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Good morning and welcome to ABC News Breakfast. It's Friday, 26 July, I'm Michael RowlandAnd I eeflt h I'm Beverley O'Connor and these are the top stories today - the terrifying moment of Spain's train disaster - was speed to blame?

Doubts raised about Tony Abbott's plan to send in the military to combat people smuggling.You have to be careful about dragging the Defence Force into situation of great party political controversy.And the world's largest fraud case in history.This time of type of crime is the cutting edge of financial fraud.And Japan beats the Socceroos in the east Asian Cup.

Own open

Ooh ooh

.Video footage has emerged of a train as it came around the bend. The train's driver is now being investigated amid reports search for survivors has now he was travel ing too search for survivors has ended. Spain's PM has ended. the ended. Spain's PM has visited
the crash site three days of national the crash site and declared mourning.
TRANSLATION: I three days of national TRANSLATION: I want to say that TRANSLATION: in this moment two investigations are being carried out. One carried out. One is the judicial investigation and the other carried out. One is other one is by the commission judicial investigation and of investigation of other one is by the of investigation of train
accidents which of investigation accidents which depends on the Minister accidents Minister of public works. The aim is to know the Minister of public works. aim is to know the cause of aim is to know this terrible aim is to know the cause accurately and as soon this accurately and as possible.In other news seeker policy is possible.In other spot light possible.In other news asylum
seeker policy spot light this morning. The Defence seeker policy is again on the
spot light Defence Association is
concerned about Tony spot light this morning. The Defence concerned about Tony Abbott's
military response Defence Association is
concerned about Tony military response to the
problem. The Opposition wants to appoint a 3-star general to take charge of border protection. The Defence Association's Neil James says should
that would militarise what should be a civil responsibility. And the Human Rights Commission is questioning the Government's deal with Papua New Guinea, saying it risks breaching Australia's legal obligations.US prosecutors have launched what they say is the count rir's biggest ever credit card hacking case. Five men from Russia and Ukraine has been charged with running the operation. They allegedly stole more than 160 million credit and debit card numbers from several US companies over seven years. Victims include naz - Nasdaq, visa and Dow Jones. The men stole around $300 million.In Tunisia, thousand of people have taken to the streets to protest against the assassination of an opposition politician. Mohamed Brahmi was shot dead outside his home in the capital, Tunis.He's the second Opposition party leader to be killed this year. There have been deep divisions between Islamist and their secular opponents since the 2010 revolution. United Nations Secretary-General Ban Ki-moon says more than 100,000 people have now died in Syria's civil war. He has been holding talks with US Secretary of State John Kerry as part of new efforts to convene a peace conference. In the latest violence, a car bomb in the capital, Damascus, has left at least seven people dead and more than 60 wounded. Child health experts want the law to be changed to ban parents from smack children. Children who are smack are physically punished are more likely to suffer mental health issues like depression. Studies show more Australian parents still smack their children but attitudes are parents still changing.A children but attitudes changing.A quick look at finance -

