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(generated from captions) hospitals is primary care. Clearly we're too hospital centric. Most of this work could be done in the communities where people live. Most health services rely heavily on government or taxpayer funding but there's an increasing level of out of pocket expenses. In Australia we're paying about $24 billion in out of pocket costs. That doesn't include the contribution that consumers make as taxpayers or privately health insured. We're one of the 5 highest spending nations in the world when it comes to out of pocket costs. We pay double what people in the UK and France are paying. We're paying more than people in the US. This is one of the major issues for all Australians and one that fuels inequity, especially for older Australians who often have complex chronic conditions and lower incomes.We spend $7 billion on dental care, that's mostly conducted in the private sector and poor dental health has become the new indicator of social disadvantage. Again impacts on older more than other impacts on older Australians more than other groups. We issue more than prescriptions every week, which issue prescriptions every is one of the reason s why it's supported price disclosure. It's critical to the future sustainability of our health care system because the cost of medications matters to older Australians.Governments should stop paying inflated prices for drugs and passing those inflated prices on to consumers.

Let me address some more specific health issues for older Australians. Signature for spend a lot of time consulting with and listening to older Australians. To understand what their needs are, to understand what they want from health services, and they tell us very clearly that they don't want to be passive recipients of an inflexible health system. They want to have a say about what services they receive, about how, about when, and about where they receive them. They want health services that enable them to live full lives, not just treat an illness. They want to be able to take care of themselves and the people that they love. And they want a partnership, they don't just want to be battling to get access to providers who have the power to determine their health. What they want and what they receive things.
can often be two different things. Their experience an illness focussed system seeking to prevent mortality at
all costs. Often the desires of the all costs. Often disregarding
It's the desires of It's a system that's built around achieving through movie put with payment is for activity and not for providing a high quality consumer experience of care. In the words of Professor Ken Hillman a practising specialist intensive care clinician at Liverpool Hospital and a Professor of intensive care at University of NSW, people are getting sick at home. They're being put in an ambulance, they're coming into hospital, it's a process which has happened subtly. And it's happened without any discussion within our community. It's just what we do and we do it for what we consider our in the best interests of patients. We want to look after them. We want to cure them and in doing so we've set up a situation where it's difficult to die peacefully. This issue of appropriate palliative care, of allowing people to die with dignity, is one of the critical issues for older Australians. And their families. It's a classic case in which we don't address the real needs of older Australians, their carers or their families. When surveyed, more than two thirds of people will say that they want to die at home. The reality is that two thirds of people will die either in a hospital or a clinical care setting. One fifth of those people will die in an intensive care unit. That figure is increasing and I think that's a real indictment on health care for older Australians. Another example of the failure of our health system is to respond to the needs of older Australians is dementia care. As Glen and Alzheimer's Australia have high lighted. People with dementia struggle to get timely diagnosis, then they receive poor care in hospitals and they're often unable to access appropriate care at the end of their lives. Only half of the people with dementia are ever diagnosed and for those there are, the average time between first symptoms and diagnosis is over three years. As pointed out by Ian and COTA the new living longer, living better aged care reforms do go some way towards addressing better consumer directed care. And some of the other issues that I've mentioned but a great deal more needs to be done. What we're finding in our consultations is that it's difficult to meet the needs of older Australians, when our health system tends to be inflexible. It's process driven, it's focussed on acute care in hospital rather than on community care where people live. It's focussed on a crisis rather than investing in prevention and primary care services. It's focussed on activity measures, rather than the merits of our experience of health care or of our health and wellbeing. So given these issues, in our health care systems, what needs to change? To start with, the goal of our health services should be about trying to achieve healthy lives, not just lives where there's an absence of illness and sometimes the most critical health outcome is achieving a personal mobility for somebody who wants to walk to the shops on their own or the ability to chew food or being able to smile without embarrassment. Or having proper glasses so that they can continue to drive. Our goal should be to better enable people themselves and the people people to take care of themselves and the people they
love even if themselves and the love even if that means a love even different approach love even if that means different approach to treating
an illness. Health love even if that means a
different an illness. Health care should be a partnership between consumers and health care providers. In every providers. In every system of human service delivery we know what gets measured gets done. But without real measures of consumers' health experience and health outcomes we may well be rewarding failure or Ing success. In some ways our health systems currently reward illness, not health by paying or activity of simply counts through-put or outputs. If health consumer experience becomes the key touchstone for health system performance it will inevitably drive real health reform. Provided it's appropriately measured and reported. In practice what we need for older Australians is that their needs and their experience of health services is the key driver of what services we provide. I believe we all have a responsibility told owner aurngs their families, their careers, our community so seek to drive the changes needed and if ageing Australians are not receiving the health care services they need, what are we doing? It's up to Australia and we can do that, we can redefine health in the 21st century, we can move beyond vested interests currently drive many health
decisions. And we can and should put decisions. And we should put the needs of all health consumers including older Australians at the centre of all health care decisions. APPLAUSE

Let me ask you the first one, Ian as you made the point that health and ageing rate very highly in terms of important issues to the electorate, in ft the President of the AMA at this forum pointed out it ran a very close second as an issue to economic management. And yet it has been a sleeper in this election. Ageing was raised in passing as a result of a question during the leader's debate on Sunday night but it was not mentioned by either leader in their opening comments because because they are largely in agreement on that issue. But how much does it concern you that in fact this simply isn't on the agenda and yet it is such an important issue in terms of the politicians be it in terms of ageing, health, or specific health issues such as Alzheimer's. Perhaps a quick comment from each of you?Obviously we are concerned. We're concerned I suppose that one has had to mount such a huge campaign as we have over recent years to get aged care reform achieved which several different Governments failed at. I think that what the three of rus saying however is really important, that politicians need to listen and that is it's not just as I think they often think if you talk about health and ageing, you talk about more money, we're saying it's about the different way of doing things and that there might be some pay-off s for that. I was surprised at the PM didn't claim much greater credit for the living longer, living better announcements which were one of the key reforms of the Government. How we do health and aged care but I also think that it does unfortunately reflect the fact that we don't put as much priority on old people, that ageism is alive and well and we need to face up to that as a communities, not just our politicians.Carol you said that the politicians ignore this at their peril, yet they seem to be ignoring it in terms of this campaign This Program is Captioned Live.We're just interrupting to take you to Queensland where the Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has been addressing the media a short time ago. If you want to keep watching Press Club and you're in the eastern States you can do so on ABC 1. In the other States it starts at 12:30.

