PRIME MINISTER AND CABINET PORTFOLIO

In attendance

Senator Abetz, Minister for Employment

Department of Prime Minister and Cabinet

COAG Reform Council

Frost, Michael, Deputy Head of Secretariat

Office of the Official Secretary to the Governor-General

Outcome 1—Program 1

Mr Mark Fraser, acting Official Secretary to the Governor-General

Ms Karen Baker, Director Corporate Services Branch

National Australia Day Council

Honours, Symbols and Territories Branch Government Division

Mr Jeremy Lasek, Chief Executive Officer, National Australia Day Council

Mr Adrian Watts, Corporate Direction, National Australia Day Council

Australian National Audit Office

Outcome 1

Mr Ian McPhee, Auditor-General

Mr Steve Chapman, Deputy Auditor-General

Mr Watson, Michael, Group Executive Director, Assurance Audit Service Group

Outcome 2

Ms Barbara Cass, Group Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Dr Tom Ioannou, Group Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Dr Andrew Pope, Group Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Mr Brian Boyd, Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Mr Mark Simpson, Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Dr Tom Clarke, Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Ms Fiona Knight, Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Ms Edel Kairouz, Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Ms Donna Burton, Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Mr Stuart Turnbull, Executive Director, Performance Audit Service Group

Ms Anya Moore, Executive Director, Corporate Management Branch

Mr Mitchell Frost, CFO

Outcome 1

Australian Public Service Commission

Mr Stephen Sedgwick, Public Service Commissioner

Ms Stephanie Foster, Deputy Public Service Commissioner

Ms Annwyn Godwin, Merit Protection Commissioner

Mr Ian Fitzgerald, Chief Human Capital Officer

Ms Helen Bull, Group Manager, Workplace Relations

Dr David Schmidtchen, Group Manager, Human Capital Research and Evaluation

Ms Karin Fisher, Group Manager, Ethics

Mr Owen Livermore, Group Manager, Employment Policy and Participation

Ms Clare Page, Group Manager, Corporate

Mr Patrick Palmer, Group Manager, Remuneration Tribunal Secretariat

Mr Kelvin Zhu, Chief Financial Officer

Office of the Commonwealth Ombudsman

Executive

Mr Colin Neave, Commonwealth Ombudsman

Mr Richard Glenn, Deputy Ombudsman

Mrs Lynette MacLean, Chief Operating Officer

Mr George Masri, Senior Assistant Ombudsman

Office of National Assessments

Outcome 1, Program 1.1 Assessment and reports

Mr Maude, Richard, Director-General

Mr Harrison, Michael, Assistant Director-General, Corporate & IT Services

Mr Keane, Patrick, Chief Financial Officer

Outcome 1, Program 1.2 Coordination and evaluation

Mr Maude, Richard, Director-General

Mr Harrison, Michael, Assistant Director-General, Corporate & IT Services

Mr Keane, Patrick, Chief Financial Officer

Office of the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security

Output Group 1

Dr Vivienne Thom, Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security

Jake Blight, Assistant Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security

CHAIR: I will recommence the estimates hearing for the Finance and Public Administration Legislation Committee. I welcome the Minister for Employment, Senator the Hon. Eric Abetz, representing the Prime Minister, and Mr Michael Frost, Deputy Head of the COAG Reform Council secretariat. Officers and senators are familiar with the rules of the Senate governing estimates hearings. If you need assistance, the secretariat has copies of the rules. I particularly draw the attention of witnesses to an order of the Senate of 13 May 2009 specifying the process by which a claim of public interest immunity should be raised.

The extract read as follows—

Public interest immunity claims

That the Senate—

(a) notes that ministers and officers have continued to refuse to provide information to Senate committees without properly raising claims of public interest immunity as required by past resolutions of the Senate;

(b) reaffirms the principles of past resolutions of the Senate by this order, to provide ministers and officers with guidance as to the proper process for raising public interest immunity claims and to consolidate those past resolutions of the Senate;

(c) orders that the following operate as an order of continuing effect:

(1) If:

   (a) a Senate committee, or a senator in the course of proceedings of a committee, requests information or a document from a Commonwealth department or agency; and

   (b) an officer of the department or agency to whom the request is directed believes that it may not be in the public interest to disclose the information or document to the committee, the officer shall state to the committee the ground on which the officer believes that it may not be in the public interest to disclose the information or document to the committee, and specify the harm to the public interest that could result from the disclosure of the information or document.

(2) If, after receiving the officer’s statement under paragraph (1), the committee or the senator requests the officer to refer the question of the disclosure of the information or document to a responsible minister, the officer shall refer that question to the minister.

(3) If a minister, on a reference by an officer under paragraph (2), concludes that it would not be in the public interest to disclose the information or document to the committee, the minister shall provide to the committee a statement of the ground for that conclusion, specifying the harm to the public interest that could result from the disclosure of the information or document.

(4) A minister, in a statement under paragraph (3), shall indicate whether the harm to the public interest that could result from the disclosure of the information or document to the committee could result only from the publication of the information or document by the committee, or could result, equally or in part, from the disclosure of the information or document to the committee as in camera evidence.

(5) If, after considering a statement by a minister provided under paragraph (3), the committee concludes that the statement does not sufficiently justify the withholding of the information or document from the committee, the committee shall report the matter to the Senate.

(6) A decision by a committee not to report a matter to the Senate under paragraph (5) does not prevent a senator from raising the matter in the Senate in accordance with other procedures of the Senate.

(7) A statement that information or a document is not published, or is confidential, or consists of advice to, or internal deliberations of, government, in the absence of specification of the harm to the public interest that could result from the disclosure of the information or document, is not a statement that meets the requirements of paragraph (I) or (4).

(8) If a minister concludes that a statement under paragraph (3) should more appropriately be made by the head of an agency, by reason of the independence of that agency from ministerial direction or control, the minister shall inform the committee of that conclusion and the reason for that conclusion, and shall refer the matter to the head of the agency, who shall then be required to provide a statement in accordance with paragraph (3).

(Extract, Senate Standing Orders, pp 124-125)

Witnesses are specifically reminded that a statement that information or a document is confidential or consists of advice to government is not a statement that meets the requirements of the 2009 order. Instead, witnesses are required to provide some specific indication of the harm to the public interest that could result from the disclosure of the information or the document. The committee has set 11 July 2014 as the date by which answers to questions on notice are to be returned.