Let's get more on the debate over asylum seeker policies. Let's go straight to Parliament House in Canberra. Kerrin Binnie join s us from this there this morning. There about the
are more concerns being raised about the Government's plan for offshore detention .There is. There's a criticism again comes from - coming from the Australian Human Rights Commission, it's raised concerns about the conditions on Manus Island and also Nauru. These vg have been long held views but I guess they've been renewed, given the Federal Government's plan to send all asylum seekers arriving by boat after July 19 to PNG and specifically Manus Island. Now, the Human Rights Commissioner Gillian Triggs has expressed some reservation, some more concerns saying that she's describing the conditions as harsh and not up to international standards. This comes amid the possible expansion and likely expansion of that facility on Manus Island.There are questions as well being raised from within military ranks about what the Opposition is planning.That is right. This is around op raetionz Sovereign Boarders which was announced by the Shadow Immigration Minister Scott Morrison and the Opposition Leader Tony Abbott yesterday. An extension of their border protection policy, a three-star general will take control of all of the agencies having over arching role of 15 agencies including the Federal Police, immigration, department officials, the Customs and border protection and the Navy, all bringing together those involved in the operations off Christmas Island in north-west Australia.So the Australian Defence Association has raised concerns about it. Neil James from the Defence Association says that it could be in breach of the constitution.There is a difference both in practice and in constitutional principle. At the moment, border protection command is a military element assisting a civil authority with civil law enforcement. That is not what Jim's talking about. Jim is talking about putting a military leadership or command structure in over the top of that. So it wouldn't be a case of the Defence Force assisting the civil authority, it would be a case of a Defence Force element having the authority. These matters are intentionally controversial in party political terms and indeed in social terms in the Australian community. The Defence Force is an a political organisation. You have to be careful about dragging the Defence Force into a situations of great party political controversy because that's not why we have a Defence Force and it's not good for the Defence Force or the Defence Force's relationships with the wider society.So .So that was Neil James from the Australian Defence Association but on 'Lateline' last flight the Opposition's Immigration Minister Scott Morrison rejected the suggestion it can't work.I dismiss that. He's been on the record for many years being opposed to having the military involvement in - involved in civil activities. There is no change to what the military are doing on the grounds. Border protection command still operates in the same way.While this was happening if Immigration Minister Tony Burke account
has been getting a first hand account of conditions at those offshore processing detention centres?That is right. Hi spent a couple of hours on the ground on Manus Island yesterday, investigating and looking at the facilities. Of course over the past couple of days there have been allegation, some serious allegations of mistreatment of detainees at the centre .And so Tony Burke as on the ground to inspect for himself what was happening.Manus Island is likely to be massively expanded under this new regional resettlement program and he was confident yesterday that that can occur and that the conditions there can be upheld to the standard that is expected under human rights law.And now he's also heading over to Nauru where last weekend there were riots there and massive amounts of done to the buildings there. So
he will inspect done to the buildings he much.In the US, five men have been charged with a computer fraud conspiracy involving the theft fraud conspiracy involving theft of millions of credit and debit card number numbers. Stolen card data was uploaded to blank cards used by criminals to make cash withdrawals and purchases. Prosecutors are calling it the biggest hacking case in US history.The individuals charged and arrested in this case are the ones at the top, the ones who steal the data, that they sell to the folks who cash out.By arresting two of the key players and identifying three of the others, we believe we have taken a major step towards dismantling this organisation.North America correspondent Ben Knight joins us now from Washington. We are hear ing figures of $300 million, it sounds like a huge case.They're saying that is a conservative estimate, they don't know exactly how much was taken. There is no doubt this is a massive case and as you joust heard Paul Fishman saying there these aren't usually the guys they catch. Normally you get the ones carrying the fake credit cards who are either trying to use them in the shop or using the ATM machines to get the cash out. But in his press conference today he really seemed to have a grudging respect for the sheer cleverness and tenacity and patience of these alleges have been involved in this crime. He talked about how they would wait this crime. He talked they would wait month, they they would go to particular websites, find a company and start doing little probes into the websites, starting to start doing the websites, starting to look
for weaknesses start doing little probes into
the for weaknesses and this could take months. When they found a weakness that's when they would hand over to another member of the team who would send in malicious soft ware, that was the soft ware that enabled them to rip out, allegedly, all of these millions of credit card numbers. They didn't do anything with them themselves other than sell them on.AThere was another member of the team who was alleged to be the broker. He was would sell them on and it worked down the tree. In is no doubt this is a massive fraud in the country that this is the number one site for credit card skimming in the world and for very good reason.Why is the US such a target? Is it lax with regard to technology?It's just old technology, it is really quite stunning how backwards some of the particularly the financial technologies over in this country are.I remember I was being stunned when I first got here and everyone was saying can you pay me with a cheque and I doubt I don't think I've written a cheque in my life butt ice common here. It's the same thing with the credit card technology. They're using the magnetic strip and signature as the only verification. Everyone in Australia, everyone in Europe has this chip and pin, that chip that appears inside your credit card, it's a lot hard #20er do with that kind of technology but the United States simply doesn't vit. There's talk about going down that road but the banks are resisting, they're saying we would have to replace every machine in the country, which is true, but this is 2 country that's losing an estimated $1 billion a year. And it is a prime target. 80% of this kind of crime that happens outside of Europe happens inside the United States.It's just massive. So there's a lot of incentive for them to change but a lot of resistance as well.Let's move to another topic and the Bradley Manning trial continue s. What is the latest there?It's been closing arguments and this case of course Australian s will be well aware of. Bradley Manning, the man who was accused of leaking more than 700,000 sensitive classified American military documents to WikiLeaks. Today, the prosecution wrapped up its closing arguments and it was really quite scathing in its description of Bradley Manning, not just as someone who was the the defence has paintsed was well meaning but naive. No, they say this was a calculating name
man who wanted to make his own name and please Julian Assange, who is the founder of WikiLeaks. They really painted a picture of someone who was only out to serve his own purposes. So that is it. The prosecution has wrapped up. The case has wrapped up. It's now up to the military judge to make a decision. Bradley Manning decided he did not want to have a jury of his military peers and we're expecting that that sentence - sorry, that verdict will happen some time in the next week.The United Nations now says more than 100,000 people have been killed in Syria's civil war.Despite
the in Syria's civil the recent figures the United
States in Syria's civil war.Despite
the States says it doesn't intend to launch a military States says it doesn't intervention to end the to launch a fighting.There is no military solution to fighting.There is no solution to Syria.There is only a political solution. And that will require leadership in order to bring people to the table. Yesterday, I had a conversation with the Foreign Minister Lavrov of Russia. We remain committed to the effort to bring the parties to implement Geneva 2 to implement Geneva 1.That is John Kerry there. The top stories now on ABC News Breakfast - two investigations are under way this morning into a train de railment in Spain that's now killed at least 80 people. Graphic footage of the moment the train came off the tracks has emerged amid reports speed may be to blame for the crash.The Defence Association has raised sout doubts about the Coalition's plan to use the military to combat people smuggling. The association's director Neil James says the Defence Force shouldn't be dragged into what he says is a political controversy.And US authorities have uncovered what they say is the country's biggest ever hacking fraud case. They allege more than 160 million credit and debit card numbers were stolen from several companies including visa and Dow Jones.Let's take you to the front pages of the major newspapers around the country. The 'Australian' says the Government is on track to new
spends hundreds of millions on new facilities if boats continue to arrive at the current rites.The 'Canberra Times' focuses on the 'Australian' Defence Association's criticism of the Opposition's so-called Operation Sovereign Border s taskforce.The Government is facing a revenue shortfall of more than $20 billion over the next four year, according to the 'Financial Review'.The 'Mercury' covers the PM and the Opposition lead're's visit to Tasmania yesterday.The 'Courier Mail' is a warning from one of Queensland's most senior lawyers that killers could escape justice because there is not enough top prosecutors.'The Guardian Australia' reports on the investigation into the rail disaster in Spain.The 'Herald Sun' says differing #k9s of a phone call from AFL boss Andrew Demetriou has put a strain on the relationship between Essendon's coach James Hird and the club's President, David Evans.The story getting ugly the fallout
indeed. The 'Advertiser' covers the fallout from Stuart O'Grady's admission he took a performance enhancing drug.Drop in quarantine safeguards has left WA more exposed to a biosecurity disaster, the 'West Australian' has that warn ing that from a State Government wlbl.The Daily Telegraph looks at some of the past royals named and says Will and Kate's son could be the saviour of his name's sake.A name's sake.A little early for the crown to be on his head.A scalt water croc has been named Prince George -There's a crown Prince George -There's a for you!LAUGHTER from the sublime to the ridiculous.Imagine sending off a croc to the young prince. Can you imagine what the royal family would do with that.He is a 51cm salt water croc. He's been kept at crocco saurus cove in Darwin.And the egg was hatched about the time of the announcement of the pregnancy. He's going to be known as Croc George. They're not sending the croc over but send photos on its first birthday every year to jung Prince George.It will become his favourite animal, no doubt.Let's finish with another old croc, the the 'Age' celebrates the career of Mick Jagger who is turning 70 today!.Not the most flattering figure of Mick but then again he is 70.Now one thing is certain - if Kevin Rudd does not go and see - in fact we're going to bring you a bit of business activity statementdy's very strong - Barrie Cassidy's very strongly worded 'Drum' article. He looks at the options facing Kevin Rudd Kevin Rudd, the PM, in deciding whether to go for an August 31 election or to wait for possibly mid-September or wait longer into October and November. We can bring you some photographs now from that piece by Barrie.