This facility damages by the floods and in any event needed up grading. I wanted to thank the council for investing millions of dollars in this facility but I do want to indicate that an incoming Coalition Government is prepared to further upgrade these facilities prepared to assist council to facilities to the tune $250,000. That money will help to facilities to the tune of
$250,000. That to provide seating, it will help to improve and upgrade the canteen, extend the club rooms, make available an umpire's room, it's all part of trying to ensure that the thousands of people who use this facility get the kind of facility that a decent country ought to be able to give them now, we can only invest in things like this if we have a stronger economy and it is obviously the Coalition which does have plans to build a stronger economy by abolishing the carbon tax, by abolishing the mining tax, by getting red tape down, by getting infrastructure built, this will generate the kind of pros terity and the kind of enable
revenue which over time will enable an increasing social dividend. The stronger the economy the greater the social dividend, that's why the Coalition is so committed to building a stronger economy so that everyone can get ahead and this is why we are prepared to make this $250,000 available to council to upgrade these facilities as a you like, on the stronger economy that we are confident we can create. Wyatt Roy is a local member, he's been a remarkably forth right contributor to our Coalition party room since entering Parliament. I think he is one of the coming wave of national leadership from the Coalition. Obviously he appreciates you've got to be Obviously got to be a strong local member before you can be a contributor on the national stage and Wyatt, you were keen that we should make a commitment to this facility and we have and I invite you to say a few words.Thanks so much Tony. Thank you, Tony and Bridget for coming up. I think everyone has a great time here today. Netball locally is probably one of the biggest sports and this is an important part of the fabric of our community. A great mate of mine and Tony, John Alexander, he's local member of parliament but in his time he was also a really good tennis player and when I talked to John about how do we get the next great sporting stars in Australia he always says it's not about investing in the Australian Institute of Sport, it's not about investing in elite sport, it's about investing in grass roots community sport, junior sport and I'm really excited to be doing that today and if we're fortunate enough to form the next Government. Can I also say thank you to Greg and Shirley for having us out here. Shirley is a local icon. These netball courts are named afrd her. It was between working with these community groups that we were able to deliver this outcome. Thank you so much.I've just got another little observation to make and I'll take one or two questions afterwards. Look, Mr Rudd has refused to rule out doing deals with the Greens over preferences, he's refused to rule out trying to form a minority government, with the Greens. Now if we want strong and stable government we've got to vote for a Liberal National candidate because all Mr Rudd is offering is more deals with the Greens, more concessions to a political party which is on the economic fringe and what's clear from Mr Rudd's esays vasive and hesitant answers today is that where Kevin Rudd is concerned Green means go. Where Kevin Rudd is concerned green means go. The Labor Party is hoping to sneak back into office through doing deals with the Greens on preferences and coming into an arrangement with the Greens on power sharing as part of a minority government. Well, it's just not good enough. Mr Rudd's own Treasurer said in his book, released just a few weeks ago, that Labor would govern alone or not a few weeks ago, that would govern alone or not at
all. All would govern alone or not all. All of that has now been junked. All all. All of that has junked. All of that has now junked. been junked junked. All of that has been junked yet again Mr Rudd
is junked. All of that has now
been is prepared to sell the Labor Party to the Greens is prepared to sell the soul of the Labor in order the Labor Party to the in order to realise his own in order to realise ambition.Mr Rudd said your comments yesterday about Fiona Scott are a little odd and that a male employer would not have said the same thing about a female employer, do you agree with that?Well look, you know, I'll leave Mr Rudd to hyperventilate. I think I've more than addressed that issue.Do you think that gay marriage is the fashion of the moment?Look, I certainly think it's a very significant issue. It's a very significant issue and I know that there are people in my own party room who have strong feelings on both sides of this issue. It is an important issue. It's not the only important issue and the priority of a Coalition Government, should we win the election, will be addressing bread and butter issues. How do we make people's jobs more secure, how do we reduce the pressure on people's cost of living, how do we strengthen our borders, getting the Budget under control, these are the issues which will be at the very forefront of the concerns of an incoming Coalition government.Agrees that he won't do a deal with the Greens form a minority government, we then have the situation where both men running for the prime ministership of the country are saying they won't form minority government, are we heading, if it is a close vote, to a constitutional crisis and another election? Do you think people really want two elections?What people want, what people want is an end to the kind of betrayals, the kind of double crossings which we've seen over the last 3 years. As I travel around our country talking to people the one thing they say to me is please, please, please, we can't have 3, or
