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(generated from captions) board now. But the Qantas

terminal was slow to terminal was slow to stir. Can't get to Cairns until this afternoon. We'll Minister Julia Gillard has begun that press conference. Transport Albanese

and the Minister for Workplace relations Chris Evans. relations Chris Evans. Earlier this morning Fair Work Australia granted the Government's application to

terminate all industrial action terminate all industrial action

relating to Qantas. This is a

win for passengers stranded

around the country and around

the world. This is a win for

the 1 million Australians who

work in tourism and of course

were so anxious that their

customers could not get to

where their holidays to be. In making this application the Government wanted to see industrial action

stopped. That is by going to Fair Work Australia we

achieved what we set out to do.

Planes will be back in the

skies, Qantas workers will skies, Qantas workers will be

back at work. We wanted to end all industrial action because we were very concerned about

the circumstances that had left

overall was concerned about the

extreme action taken by Qantas

that had stranded tens of thousands of passengers thousands of passengers far away from home. We wanted

make sure that those passengers

could get flights and were able

to return home. We wanted to see this industrial action at an

an end. We also took this application because we were

concerned about the risk to the national economy caused by this

disputation and the industrial action. action. This morning I have spoken to a number of the

participant s in this dispute. I'm in the process of speaking

to all of the participants in

this dispute. I have made it very

very clear to them that my

expectation now that industrial

action has ceased is that they

will get around a table and get

this sorted. There is a 21-day

period now for the industrial

parties to come together and to

resolve this dispute. In 21-day period it is clearly my

view that they should act quickly, view that they should act

quickly, they should get

together and they should

together and they should work

this dispute out. If they are unable to do so then Fair Work

Australia will impose a

solution on them. At the solution on them. At the end of the the 21 day-period. Before I pass over to Minister Albanese

I do want to affirm that the Government's action taken on

Saturday was taken

wanted to see this industrial

action resolved. The industrial

action has now been resolved.

That means Qantas planes will

be returning to the skies later today and for a description as

to how that will occur I'll turn to the Minister for

Transport now. Thank you, Prime

Minister, Qantas safety case was received by CASA hand

delivered at 10:23am this morning. CASA safety reviewing this terrible. They're assessing the serviceability of aircraft, the management of the dispute

issues arising from it and

sequencing of returning

aircraft. CASA is

Qantas to position flights,

that is empty planes flying to

where their departure point

will be for passenger as we speak. CASA as we speak. CASA believes

that Qantas passenger flights

will knhens - commence will knhens - commence around about 3pm this afternoon. The first priority first priority has been Sydney

to Melbourne because it is on

that route that there are most

stranded passengers at the

present time. The Department

and CASA estimate that Qantas

will not be at full operation until Wednesday. There until Wednesday. There is a delay period because of the cessation of flights from 5pm

on Saturday. It's also the case, I should indicate, that Virgin Australia will be providing an additional seats today. Virgin have moved over 75,000 people domestically and internationally between and internationally between 5pm

Saturday and midnight last night. So they'ved a ed 58

services to the network, that

is of course have been of great assistance as well to the travelling public. Just before

we take questions I'll ask the Minister for Workplace

Relations just to describe what

will now happen at Fair Work

Australia. I think most of you effective decision of Fair Work

Australia full bench last night is that all industrial action

is that all industrial action

is ordered to cease. There is

now aperiod of 21 days in which

the parties are required to negotiate negotiate a settlement to enterprise bargaining

agreement. If that's not successful, if they can't reach

agreement then the Fair Work

Australia will make a declaration. In the old

language they will language they will arbitrate

the decision and arbitrate the

matter and make a decision which will be parties. But there will be no

industrial action either by Qantas or the unions, the 3 unions affected during that

period ideal they either reach an agreement or an agreement or there's a declaration made by Fair Work

Australia. The Government stands ready to support the negotiation process. Obviously it will be managed by Fair Work Australia but if there's anything we can do to assist we

will. The pram PM has delivered a very strong message to a very strong message to the parties as we have been doing for some time that they ought

to get on a maturely It's highly regrettable that It's highly regrettable that it

got to this but the responsibility

responsibility on them is now

to fix it and that's the

Government's expectations. Prime Minister, there is criticism today that

you did not do enough quickly

enough to step in and stop the

fleet being grounded at all,

that you could have stopped it

happening at all. Could you

answer that and could you and the ministers also exactly when

you and/or your office first

knew of the possibility of the

fleet being grounded? OK, I'll take both of those questions.