Those are the dill dillemsa - dilemmas facing Kevin Rudd at the moment ahead of the electionHe has until Monday whether to decide to push the butt on August 31. It could be a very tense weekend for everyone involved in politics.Now, put you on the spot, do you smack your kids?Yes, I have smacked my kids when they were younger.Hard?What's hard?Not very hard.Just final resort.This could make me a criminal.It could. Because in fact there are some people who want smack of children outlawed completely, which is quite - we probably grew up being smacked.Yes.And then now people don't think it's the best way to go. In fact, a leading group of doctors is pushing to make it a criminal offence. So watch out, Michael. But I do think it's probably the severity and the level of physical abuse that doctors are concerned about. Obviously they would be seeing a lot of these kids coming through their surgeries.Susan Maloney argues that smacking could lead to mental health problems in kids, certainly could lead to more serious forms of abuse in some circumstances. She makes the point could be arrested point if you hit your dog you could be arrested but it's legal to hit your child. legal to hit your child. We protect children with pool fences an not smoking in cars, this is legislation which she argues would protected children from physical punishment.Which is one side of the argument. There are plenty of people involved in child health circles who would argue the other. We have a prominent psychologist quoted this morning as saying what are you going to do, set up smack police? It will be impossible to police. There are those that argue that smacking does, a gentle smacking if there is such a thing can set boundaries for kids to know what is right and wrong.If used as a last resort doesn't really come to harm. I think it probably would give doctors particularly if they saw and were suspecting some issues within a family to perhaps draw the parents attention to the fact that it is an issue. We would to hear your views on this issue to smack or not to smack.That is the question we would like you to discuss with us this morning. You can join the conversation on Breakfast.

Reply very quickly before we're hauled off by the smack police. Let's look at the national weather facing you today.

Let's go to the markets.

We were chatting earlier because there has been a rather significant milestone and who would have thought that Mick Jagger would still be making moves at the age of 70.Who would have thought he would be alive at 70 given what the Stones got up to in the the earlier years.Mick Jagger has cleaned up his act quite a lot and he does have a particular kind of move. It's unique.There's a great article if you can dig it out online in the 'Age' by Michael dwier. Repulsion has always been the attraction with MiG Jagger. Today Jagger turns 70 and he is a disgrace, obscenely rich, on knockous ly aloof, and still shake his butt on the 50th anniversary tour, scenes of which we are showing you now.He is sit cutting it and still drawing in the crowds. If people want to see him, I think a lot of women would not argue there's much repulsion about Mick Jagger, not one of them, but he is a phenomena. He has evolved along the way but some of his contemporaries got drug culture.If
in that drug and rock'n'roll culture.If I'm like that at 70 I would be happy.Would you like the sunken cheeks?No, not the sunken cheeks.He is a phenomena.And he has inspired so many musicians and so many front men over the years.There he is with -There he goes with that funny move on the tips of his toes.There's hen frememy, Keith Richards. Happy birth deday, Mick. Let's go to sport.Are you a Jagger fan?He looks alright. You'd love to have that energy at 70.You would. II am planning to be half that energetic at 40, if I can make it!.There's years away, though. Many years.We're going to work in a lot of sport and some drugs in sport this morning. But we will talk about that in a moment. Let's get you up to date with football news. Japan beat the Socceroos in the east Asian Cup last night. The match was played before a very small audience in Seoul. Let's look at the goals.

.Here come the Japanese again, can they find the angle for the shot? It is a beautiful goal and Japan There should be two and it There should be is. In the meantime There should be two other end it's is. In the other end it's a goal for Australia. It's fired into the back of the net.Mitch Duke, back of the net.Mitch well done.And it's a great finish from Mitch Duke., who has been close to Australia's best..