another 3 years like the last 3, or even like the last 6 but particularly like the last 3. That's why I've made a very clear commitment. I am not going to form a minority government. My absolute determination is to offer the people of and stable majority government with and stable with a strong and united team. Mr Rudd just wants to with a strong and united Mr Rudd just wants to give us more of the same. Mr Rudd is more of the same. deals
not prepared to rule out doing deals with economic fringe dwellers that won't build up our country but will prolong his time in the lodge and frankly I say to Mr Rudd this is a test of your leadership. Are you man enough to say to the Greens I'm going to put you last? That's the test for Mr Rudd. Are you man enough to say to the Greens I'm going to put you last and I'm going to try and win this election in my own right as a leader of the Labor Party.OK, so that was the Opposition Leader Tony Abbott. That was held a short time ago in ka - Caboolture just north of Brisbane. The local member is Wyatt Roy, in the seat of Longman and holds it with a margin of around 2%. The Opposition Leader Tony Abbott has told the Liberal Party to put the Greens last on how to vote cards and he's challenged Kevin Rudd to do the same. Mr Abbott says he doesn't want to lead a minority government. This has hampered Greens' Deputy Leader, Adam Bandt's reelection in the seat of Melbourne. Adam Bandt said he took the deal as a compliment.We must be doing something right here in Melbourne. It appears that Labor and Tony Abbott have struck a preference deal in an attempt to unseat the Greens from the seat of Melbourne. Well it won't work. From day one the Greens have said that we will hold the seat of Melbourne in our own right, that's our goal, and not to have to rely on preferences from any other party. To win the seat of Melbourne in our small
own right we only need here a small increets - increase in our primary vote. We got 36% last time, that was off the back of a 13% swick - swing as people in Melbourne made hisly by voting for the Greens. With a swing somewhere in the order of about 5%, so just over a third of what we got last time, we will be able to hold the seat of Melbourne in our own right.The Greens Adam Bandt speaking there in Melbourne just in the last hour or so. And the PM Kevin Rudd has been in Cairns if Far North Queensland today announcing Labor's commitment to build more trades training centres, among other things.One of the first undertakings I gave way back then as Leader of the Opposition was to build trades training centres across Australia. It's part of building the country's future. These things don't just appear out of thin air. They are here because governments decided to make them happen. And I'm proud of each and every one of these I've seen around the country and I'm doubly proud when I look in the eyes of the young people who are uplifted by places like this, the state-of-the-art equipment they have and an opportunity to carve out their own futures. That's why across the nation today we are announcing that training centres
the total number of trades training centres that we are having nationally will now rise to more than 500. There is something like 120 new trades training centres being announced right across Australia. A Meteorology Australia. A new Bureau of
Meteorology initiative, some $55.8 million with one focus - to $55.8 million with focus $55.8 million with one central
focus - to better predict, better analyse and better get
information out better analyse and better get information out about natural
disasters.They've only been here for a trial disasters.They've here for a trial up until now. China here for China Southern have now indicated they will commit to is to provide a direct seasonal services to Far North Queensland in the future and we should be seeing one of their first aircrafts arrive for a trial here fairly soon.PM Kevin Rudd talking there in Cairns a little earlier today. The National Party's campaign has moved into has moved into the outback electorate of Lingiari in the Northern Territory. Roads and problems with the live cattle trail are on the agenda.In many ways the Stuart Highway is the centre of the electorate of Lingiari. Right along this road from here in Katharine down south to Alice Springs there is still quite a lot of anger over the Federal Government's decision to suspend live cattle exports to Indonesia. The Coalition is hoping to turn that anger into votes and take this seat for the very first time. The Nationals leader Warren Truss has visited several businesses in Katharine and will today visit two large cattle stations in the Top End.The Northern Territory is a very important part of this election campaign and not only does this region contribute significantly to our seats here
national economy but there are seats here we need to hold and we hope to win Lingiari.Later on the Nationals campaign will move to visit several towns in the Kimberley move to WA. Warren Truss will Kimberley which are part of the enormous electorate of Durack. In the west the Nationals aren't part of any official Coalition. They think they can win Durack from the Liberals and take a Senate spot from the Greens and boost their influence inside the Coalition.James Glenday reporting from Katharine. Essendon coach James Hird says he finds it hard to believe he's facing charges from the AFL on the basis of an interim anti-doping report. The AFL says it's an ongoing investigation and further charges could be laid. Tony Nichols reports.Well the Essendon Football Club has remained defiant in the face of these charges making it very clear in a video statement on the club's website last night just moment s after the charges were laid and aired to the public via AFL House and