of State, and officers of the Department of Minerals and Energy, whose estimates were recommitted for its consideration.

20 November 1973

159

H. G. J. CANT Chairman

Estimates Committee F

Minutes of Proceedings

THE SENATE

ESTIMATES COMMITTEE F

MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS

No. 1

TUESDAY, 20 NOVEMBER 1973

1. MEETING: The Committee met at 8.04 p.m . The Chairman (Senator Cant) took the Chair.

2. RECOMMITTAL OF PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE " DIVISIONS 890 AND 891 - DEPARTMENT OF MINERALS AND

ENERGY: The Resolution of the Senate of 15 November 1973, recommitting the particulars of proposed expenditure contained in Division 890/l/04, Division 890, sub-divisions 2, 3 and 4, and Division 891, relating to the Depart " ment of Minerals and Energy to Estimates Committee F for examination and report, was reported to the Committee.

3. CONSIDERATION OF PARTICULARS OF PROPOSED EXPENDITURE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF MINERALS AND ENERGY- DIVISION

890/1/04, DIVISION 890, SUB-DIVISIONS 2, 3 AND 4, AND DIVISION 891: Appearing: Senator the Hon. Don Willesee, Minister for Foreign Affairs and Special Minister of State, accompanied by the following officers:

D epartment of Minerals and Energy Mr R. H. J. Thompson, Assistant Secretary Mr A. E. Crebbin, Director , Finance and G eneral Services Mr P. Power, Acting Finance Officer Pipeline Authority

Mr J. K. Kaye, Secretary Snowy Mountains H ydro-electricity Authorit y Mr W. Woodward , Chief Finance Officer Australian Atomic Energy Commi ssion

Mr A. D . Thoma s, Deputy Head, Development Group D epartment of the Treasury Mr A.M. Finch, Acting A ssistant Secretary. The Chairman called on the following Divisions: Divisions 890 (sub-di vision 1, Item 04, sub-divisions 2, 3 and 4) - 891 -Department of Minerals and Energy (Docum ent B ). The Committee concluded its consideration of the proposed expenditure for

the Department of Minerals and Energy.

163

4. DRAFf REPORT : The Chairman presented a Draft Report for the Com " mittee's consideration. The Draft Report was agreed to with an amendment.

5. ADJOURNMENT: The Committee adjourned at 7 minutes to 10 p.m.

6. ATTENDANCE: The following members of the Committee were present: Senators Cant, Devitt, Durack, Lillico, Primmer, Webster, Wilkinson and Young. Senators Georges, Lawrie, McAuliffe, McLaren, Milliner, O'Byrne and

Prowse also took part in the proceedings.

164

H.G.J.CANT Chairman