2-2!Two goals in two minutes for Australia, and parity is restored.Australia to have to keep their focus, it's 3-2, it is raining goals here.Australia were level for less than 60 seconds.We really bounced back into the game and the stewses paid off. But all in - substitutions paid off. All in all I have to give credit to the boys, the conditions were not easy, the humidity was high and we should never forget the purpose of our trip - to find new players. I am pretty confident that we are on a good way to identify a couple of new guys that will represent road.The coach there talking in particular about Mitch Duke and Tommy u rich. They were the play s impressed last night. When he is talking about down the road he means the Rio wuch.Let's look at the Essendon situation. I just want to play you the events of yesterday because there is now a rift it seems between the coach James Hird and the chairman David Evans. We will hear from David evaverns in a moment but firstly Peter Underwood will take us through the - Kelri Underwood.James Hird fronted up for another week and another twist in the supplements scandal. This time it surrounds a controversial phone call. AFL chief executive Andrew Demetriou spoke with Essendon chairman David Evans the night before the club went public with its concerns.I was at David's house that night Andrew made a call at some stage in that meeting. The contents of that call were discuss and think we have given our version or told the truth to ASADA and that will come out over time.Demetriou denies he acted inappropriately.The inference in this article is that the AFL tipped off Essendon before the investigation was announced because we didn't know who the club was. It's just simply untrue.What is known is that on Thursday, January 31, Demetriou was briefed for the first time by the Australian Crime Commission and told to keep the information confidential. Four days later, in response to inquiries from the media, Evans contacted dem denl to see if he knew anything about a doping investigation. The next day Essendon came forward, two days latter Crime Commission released its report.As David found out more and more things he rang me to tell me if I knew anymore and I didn't know.Did you tell him you had been briefed on 31 January by the Crime Commission?No because we were subject to confidentiality.Hird says he knows what was said during the phone call but refused to reveal the details.I think that I've told the truth to ASADA and other people have as well. That will come out over time.And there was a board meeting with Essendon last night and David Evans emerged from that after many hours h. Is what he had to say.I want to make this really clear.Tonight was a regular and scheduled monthly board meeting. In relation to media reports late this afternoon I am not standing down as chairman.And the board did not ask me to explain my version of events. This was a routine board meeting which we have spent considerable time implementing many of the recommendations from Ziggy Switkowski's report. Yes, we have some big issues ahead of us but we're all waiting the ASADA investigation to be completed. I am going to go off to dinner and it is not a farewell dinner.Let's go from one scandal to another and athletics is in the spot light again due to the recent some
positive tests for drug use by some key sprinters in the last couple of weeks. Now, there is a diamond league series at the next round is in London and there is Australian Sally Pearson is one of the poster athletes for that event. So is Valerie Adams we will hear from those in a moment. They're coming back to the stadium where they won gold medals and Sally Pearson was asked did very well in Sally Pearson was asked about
the positive Sally Pearson was the positive drug tests from
Sally Pearson was asked about
the positive the sprinters, one from the United States, one from the sprinters, one from Jamaica, and a United States, one Jamaica, and athletes from ja Jamaica, this is what she had to say.It's one of is what she one of those things I guess I don't really have an opinion about the l about. It's sad but at the same time it's good because people aren't getting away with it no matter who you away with it no matter who are, what your name is and how big your profile is, and it's as Kim said there definitely needs to be a lot move education in what is allowed and what is not. I think maybe these two were a victim of that, I am not sure.So I can't comment on the credibility of the sport. The true lovers of the sport will stick around and be there for us.So I guess you have to wait and see what happens at the worlds championships in the next four years, hopefully everything stays on the right path and the drug doping agencies will be doing their job efficiently.Sally Pearson there. Valerie Adams has had a very different experience. She was the world champion spot putter who went into the Olympics last year and was beaten by a drug cheat, who then tested pos forgive Bella Russ straight after the Games. So Valerie Adams is the out and out best shot putiner the world. She was robbed of her moment and this is her speaking very openly for it the first time 12 months later.Quite sad and depressed and a lot of emotions went through me but I think one thing is forgive her, never will. She's tainltsed the sport and our event.It's something that shouldn't have done. The worst thing for me is she took the moment away.That is probably what hurts the most is that at the time when I was crying tears of disappointment for my country, for myself, for my coach, this thing was crying crocodile tear s embracing a moment which shouldn't have been hers. I think that is what hurts the most. She took that away from me. No sympathy whatsoever. She can stay in Belarus forever.That is the face of someone who has been cheated.She's so right about that moment, she will become the Olympic champion but she will never have had that moment of receiving it and getting the glory and everybody in the world acknowledging she was the champion. She was the best at that point.Good on her, she is rightfully ticked off by has
that.Interesting Usain Bolt has come out in the face of the Powell problems and saying that he's going to be the one who is going to have to work hard to save running and save athletics and give people faith in athletics. There's still a lot of question marks around the whole Jamaican squad. There's something about champions who win, who seem to forget sometime times what they do and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad was - Lance arm strong forgot he was.I saw a baseballer overseas and Stuart O'Grady we will talk more about in the program. Matt Keenan who has been a very strong voice for this and talk about trying to move into a new era.He will be on the program in the next hour as well.You can go and practice your Jagger moves.II am not going anywhere until I see that.ABC News Breakfast can be watched live on the web.Head to the main website. You will find a link to the program.Snb who is very good at cutting it like Jagger is Paul Higgins! I have seen him in the dressing room!.II thank you, Michael! Good morning. Once again a large part of our nation is wait Wa waking to a chilly morning under clear skies. The remnant of a pressure trough is bringing rain to the south-east corner and in the west a strong cold front has moved ashore . It's producing rain, thunderstorms and a lot of wind in the west. Onshore winds will bring a few coastle a shower s to Queensland East

. It's producing rain, thunderstorms and a lot of wind in the west. Onshore winds will bring a few coastle a shower s to Queensland East coast.

Welcome to Friday morning. about
If you're just getting up and about you're with ABC News Breakfast. Lots to come on the program. We're going to be look at that train derailment in Spain. Investigators are now look at whether speed was significant factor.Journalism Professor Matthew Ricketson takes a look at the morning's newspapers and later we will talk to the President of the Human Rights Commission Gillian Triggs about the PNG asylum seeker solution. First, though, let's get the day's news with Michael.Good morning. Video footage has emerged of the moment a train derailed in Spain as it came round a bend. At least 80 people died in the crash and more than 170 have been injured. Two investigations are now under way, amid reports speed may have been a factor.The Defence Association is concerned about Tony Abbott's plan to send in the military to combat people smuggling. The Opposition wants to appoint a 3-star general to take charge of border protection. The Defence Association's Neil that Association's Neil James says should be a civil responsibility.US authorities have uncover ed what they say is the country's biggest ever credit card hacking case. They is the country's biggest say hackers stole more than $160 million - 160 million credit card numbers from companies including visa. They have charged five men with stealing $300 million. Police are investigating an explosion at a house in Ipswich west of Brisbane, two men were injured in the blast, one remains in intensive care with serious hand injuries. The bomb squad spent the night examining Clemicals points on the property. Child health export perts want the law to be changed to ban parents from smacking their children. The Royal Australasian college oh physician says research shows children who are physically Punish Road much more likely to suffer mental health issues like depression.One one of Europe's worst rail disasters. There are reports that the de rail - train may have been travelling at twice the recommended speed..Let's talk about the speed factor here because there's quite a bit of evidence coming now from the black box recorder?Yes, the black box has confirmed that the train was travelling at 190km/h, as it entered that curve. Just a few miles in the station of Santiago de Compostela. Now that is where the train derailed. Passengers reported that the train was going at high speed. Now it should have throe slowed down to enter that curve to around 80km/h, so it was going more than twice the speed limit.We heard in the early hours this morning that the driver had in fact admitted to driving too fast into that curve.Now the black box has confirmed it. What we don't know is whether it was human error at fault or some technical failure that prevented the automatic braking system from working if there was indeed an automatic braking system. All of that will come out in the next few hours an days as they continue the investigation into the causes of this.In the meantime, the driver has been taken into custody?He has. We understand he suffered light injuries but is being treated in hospital. He is under police guard. They want to investigate him. They want to take a statement. He is a suspect at the moment. No formal charges have been brought.But there's been some revelations throughout the day, his Facebook page was accessed by the media in Spain and there were some posts on that Facebook page boasting about how fast he went in trains. There is now this huge shadow over his experience as a driver. But as I said, at this stage no formal charges have been brought and it Ma i may be more than human error to
blame.We have vision more than human error blame.We have vision of that
rain coming more than human error to
blame.We have rain coming around the corner. You can see the extraordinary speed at which You can see speed at which he was going and
how You can see the extraordinary speed how it connects, just
horrendous