the AFL's general counsel, Andrew Dillon, that the club would seek natural justice and seek to overturn these charges of bringing the game into disrepute. Essendon's chairman Paul Little is adamant this club has not brought the game into disrepute and will seek to remedy the reputation s of the 4 officials who have been charged. The Essendon coach James Hird left his house a bit earlier today and in his own words is absolutely shattered.Yeah, shattered that I could be charged for bringing the game into disrepute that I love and cherish and respect so much. Yeah, it is terribly disappointing I've been charged for that, the club and Auld of us.So where do you go from now?I think we have a look at our options. We're obviously going to defend ourselves vigorously. We're going to contend the charges, we're going to make sure we're proven not guilty.The Essendon Football Club and the 4 officials charged now have 12 days to prepare their case before an AFL Commission hearing on August 26. But it's legal
already been argued here in legal circles in Melbourne this morning that the QCs representing the Essendon Football Club and also coach James Hird could argue at that commission meeting that the commission has a conflict of interest in hearing this matter seeing that it's been privy to the ASADA investigation all along and may indeed call for an independent body to review the case. Either way, the doping stream of the ASADA investigation does continue and whilst there's no evidence right now to any breaches or violations of the anti-doping code here by the players with the current evidence was to come to light in the future that situation could change.I note the investigation into Essendon's 2011, 2012 supplements program by ASADA and the AFL remains open and could lead to further charges under the AFL rules against other individuals. Infraction notices under the AFL anti-doping code against individual Essendon players or other persons could also result if further information comes to hand.Still in the AFL and sacked Brisbane Lions coach Michael Voss has held a media conference just in the last hour or so. Voss captained the Lions premierships and he's coached the club for premierships and he's the club for the past 4 years.Not to offer Michael a years.Not contract extension was made after years.Not to offer Michael a after a robust, thorough contract extension was made comprehensive process. after a robust, comprehensive process. The
board resolved after a robust, thorough and
comprehensive process. board resolved that a fresh board the club approach was required to ensure the club reached the next level.Many highs, many level.Many highs, many lows, probably experienced what's equivalent probably equivalent of probably 3 recessions in our time here which is a fair bit of time and fair bit of experience. And I wouldn't change it for anything.Michael Voss there. Australia's cricket coach Darren Lehmann has warned his batsmen they could be playing for their careers in the 5th Ashes Test at The Oval. Lehmann said Australia choked in its 74-run loss in the 4th Test.1/150 we were cruising, weren't we? They bowled quite well but similar - some of the shot selection was poor, back up and play better brand of cricket and learn from our mistakes. We didn't learn from probably Trent Bridge when we got bowled out similar circumstances. So from our point of view the blokes have got sto learn, if they don't learn we'll find blokes that will.Australia leads by 83 runs at stumps on day 3 in the women's Ashes Test. The Southern Stars are 1/64 in their second innings after Di missing England for 314. Erin Osborn was the pick of the bowlers taking 4/67.Animal welfare groups are calling for a new push to ban puppy farms in Queensland. The Bligh Government was poised to clamp down on unregistered breeders before it lost power and the current Government is being asked to revive the plans.Raids on puppy farms have revealed shocking scenes of animal cruelty. But many other unethical breeders haven't been caught.Puppy farming is an abhorrent industry, make no mistake, it is just hideous.The the RSPCA said the dogs are often sold online, hiding the conditions they were bred in.People are paying thousands of dollars to these fraudulent breeders rather than good quality breeders registered.The State Opposition said the Government should revisit proposed legislation which Labor planned to implement in 2012.What we want to see are these puppy farms monitored, we want to make sure that the breeding dogs are microchiped and we want to make sure RSPCA estimates there are about 100 RSPCA estimates there 100 puppy farms across Queensland with many of those in isolated rural areas away from scrutiny.Breeders who are doing the right thing say the practice could be difficult to stamp out.And they worry that new regulations could increase costs.Most of us are pensioners and it's a hobby and we don't certainly make much money out of it.The Government says there are already tough penalties for animal cruelty and specific puppy farm laws aren't necessary.Now for a look at tomorrow's weather here is Vanessa O'Hanlon.Jet stream cloud over central Australia not causing any rain. However we've got this very quick-moving cold front over the south-east with damaging winds across Victoria and also into the southern parts of NSW, Tasmania also experiencing rainfalls from this system. There's flood warnings across the northern parts of Tasmania, also affecting the lower Derwent and the Huon and also across the north-eastern parts of Victoria. We can see it is a very quick-moving system with those very gusty winds. Behind it a westerly air stream. This will remain with us tomorrow but the rain moving away from that region. Another frontal system will affect WA's south-west so rain on the way tomorrow and also very windy conditions with that.