horrendous site and the wreckage is strewn Give us a sense of what it wreckage is like on the Give us a sense of like on the ground in like on the ground in terms of what authorities do.They spent much of the night trying to free passengers trapped within the wreckage and to remove corporations of many people that died - corpses of the many people that died.There are still I think 36 people here considered in a critical condition. So that death toll may even go up. On the scene itself, they've had clearence people there all day trying to clear the track of the wreckage. But the carriages are still clearly visible, torn apart, and twisted horrible visions of metal and blood everywhere. And the people of Santiago have been coming out to look at that scene today. Some of those people are survivors of the accident who want to return to it to see what happened and others are relatives, friends but also many more who want to see the catastrophe.That is often what happened.Are many of them relatives of those people who were on the train at the time?There rr 218 people travelling on that train as passengers: An un told number of crew members, we don't know how many of those who died. What we stillstill don't have is the definitive list of the dead. They have set up a morgue morgue
outside the city, a temporary morgue where friends and relatives have gone today to try to identify some of those corpses. More than half of those have been identified formally. But many of them unfortunately are so disfigured that identification is very difficult. So that is also going to continue over the coming hours. They are taking DNA samples from families who think they may have somebody on that train. They do have a passengers list but they're going around the hospitals trying to cross off those people who have survive and those who have perished in the accident.So there's many people still who don't know whether they had loved ones on they have survived or died that train and whether or not vred.What does the impant on the rail network more broadly and I guess too on that little town?This is the first accident, train accident in many years and the first one that occurred on the high speed rail network. It wasn't a high speed train but the tracks had recently been converted into the high speed system.So at the moment people are wonder ing whether or not there had been some maintenance problem and whether it does jeopardise the entire system. That doesn't seem to be the case at the moment. But what should have been a day of celebration in Santiago today has turned into a day of mouverning:Today is a public- - mourning. Today is a public day when they celebrate the feast of St James. It attracts many pilgrims here to the town and there's supposed to be a massive fiesta. All of that has been cancelled. Three days of official mourning have been declared across Spain. The PM has visited today.He is as thattive of sant yag yes. The King and Queen have been here here to visit and comfort people in hospital. It's a very sombre mood on a day that should have been one of celebration.Thank you for your time.Thank you.Now on a twist in the story the Spanish PM has been severely embarrass ed by a cut and paste condolence letter about the crash that he sent to grieve ing relativesAfter ex expressing his personal grief, she a native of Santiago de Compostela, he sent sending his most heart felt condolences to the victims. His message went on to express regret for the loss of human life and material damage inflictded. Here is where he ran into trouble. In that latd letter it says by the earthquake that struck the island of Gansu on Monday.Oops.Clearly dramatic scenes so soon after that and an error from his office but not a good thing to happen.Let's bring you some more uplifting scenes. The Pope is continuing his visit to Brazil, his popular visit to Brisbanil. He is there in Rio de Janeiro for World Youth and that rapt ous welcome he's and that got since touching and that rapt ous welcome got since touching down in got since South American country got since touching down in continues a pace. There South American continues a pace. There we see
him being continues a pace. There streets in him being led through the streets in his popemobile and the throng been throng upon throng of people, not just Catholics but of people just wanting to see him and welcome him to South America. Because he is a South America. Ian.And it's nice to see in contrast in the week there were a number of protests against the costs of this visit to a number of countries within the region and of course a cost quite heavy in many countries that are struggling financially. But there he is a rapt ous reception as he comes kissing babies and he is very active on Twitter.He is very active on Twitter.I have lost count of the millions of followers he has.And he encouraging his Twitter followers as well. Man of the people.There we leave Pope Francis in brazy. Let's come back home and cattle men and women are gathering in western Queensland to celebrate the 25th birthday of the stockman's hall Fame.They're competing in games focusing on bush skills. Peter Lewis has some skills himself. He is in Longreach.It seems in western Queensland if you build it, they will come.In the case of David Murphy of of David Murphy and his string
of horses, all the way from Victoria.Yeah, it's of horses, all the way Victoria.Yeah, it's been a massive draw card and we saw it advertised and saw it was part of the trip advertised and of the trip to put on our agenda to come up here and sigh See the Hall of Fame and the draft in one trip.On the eve of competition, finishing touches are being made to the new arenas that Ben Maguire says will bring to life the skills that brought to life stockman's Hall of Fame.We've been saying weir more than a human museum: We can get viz visitors an locals to see the place alive.David Murphy is one of 1,500 nominations for the camp draft alone.I think that is a great response for their first time doing it and the reports from this trip I think the camp draft will grow year after year and this will be something like paradise when it's set up.Along with AFL footy and polo cross, camp drafting is one of the sports established in Australia.This is the vision of Queensland cattle men Graham Acton.There is good support from all the western Queensland shires have been very supportive of the concept of building this big entertainment centre here and it will be used for horse sales and bull sales and all horse events and big musical show, rodeos, you name it.And he reckons the timing of these events couldn't be better.They certainly very necessary to boost the morale of people in the bush as you say it's been a tough year, this is 2 toughest year I've seen in my lifetime. Widespread drought through 70% of Australia, cattle prices at their lowest ebb where they were 30 years ago, it's been protoey tough going.His horsings were among the first to stretch their - legs in Long ree.Weave been mustering cattle for past week in preparation.Given their recent run of sport, you wouldn't rule out an upset from a British blow-in.Give everything a good go.Spoken like a true stockman.Now we can bring you some developing news from Sydney. The NSW police force is telling us it wants search for an public assistance in their search for an 8-month-old boy
who search for an who was abducted from Chester hill last night. who was abducted from hill last night. At about 8:30 hill last last night a man armed with hill last night. At about knife forced last night a knife last night a man armed with a house he grabbed knife forced his way into house he grabbed a 16-year-old house he grabbed a girl and the young boy, put
them in girl and the young them in a 2007 black them in a 2007 black Toyota Camry with NSW numberplates then drove off.About 10 o'clock the car stopped on the Hume Highway at Douglas Park where the girl was allegedly assaulted and the man drove off with the 8-month-old boy in the car. He is caulk caution and a thin build with drown hair and wear wearing a blue jumper and green track pants with tattoos on his arms and chest.Police are asking you to call the triple O emergency number if you have any energy: Initial investigates have reveal add train that derailed in Spain was travelling at twice the speed it should have been hit when it came off the tracks.Scores of people were killed or injured in one of Europe's worst ever train disas relevance.The defence soerntion's Neil James says the Defence Force shouldn't be dragged into a political controversy.And US authorities uncovered what they say is the country's biggest ever hacking fraud case. They allege more than 160 million credit and debit card numbers before stolen from several companies include ing visa and Dow Jones. Let's get a look at the papers. We're joined today by wick Matthew Ricketson, Professor of journalism at the university of Canberra.I see that 'Herald Sun' firmly in your view because it is the story everyone is talking about in Melbourne.Very Melbourne story, it's the continuing saga about whether trug drugs were used at Essendon it's all over page 1 of the 'Herald Sun' today, a big spill inside to page 4. All over the the 'Age' as well. You've been talking about it, everybody is talking about it.One of the things that is interesting about this and black,
is that - and I should deClare and black, but it's on my allegiances I am wearing red and black, but it's on the face of it it's kied kind of a mystify ing of it it's kied mystify ing story, what is the significance of these phone calls made on a particular night? And yet for those who have been following it for - it sort of bespeaks a large er problem down at the club and there's a kind of it's like reading the political tea wleefs this story in the same way you do with politics. So I would think if you just arrived in Melbourne you would be baffled by it.And to your point it's all about politics right now, it's about two heavyweights in the game in Andrew Demetriou and James Hird taking each other on essentially.That is right.It's getting pretty ugly.It is. Who knows where it's going to land. But in Melbourne we are approaching August, which gets near the final season, so if this matter is not resolved by then it's getting very ugly because Essendon sits third on the ladder and may -That ASADA report could drop at any time, possibly before the finals play out.The biggest problem that I am getting the sense of is whatever happens now no-one will be happy. There's been really selective narsy leaking that's gone on in a prosthaes was supposed to be clean and completely protected because it was a criminal investigation and all these things to pro protect all the individuals. That's gone out the window.It's extraordinary. And the pressure that's building not only with football kind of media
club and the teams but in the media like it's sport in the media is a huge area, there a lot s of sports journalists and some very high profile big name sports reporters have kind of come out very, very strongly from very early on and said one way or the other what their views are. So they is had a huge amount invest and if in fact they're vindicated that is one thing but if not you wonder whether where that would go.The great surveillance debate has emerged.This isThis is one - in America a bill has narrowly been defeated which would curb the National surveil
Security Agency's ability to surveil telephone calls, domestically and also Internet traffic and so on.There has been recognition that this is a very contentious issue so the people in the Congress over there are saying we will look at this more closely. That is a running issue as you know, with Edward Snowden's revelation s recently and him still being over in Russia.I just wanted to bring to your attention a series that that's been running in Crikey over the last couple of day s, very good series going to the kind of complexities of these issues and the fact that the Internet allows so much surveillance now that, you know, in the hands of government, it's almost inevitable it will be abused and yet it's all done in secret. How do we know as a society where we're at and where we're not. It's changed the issue ex-upon enshally as the issue to the additional private security issues that we had in to the additional private the past.It's security issues that we had the past.It's like Essendon, we don't know, we won't.We're in the don't know in the don't know phase this morning.We don't want to know.But we know if you're a smacker or not.Oh God.Talk about pressure.At least you're not asking me about my voting. Good question because I was thinking about that on the way in and I was readsing the story.What occurred to me is if in fact this law I would be & convicted of a criminal offence because I did smack our children from time to time.As most warrants would.We have three children.Progressively you get better as a parent and our third child was smacked the least. It didn't happen often but occasionally you get frustrated as a parent and so my issue with it is, OK, that we know as parents but what about at the other end of the scale where there is genuine abuse of children 50 oh curing. If you muddy those too much, I do think as some of the commentators have said in the piece this morning education for the broad mass of parents who - there is not a parent around who hasn't at least had to deal with the separation of how do you discipline.It's a grey area. Because these leading doctors are dead serious, they want to outlaw smacking altogether. What - if there is such an expression what is good or bad smacking. Lots of people share our views. William says why not make and be done with it.Jen and be done with it.Jen ter - a short sharp smack should shock a recastle rant child out of its shock a of its bad behaviour. I have said a short sharp sma, don't beat the child.That is the point. We grew grew up in an era where we got smacked more and that you guys would be smacking your kids. Like my brother got smack add hell of a lot more than I thought was short sharp smack. When you have one #34r5rly difficult child who stops responding to smacks where do you go?That is an issue in itself.I just want to draw the line between that and -As we do.And child abuse which is serious horrible problem.Totally different, let's fin wish a case closed - finally something we do know.Yes, we think!:This is on the front page of the taurn, it's about the - the 'Australian', it's about the former journalist and now it would appear from what the written there proven KGB operative, will Fred Burchett, the new information here is that Professor Robert Manne from Latrobe University has written a big ae essay in the Monthly which they have an extract of and he has access to material from the Soviet or ah chifs which he says demonstrates beyond doubt that Burchett as a covert agent for the KGB. The great pilty about this is some of Burchett's early reporting, being the first journalist in the world to get to Hiroshima after the bomb was dropped remains one of the most out standing pieces of reporting in history of reporting.And yet it would appear quiet definitive from what is reported here that he then went on to become a Soviet agent.See you soon, Matthew. Thank you for your time.Thank you.Let's go to sport now.Good morning. A quick result on the Socceroos from last night. They're playing the east Asian Cup and they played against Japan last night. The score was 3-2. Australia did quite well in scoring those two goals after being down 2-0. Mitch Duke and Tommy u Rick scores.Really bounced back into the game and the substitutions paid off. But all in all I think I have to give credit to the boys, the conditions were not easy. The humidity was pretty high, and we should never forget the purpose of our trip to find new players and I am pretty confident that we are in a good way to identify a couple of new gay Guys that will represent our team down the road.Australia's final match of that tournament is against China. An update on the Essendon saga after yesterday there being some suggestions that Andrew Demetriou made a call to Essendon before it call to Essendon before outed itself and confessed being in trouble with outed itself and being in trouble with the
supplement being in trouble supplement program. David Evans did not reveal much after last night's board did not reveal much after night's board meeting. He's not night's stood down, so there seems to
be stood down, so be a stalemate there. We still wait to find out what ASADA will do about it all. In the meks next half hour which will back with a chot with Ross Fitzgerald.Now for the weather.A few showers for Queensland's east coast today, especially the north-east tropical and central coast.