The top stories today - the Opposition Leader Tony Abbott says the Coalition will preference Labor ahead of the Greens in all Lower House seats. It's designed to avoid the September 7 election resulting in a minority government. Meanwhile Kevin Rudd says Mr Abbott must level with the Australian people on his proposed Budget cuts. He's also announced the next stage of Labor's trades training centres program.Essendon coach James Hird says he's shattered by the AFL's decision to charge the club over the Bombers' supplements program. Mr Hird and 3 other officials have also been charged with bringing the game into disrepute as part of an ongoing anti-doping investigation by the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority. The chairman says the club will fight the charges.A man has died and 3 other people are in hospital after a fire tore through a house in Sydney's south early this morning. A man and a woman both in their 20s managed to escape from the Engadine house and raise the alarm. Paramedic s tried to resuscitate the 65-year-old man but he could not be revived.Israel has released 26 Palestinian prisoners as a prelude to the resumption of Middle East peace talks. The prisoners have been taken to West
their homes in Gaza and the West Bank but the move has sparked protests in Israel.The major parties are raising the stakes to ensure Australia doesn't end up with another hung parliament or minority government. Tony Abbott has declared the Liberal Party will encourage voters to put the Greens last when they number the challenging Kevin Rudd to do
the same. challenging Kevin Rudd to the same. He won't but he does rule out any negotiation the same. He won't but rule out any negotiation or
alliance with the rule out cross-benchers if there is a hung parliament. From Canberra Melissa Clarke reports.Getting some dad and daughter time on the campaign trail and getting some frank feedback.Look, as the kids suggested to me I had a dad moment.A daggy dad moment maybe, yeah.Critics have put the boot into Tony Abbott for his thoughts about candidate Fiona Scott.A bit of sex appeal.After remaining silent on the issue yesterday the PM today likened it to workplace harassmentIf any male employer stood up in a workplace anywhere in Australia and pointing to a female staff member said this person is a good staff member because they've got sex appeal, I think people would scratch their heads at least and I think the employer would be finding themselves in serious strife.But Tony Abbott is already moving on to the next step in the election - preference deals.I have today instructed the Liberal Party organisation right around Australia that we should put the Greens last.Boosting Labor's chance of winning back sole
the seat of Melbourne from the sole Greens MP Adam Bandt.The last thing that you the people want is another hung parliament and another minority government.It's no wonder Tony Abbott feels threatened by one Green. Imagine what you could do if we had 10 Greens in the House of Representatives. So I say that it's the best message yet to the whole country that if you want effective members of parliament vote
driving progressive change then vote Green.Both Kevin Rudd and government with a clear majority. The Opposition Leader says he won't majority. The Opposition says he won't lead a minority government. But the PM is a little more equivocal. He says he won't sign any formal deals with minor parties or Independents as Julia Gillard did, but he is leaving open the option of governing with their support, if voters deliver another hung parliament.And during the election campaign our political editor Lyndal Curtis is having a daily chat with a few insiders. Let's go to Lyndal now.Thank you, Joe. We're joined now by former Greens staffer Tim Hollow and former National staffer Tom Chessan.Tony Abbott has done as the Liberals in Victoria did during the last State election saying they will preference the Greens last. What impact will this have on the Greens vote and your bid from more Lower House seats?Don't think anyone in the least surprised by this. Adam Brandt has been a popular and high profile member and I think his chances of retaining the seat of Melbourne are very good indeed. And he's been planning all along, as I said, this isn't is a surprise, he's been planning all along to attempt to win the seat in his own right. I suspect that he will do so. In terms of other seats again, the real impact of this is yet to be seen in terms of whether it will actually make people sit up and think, you know what, Tony Abbott's actually dead right about one thing and that is that the Greens stand for something completely different, from either of the other two major parties and, you know, Tony Windsor's come out earlier today and said it's just different management of essentially the same company, the Coles and Woolworths, if you like, of politics. I suspect that more people will be looking at this decision and thinking, you know, we'll give the Greens a go.Tom, what message do you think this sends to voters, particularly the voters that the Coalition is trying to win over, not necessarily the ones they already - who already support them?I think it sends a very strong message that the Coalition Government is not going to do deals with the minority and see us go back into a minority government. I think probably one of the key issues is that the Labor Party cannot win this without the Greens' preferences. We know that their primary vote has been languishing and probably one of the more interesting debates about of all of this will be where does the Labor Party put its preferences in the Senate? For example, they could end up electing Bob Katter, you know, a far right-wing type candidate in the Senate in Queensland if they preference Katter above the Greens. So I think there will be some very interesting conversations going on around that.But the Senate preferences are always interesting because the people the parties preference they don't always necessarily mean the outcome of someone getting in and that's true from preferences for both major parties, isn't it?It is quite often you get people with quite often you 0.0% of quite often you get people 0.0% of the primary votes get elected into parliament so it throws up some interesting results.Tim, is it actually more interesting the way to look at the way the preference flows are going in the Senate because in the Senate you have deals
to legally produce preference deals because of the above the line voting?That's right. You are legally obliged to provide preference deals and I don't know obviously the state of those but as Tom just referenced, recall 2 elections ago or what is it, 3 elections go now, Labor ended up preferences Family First above the Greens and electing Steve Fielding in the Senate at a time they won government and difficult