Can I start siege some of those moves, please?We can start to see some Mick Jagger move moves. Happy birth Mick Jagger. He's turned 70 today. It's hard to lose - it's hard keeping track. We leave you now with Mick Jagger in full flight. We're back after this very short break.

This program is not captioned. This program is not captioned. This program is not captioned.

Welcome back to ABC News Breakfast. A very good morning. I'm rieched. This Michael Rowland. This morning - the I'm rieched. This morning - Michael the moment of impact. Michael Rowland. This morning the moment of impact. Spain's horrifying train crash caught on cack ra cam on cack ra cam ra. It appears excessive speed the cause for the deaths and injuries. Also I Ahead the human rights Commission is worried about the PNG asylum worried about the seeker deal. We will chat to its President Gillian Triggs to find out more and the musical master piece that leaves audiences scratching their heads.We would have talks afterwards with the audience and people would say what does it mean and I would say what does it mean to you and they would tell us a story.Einstein on the Beach premiered 40 years ago and people are still asking about what it's about. Philip Glass has brought his creation back to Australia. But first the news.Good morning. Initial investigations have reveal add was
train that derailed in Spain was going too fast when it crashed. The train's black box shows it was travelling at twice the speed it should have been when it round add bend. At least 80 people have died, mover than 170 have been injured. Two investigations are under way and authorities are questioning the train's driver.Asylum seeker policy is again in the spot light. The defence association is concerned about Tony Abbott's problem. The
military response to the problem. The Opposition wants to appoint a-star general to take - a 3-star general to take charge of the operation. And the Human Rights Commission is questioning the Government's deal with Papua New Guinea saying it risks breaching Australia's legal obligations.US prosecutors have launched what they say is the country's biggest ever credit card hacking case.Five men from Russia and Ukraine have been charged with running the running the operation. They allegedly stole more than 160 million credit and deb yet card numbers from several US companies over seven years. Victims include Nasdaq, visa and Dow Jones.Prosecutors say the men stole around 300 million expertings want the law to be changed to ban parents from Australasian College
smack their children. The Royal Australasian College of physician say research shows that children punish ed are more likely to suffer mental health issues like depression. Most Australian parents still smack their children but attitudes are changing.Police are investigating an explosion at a house in Ipswich west of Brisbane. Two men were injured in the blast, one remains in intensive care with serious head injuries. The bomb squad spent the night examining chemicals found on the property. A quick look at finance.

As we have been reporting, excess qulif speed is one of the factors being investigated as the cause of Spain's rail tragedy. The death toll has now risen to 80 and Spain has declared three days of national mourning. Phillip Williams reports.As the twisted marriages were lifted off the line, there was no-one left to rescue.As the death toll mounted came the question what went wrong.Perhaps this rail company CCTV footage may hold the answer. The train appears to topple on the bend but then it's all too late. There's already speculation that the modern train may have been travelling over the 80km hour speed limit for that track.Did that system work, did it tell the driver what the speed limit was and then for instance the driver somehow ignored it or did the system fail?Whatever the cause, the result was horrifyingly clear. Desperate relatives were turned back for some came the worst possible news. TRANSLATION: I am here with the daughter of one of my friends who was killed. It's been a long night. The most disiflt part is when they bring the news. It's generally bad.The PM visited the crash site and later spoke to survivors in hospital. He says there will be three days of official mourning. TRANSLATION: At the moment two investigations are being carried out. One is the judicial investigation and the other one is by the commission of investigation of train accidents.The aim is to find the causes of this terrible accident accurately and as soon as possible.The accident has shocked a nation used to a safe, fast and efficient rail
system, accidents safe, fast and system, accidents have happened system, but not on this system, accidents have but not on this scale, not for but not on this scale, not decades.Let's come back home and get more on the home and get more continue ing debate on the asylum seeker policies. Kerrin Binnie is with us. Let's start with the Coalition's policy and there's still concern within defence sircts about what Tony Abbott is proposing?That is right. The announcement was made by Tony Abbott, the ShadowImmig made by Tony Abbott, the ShadowImmi Minister Scott Morrison yesterday as well as one of the advisers to their policy, Jim Molan. Under this plan, there will be a 3-star general that will essentially bring together the chain of command for about 15 government agencies including immigration, the Australian Federal Police, and the like, all of those agencies that are involved in the operation s - involving asylum seeker s off Christmas Island between Australia and Indonesia. Now at the moment there's a 2-star general that - or a 2-star senior military ranking officer who overseas - overcease those operation force border pro protection. The Coalition wants 3-star. The Immigration Minister will have ultimate responsibility up the line of that chain of command. Now Jim Molan says that shouldn't be a problem. But it has raised the ire of the Australian Defence Association, who says that it might breach the constitution. Let's have a listen to Neil James.There is a difference both in practice and in constitutional principle. At the moment, border protection command is a military element assisting a civil authority with civil law enforcement. That is not what Jim's talking about. Jim is talk about putting a military leadership or command structure in over the top of that. It wouldn't be a case of the Defence Force assisting the civil authority, it would be the case of the Defence Force element having the authority. These matters are essentially controversial in party political terms an in social terms in the Australian community. The Defence Force is an a political organisation, it defends all Australians equally. You to be careful about dragging the Defence Force into a situation of great party political controversy because this's not knot why we have a Defence Force and it's not good for the dwoence force or its relationships with the wider society.So that was the Australia Association Defence Association's kneel James speaking to us last night. Also last night the Shadow Immigration Mi last night the Shadow Immigration M Scott Morrison rejected those suggestions. Let's have a listen to him.I dismiss that. He's been on the record for many years being opposed to having the military involved in civil activities t but there is no change to what the military are currently no change to are currently doing on the ground. Border pro#2eks command still operates in the same way.It's ban week or so since the government announced its tough new PNG policy, but still the boats keep arriving?That is right. So far there are more than 700 people a-Rying since the July 19 cut off and that is on about 10 boats. Now, the Government's new policy is to send anyone beyond July 19, last Friday, to PNG for not just processing but resettlement as well if their applications for asylum are approved.Now the Opposition has been quite critical of the policy and the Rudd Government's ability to implement it. As I said, there are many boats still comes. On commercial television this morning, Jason Clare says he's receiving reports from Indonesia that the people smugglings will telling the potential asylum seekers before they get on the boat anyway should get on the boat because of various number of reasons. Have a listen to Jason Clare explaining what people smugglers are telling asylum seekers.The latest reports I've got that people smugglers are telling'm in Indonesia now and remember you have thousands of people in Indonesia who have bought tickets already, they're saying get on to a boat now before the first plane goes to PNG or this won't go through the Parliament, it won't survive the High Court, every lie you can think of is now being told to encourage people to get on to boats. That is why you can expect more boats to come over the course of the next few weeks like boats came after Tampa, they're turning people on to boats because they make a million dollars per boat, sometimes the Human Rights Commission has weighed in expressed its first concerns about the conditions in those facilities?These are what you can call renewed concerns. There's been ongoing concerns about on Manus Island and Nauru. Not just the conditions but also the set up of processing people in the first place. Been of the detention centre s or processing serpts themselves, - centres themselves, Gillian Triggs is saying they are harsh and she's worried they're not up to international standards. We will hear from her later this morn. Also the Immigration Minister Tony Burke has been on Manus Island and today is heading to Nauru to investigate the situation or have a look first-hand look at the situation there, specifically today will be inspecting the damage from the riots last weekend that where buildings were burnt, there were cars destroyed and millions of dollars of damage done to the buildings and facilities there.As Kerrin Binnie mentioned Gillian Triggs will be joining us on the program in about 20 minutes time. To the United States now where five men have been charged with a computer fraud conspiracy involving the theft of millions of credit and debit card numbers, stolen card data was uploadtol blank cards used by criminals used to make cash withdrawals and other purchasesBen Knight told us that several big companies have been targeted.These aren't usually the guys that they catch, normally, the ones you get are the ones who are carrying the fake cards, who are trying to use them in the shop or at the ATM machines to get the cash out. In his press conference today he really seemed to respect for the sheer seemed to have a grudging respect for the cleverness and tenacity and cleverness patience of these people who he patience of these alleges have been involved in this crime. He talked alleges have been involved this crime. He talked about how
they would this crime. He they would wait month, they they would go to particular websites, they would find websites, company and start doing probes websites, they would into the company and into the website, start looking into for weak competences when found a weakness for weak competences found a weakness that's when found a they would hand over to member of the team they would hand member of the team who would start to send malicious software. That enabled them to rip aut all of these reddit card numbers. They didn't do anything with them other than sell them on. There was another member of the team who was alleged to be the broerk and it worked its way down the tree. But it's no doubt that this is a massive fraud in a country that is the number one site for this kind of credit card skimming in the world. With very good reason too.Why is the US such a target? Is it particularly lax in some of way Way with regard to technology?It's just old technology, it is really quite stunning just how backwards some of the particularly the financial technologies over in this country are. I remember I was being stunned when I first got here and everyone was sort of saying do you pay me with a cheque and I thought I don't think I have written a cheque in my life. But it's very common here, it's the same thing with the credit card technology. They're use ing the magnetic strip and the signature as the only verification. Everyone in Australia, everyone in Europe has this chip and pin, that chip that appears inside your credit card. It's a lot harder to do with that kind of technology. But the United States simply doesn't have it. There's talk about going down that road but the banks are re re resisting saying they would have to replace all the machines in the country, which is true, but this country is Loosing an estimated $1 billion target.
a year and it is a prime target. 80% of this kind of crime that happens outside of Europe happens inside the United States. ImentIt's just massive too. There's lot of incentive for them to change but a lot of resistance as well.Now, we should just mention once again that the NSW police have put out They have mentioned that there needed
is urgent public assistance needed to help locate an 8-month-old boy who was abducted from Chester Hill last night. At about 8:30 last night a man armed with a knife forced his way into a house in Kenthurst Place. He grap add 16-year-old girl and the young boy putting them into his 2007 black Toyota Camry. It has a NSW registration of AN 22 XX, which is easy to spot..At about 101 car stopped on the Hume highway where the girl was assaulted. The man then drove off with the 8 month-month-old boy in the car. The man has Caucasian appearance, about 165 to 175cm tall, thin build with brown hair ing wearing a blue jumper and green track pants. He has tattoos on his arms an chest. If you have any information, perhaps you have seen this man, this black Toyota am ray with registration plates AN 22 XX to contact them on triple-0 immediately.To the front pages of the newspapers. TheThe 'Australian' says the Government is on track to spend hundreds of millions of dollars on new facilities if boats continue to rive at the current rates.The 'Canberra Times' focuses on the Australian Defence Association's criticism of the Opposition's so called Operation Sovereign Borders taskforce.The Government is facing a revenue shortfall of more than 20 billion dollars over the next four years, that story in the yurve.The 'Mercury' covers both the PM and the Opposition lead're's individualit to Tasmania yesterday.The 'Courier Mail' has a warning from one of Queensland's most senior lawyers that killers could escape justice because there's not enough top prosecutors.'The Guardian Australia' reports on the investigation into the rail disaster in Spain.The 'Herald Sun' says differing accounts of a phone call from AFL boss Andrew Demetriou has put a strain on the relationship between Essendon's coach James Hird and the club's President David Evans.The 'Advertiser' covers the fallout from Stuart O'Grady's admission he took a performance enhancing drug.Drop in quarantine safeguards has left WA more exposed to a biosecurity disaster, the 'West Australian' has that warning from a State Government whistleblower.'The Daily Telegraph' takes a look at some of the past royals named George and says will and Kate's son would be the saviour of his name sakes.The 'Northern Territory News', as always, has to have a croc features even if it is a royal story and that salt water croc and
has been named Prince George and the NT's Chief Minister says it is a fitting gift fo