they then had a much more difficult in time in government dealing with Steve Fielding, the Greens and Nick Xenephon. They could be making a serious mistake if they choose to go down that path again.We might look at the issue of another minority government. Both the PM and the Opposition Leader have said they would not strike a deal with Independents or minor parties. This follows Mr Abbott's promise this morning not to preference the Greens.This is my captain's call and I say to Mr Rudd, be man enough to do the same. The last thing that you, the people want is another hung parliament and another minority government.All preference matters are handled by the national secretary of our party and I'm not aware of what agreements have been reached and frankly, I intend to just also be
leave it all to them. Let me also be very plain about this, that we'll be not entering into any Coalition agreements, we won't be having any negotiated agreement s, we won't have any deals.They have moved so far right I'm not in the least bit surprised that right I'm surprised that you've got this kind of collusion going on between the Liberal and Labor Parties to do in the Greens.Now, Tom, the Liberal Party are always in coalition, Greens.Now, Tom, the Liberal
aren't they?They are with the National Party, not always, sometimes we - there are some differences. But look, I think it is interesting that the Greens are arguing that a Labor Party and the Greens aren't or have never sort of been in a coalition and that they're sort of party that's swinging to the right because they have been in coalition for pretty well the last 3 years.But it's not the formal coalition arrangement that the Nationals have with the Liberal Party, is it? It was an agreement to support Labor in government?It was but when you start looking at it the Labor Party cannot win in its own right, it cannot win elections without the Greens' preferences unless something changes dramatically. So I think there always will be a marriage of convenience between the two and obviously they will be fighting for that sort of far left vote and, you know, I guess this is just what we see during elections is parties positions themselves.Tim, both major parties are in this election saying they want majority government, is this just another way to sell that message say with Tony Abbott saying he won't do deals, he won't lead a minority government and Kevin Rudd saying he won't make formal agreements on minority government?I think that's what they're trying to say and I think what a lot of people will hear is 2, you know, rather boring and not particularly trust worthy men saying if I'm not getting a majority I'm going to take my bat and ball and go home. If that's the case maybe the Governor-General should commission to be PM if the others don't want it.Tony Abbott this week was promising funding for mobile phone black spots. It brings up the question of mobile technology in rural areas more generally. That's something that's always an issue because of the distances that have to be travelled in terms of laying the infrastructure.And certainly within agricultural farmers, food producers, we probably are the best users of new technology. We have the greatest take up of new technology of any industry and mobile black spots are a real issue. As we go towards telemetrics, remote sensing of water needs in the crops it's going to be - it's something that we're looking forward to and I'm sure there will be lots of communities sticking their hand out for that 100 million.And Tim, there's a lot of talk particularly about the NBN in capital city areas and what people in regional areas get. Do you think that regional areas are well served by governments on these sorts of issues?Look, generally absolutely not. I think it's clear and, you know, one of the great outcomes of this last Parliament, which the conservative parties have been trying to tear down is the role of the rural Independents and the Greens in pushing, you Knowe rural mental health and rural health generally and technology in the bush and support for farmers and farming communities removing to renewable energy has been one of the great successes of this Parliament but there's a lot more to do.On that note thank you very much for your time.Thank you.Now Tony Abbott this morning gave a radio interview where he repeated his position that he does not support same-sex marriage. He says he doesn't believe that now is pursue believe that now is the time to
pursue the issue. He was asked about the pursue the issue. He was about the question of tra - tradition and same-sex saying that we had to be conscious of the fact tradition and same-sex marriage
saying that we conscious of the fact that all
products of society are shaped by us, that not saying the culture and traditions are perfect but his idea is to build on strength. He supports evolutionary change, he's not someone who wants to see radical change based on the radical change based fashion of the moment. To get reaction to his comments I spoke a short time ago to the Deputy PM Anthony Albanese.Anthony Albanese, welcome to ABC new us 24. Tony Abbott has said -Good to be with you again, Lyndal.Tony Abbott has said today about same-sex marriage and about traditional generally that he supports evolutionary change not radical change based on the fashion of the moment. Isn't
evolution the way most change comes about?Well, this is an extraordinary comment and an insight, once again, into Tony Abbott's character and an insight into why Tony Abbott is so scripted and won't go on ABC programs in particular where he will get asked questions in depth without just reading from a prepared script. I mean to define sexual or-Jen taition as fashion of the moment will be deeply offensive to many Australians particularly families as well as individuals who happen to be gay or lesbian.Couldn't you also interpret his comments of saying that to change a tradition it is his view that you need evolutionary rather than change based on
something that might be popular at that point in time?It is fair to have a look at what Tony Abbott's comments actually are and the interep interpretation of them is clear. It will be deeply offensive to those people who understand, as most people do, that people's sexual orientation is just the way that they are. They're just other human beings who happen to be in love or in relationships with people of the same gender. Now, in terms of Tony Abbott, whenever he goes off script, whenever he is unscripted and just talking about issues we have these issues. We had one yesterday when it came to gender, today we have one when it comes to sexual preference. It is no wonder that Tony Abbott and his minders keep him away from serious scrutiny and serious interviews. Now Tony Abbott really has to be in a situation as the PM in 2013, he wants to hold that position. What he needs to do is to reflect modern Australian values in 2013 rather than values that may have had a place in the past but really don't sit with modern Australia.But isn't the question of same-sex marriage different to the question of sexual orientation? He said in the same interview the last thing he wants to see is discrimination against anyone based on religion, gender or sexuality. So he's not necessarily - you can't say definitely that he was talking about sexual orientation, he was talking about the issue of same-sex marriage, aren't they different?He stated very clearly, to quote him, he said, "I'm not someone who wants to see radical change based on the fashion of the moment." What this is is one, it's not radical change, it's not talking about changing the rights that existing heterosexual couples have, it's not interfering with anyone's existing marriage rights, it's not interfering with the rights of churches to engage in traditional marriage between men and women only if nah is their view. It's simply saying that where people love each other, are in a loving relationship, they should have the same rights as others. So it's an extension of rights and an extension indeed of the recognition by society of, in a secular way, of the importance of stable relationships. And describe it as a fashion describe it as statement is, I think, statement is, I think, just out of touch with modern Australia.There would be your own people who on the issue of whether it is the right time to say yes to same-sex marriage, wouldn't there?Yes, there are and I respect different people's views on this. But it's the use of the term fashion statement that will cause such concern. One of the reasons, this isn't just about a symbol. It's also about the fact that many people, particularly young people are going through issues of discovering who they are, what their sexual orientation are. Can suffer from a whole range of issues in terms of mental health issues and issues of struggling with these issues of their sexuality. What we need is for leaders to be comfortable with acknowledging who people are and that's really important.If I could ask you a question about preferences. Tony Abbott says the Liberals will put the Greens last. In your own words you have said on the Greens they have a parasitic relationship with Labor, fail when it comes to substance and are on the fringe of the political system. Are you going to preference them ahead of the Liberals?Look, I'll make those decisions locally according to what my community want. The fact come up with this position in my come up my seat after it's been published polling showing the Liberals in fact are finishing second, the Greens are finishing third and so the Liberal preferences won't be counted. We'll make our decisions as a political party on the basis of discussions on a seat by seat basis. What we will do though, and we've made this very clear, is that we're after a majority Labor Government and we will not be entering into an alliance, a Coalition, whatever you want to call it, with any other political party. We will be promoting our policies in government, we want to be a majority government, that's why I've been here this morning, indeed campaigning in the electorate of Denison with Jane Austin, the Labor candidate.Anthony Albanese, thank you very much for your time.Good to be with you, Lyndal.OK, the Opposition education spokesman Christopher Pyne has just started a media conference in the last 5 minutes or so. He wanted to take the PM to task on his commitments to trade training centres. We heard from the PM Kevin Rudd a little earlier today up in Cairns. Let's take it from the top, this is Christopher Pyne speaking in the last few minutes from Adelaide.A few subjects today, the first of those is Mr Rudd's announcement that he wants to have his cake and eat it too when it comes to Green preferences. Mr Rudd would have us believe that he will not negotiate for a minority government should there be another hung parliament after this election. But he won't do the courageous thing that Tony Abbott has done and insist that his party put the Greens behind the Liberal Party. So Kevin Rudd wants to have his cake and eat it too. He wants Green preferences but he wants people to think that he's all Mr Tough guy. The problem with Kevin Rudd is that he's all talk and he's no action and there's no clearer example than the fact that on the issue of Greens preferences he's all talk, he says that he won't negotiate for a minority government but he won't take the necessary action to ensure that the Greens do not have a presence in the next parliament. So Kevin Rudd wants people to believe one thing while he does another and so many times we've seen this with Kevin Rudd over the last 6 or 7 years that he's been in public life. He routinely says one thing and then does another. I'll give you another example. Today he's announced 137 new trades training centres at a cost per centre of $1.1 million. The only problem is that the trade training centres that they've built over the last 6 years have cost on average about $3.4 million. So the public will never see 137 trade training centres at the price tag of $200 million. piece with his $200 million. And this is of a piece with his promise in 2007 piece with his promise in that he'd build 2,650 trade training centres. Six years later the Government's built 250. Today he wants people to believe that he will build another 137 at one-third of the price that it's cost him over the last few years and this from a government that in last year's Budget abolished all funding for the trade training centres. So you can't believe Mr Rudd's promise today because it goes into the same basket as every other promise that Kevin Rudd has made. And I'll give you a third example. Today he said that Mr Abbott should answer questions about his remark yesterday about Fiona Scott by saying that if that happened in the workplace it could cause difficulties for Mr Abbott. Here is a man lecturing Mr Abbott about workplace relations when we have video evidence proof of how Kevin Rudd treats his staff because it was helpfully leaked during one of the many leadership crises in the Labor Party over the last 3 years, leaked out of the PM's office, his expletive-laden video with the way he was talking to his staff. This is a man who had a record
massive turnover, probably a record turnover of staff during his prime ministerial period and famously made an air hostess on an Air Force 1 jet cry because he didn't have the right meal he special choice. So Mr Rudd's hypocrisy is on display for everyone to see. He wants the chaos and dysfunction of the last 3 years to continue because Labor will preference the Greens when the Liberals will not. And finally, the Senator Lin Thorpe from Tasmania has let the cat out of the bag in Tasmania today. She's given everyone a peek up Mr Kevin Rudd's sleeve about what they plan to do after the election. The PNG solution will be altered. The caucus will demand changes to the PNG solution. We know that because Senator Thorpe has said so. And Kevin Rudd needs to explain exactly what changes the Government is planning to the PNG solution straight after the election. He's saying one thing before the election, he will do another thing after the election and the Australian of
public are well and truly tired of Mr Rudd's all talk and no action approach.Is Kevin Rudd right though about the sex appeal comment? Would Tony Abbott be in trouble if he tried that on in the workplace?No, of course he's not and Kevin Rudd is just trying to kick a long an issue to distract the public from the real issues in this election which is job security, border protection, the cost of living and economic management. Kevin Rudd will do anything to try to distract people from the Government's record because he can't run on their record. The problem with Kevin Rudd's campaign is he's looking increasingly rattled and desperate. He has a scare campaign a day, a Labor lie a day and he tries to grab any flotsam and jet some floating past to get their minds off the cost of living is higher, their jobs are insecure, the bords are insecure and the economic management of the government has been nothing short of the joke.Is it appropriate to say that sort of Ning in the workplace?I think people shouldn't overreact to an exuberant remark from Tony Abbott. I think it is a very public
minor issue and the Australian public are much more interested in which political party will reduce their burden on the cost of living, who will secure their jobs. Like, for example, the Coalition scrapping the increase to the fringe benefits tax which is hurting the car industry as we speak. $1.8 billion hit on the industry. These are the real issues in the campaign and Kevin Rudd is in no position to lecture anybody. Anyone who wants to watch his expletive-laden video will get a very good idea of how he treats his staff.Do you feel comfortable using that sort of language to discuss colleagues?I wish people would describe me as having sex appeal but they don't. I think we're taking it all far too description
seriously.What about your description of your colleague, would you feel comfortable making that sort of comment about a colleague?I think it's an extreme distraction from the important issues of the day. How I talk to my colleagues is a matter colleagues. Quite frankly I I think if this is the most important issue of the day Mr Rudd has lost sight of the fact that this is an election about the future of the country. It's an election about whether people want more from the same from Labor. In they want the next 3 years to be like the last 3 years or whether they want a Coalition government in power that knows how to live within its means, knows how to stop the boats, knows how to reduce the cost of living burden by abolishing the carbon tax, secure people's jobs by abolishing the mining tax. They are the key issues and Kevin Rudd will do anything to try and distract people from those because Labor has no sell on them.Just on the Greens sell on Greens preference deal, is the aim to wipe out the Greens preference deal, aim to wipe out the Greens?I
think aim to wipe out the think the Greens are a very damaging think the Greens are a damaging influence in our polity damaging influence in polity because they have destroyed the economy in Tasmania with 20 years of government there in Coalition with the Labor Party. And the last 3 years we've seen what it means for the Greens to be in government at the federal level. Confidence is the lowest it's been in generations, investment is drying up, unemployment is starting to nudge 800,000, we have close to $400 billion of deficit. In the last 10 weeks the Budget has blown out by a further $30 billion, that's $3 billion a week. That is what happens under a Green/Labor government. We've seen dysfunction, chaos, division and it's time to put an end to that so the Liberal Party has made it very clear that we will not preference the Greens ahead of the Labor Party. If Mr Rudd had any guts, which he doesn't do, that's why he undermined Julia Gillard from behind closed doors for most of the 3 years rather than coming out and actually challenging her, if he had guts he would say that Labor
will put the Greens last as

well.Is there an element to this deal where Labor has agreed to preference this agreed to preference the
Liberals over the this deal where Labor has
agreed Liberals over the Nationals in 3-cornered contests?I don't have the faintest clue.You aren't aware of any arrangement particularly in the seat of Mallee?No.Would you be surprised if that was the quais?I don't deal with the preference discussions as they occur. Nominations close this Friday. The preferences in Sturt will be my focus on Friday but I'm very pleased that the Liberal Party has shown that it has the courage of its conviction s by putting the Greens behind Labor. Unfortunately Mr Rudd wants to have his cake and eat it too. He wants to be able to pretend that he's being tough while in fact he is sneakily going behind the curtain and doing deals with the Greens on preferences in order to keep the Liberals out of power.Talking about the campaign in Sturt, is or has Monica O'Shea been volunteering on your campaign?Monica O'Shea is a volunteer of mine, and I'm very proud of her.Were you aware of the pictures taken of her allege edly removing signs of your opponent around the electorate?I couldn't help but seal them because they're on the news.Do you think that activity is appropriate?That's a matter for Monica. I understand it's been dealt with. I'm absolutely confident that no wrong doing occurred and I'm embarrassed for the Labor Party that they have pursued an election volunteer over such a minor matter which they know to be a minor matter.Will you call for an apology from the Labor Party over the issue with Andrew Southcott. What is your understanding of what happened in those photographs?I understanding with what happened with Mr Picton is he tweeted bald faced lies about Andrew Southcott which is an entirely different ofair - affair.What happened with Ms O'Shea, I'm sure you sought an ex-plan yition?I did and I'm confident there was no wrong doing occurred.That was the Opposition's education spokesman Christopher Pyne speaking in Adelaide taking the PM to task over Labor's commitments to trade training centres. The PM, Mr Rudd, said earlier today that Labor would spend $210 million on 137 new trade training centres if a Labor government was elected on September 7. Stay with us on ABC News 24 as we bring you the very latest on the day's top stories right throughout your afternoon.

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