On the first

action the Government took action the Government took has brought the dispute to an end. Flights will be in the air Flights will be in the air this afternoon. We have achieved

what we set out to do which is

the end of industrial action

and Qantas getting back to its

business of flying business of flying passengers

where they need to go. And where they need to go. And that

is a win, it is a win for those

stranded passengers around the

nation and around the world and

of course for our tourism

operators. In terms of timeliness of the actions taken

we were advised around 2pm on Saturday that Qantas was

grounding its fleet at preparation for a lockout. That

was the advice the Government

got from Qantas at 2pm. We did

not have any earlier advice

that planes would be grounded at 5pm. Having heard that we

took immediate steps to get the

matter to Fair Work Australia.

Fair Work Australia commenced its hearings that night. Fair Work Australia continued concluded them early this morning. As a result morning. As a result planes

will be back in the sky this afternoon. Now I know afternoon. Now I know that

there has been discussion about

another section of the

legislation, section 431. Let

me take it very clear the issues about section 431, it is

a section which enables a minister to make a declaration about industrial about industrial action. It appears in the Fair Work

Australia act, it has appeared

in earlier versions of industrial industrial relations

legislation. It has never used. It is capable of used. It is capable of judicial

review. If that judicial review happened you would have to have

a hearing with all the facts

put on the table, that is all

the facts put on the table the

way the facts were put on way the facts were put on the table before Fair Work

Australia. The Government

therefore faced a choice

whether to use the procedure

which we have used, which

worked, or whether to use this

last resort procedure, last resort procedure, this last resort section 431 which has never

been used and which would have

taken us into new legal

terrain. We determined to use

section - the section that section - the section that we

did use and it did use and it has got the

result that we wanted. I would

note too that we received the

clearest of possible advice from

from our departmental advisers to take the course that we did

take.On On the advice question,

timing of advice I'll tern to Minister Albanese on that. Can

I indicate that the first time in which I was informed in which I was informed that there would be the there would be the grounding of

the aircraft but a lock out the aircraft but a lock out was

when a staff member from when a staff member from Mr

Joyce rang one of my staff on

Saturday afternoon. In terms of

the timing of that, the timing of that, my staff member was rung at 1:26pm. and told me to expect a and told me to expect a phone call from Mr Joyce. I didn't

receive one so I rang him at

1.51pm.. I still didn't receive

one so I rang him at 1:55pm. I

still receive one so I rang still receive one so I rang him

at 1:58pm. Apparently through security measures security measures it's harder

to get phone calls in so I'm

not sure what time Mr Joyce

rang me but it was certainly after on a number of occasions to get

hold of him. That was the first

occasion in which Mr Joyce, or

anyone else from Qantas, ever raised anyone else from Qantas, had ever raised the issue of a

lockout. Now I listened to Mr

Joyce on Fran Kelly's program

this morning and as a result I

rang Mr Joyce and he will

confirm that at no stage, at no

stage did Qantas, Mr Joyce or anyone else raise with me the possibility of a lockout of the

Qantas work force until we had that conversation that

afternoon. He said that he raised this on several occasions with the and you shouldn't be surprised

in the least, who did he say it he raised with it and when? I

indicate to you that I had a phone conversation with Mr

Joyce about an hour ago after he finished his press

conference. I indicated to him

that this was my recollection

of events, that I did not

recall him ever raising possibility of a lockout of his

work force. He confirmed to me

that that was also the case. I

indicated to him that I would be making that public given

that there was some speculation

about that. He agreed that about that. He agreed that he

would - he agreed with my account that it had never been

raised publicly, the possibility of a lockout. How

did he explain the discrepancy

from his earlier - That's not

up to me to explain. Did he

explain to you? What it's up to

out there. Qantas had certainly

raised with me on a number of occasions, we had occasions, we had face-to-face meetings, phone conversations, the problems they with the fleet and with the fleet and the grounding of the fleet in terms

of the grounding of particular

planes and 7 aircraft had planes and 7 aircraft had been grounded, as aware, Mr Joyce had indicated

and we have a difference as with regard to interpretation of that in terms of that in terms of timing. But he indicated that obviously if

planes kept being grounded at planes kept being grounded at a

rate of 2 a week it rate of 2 a week it would reach

some point whereby there were a

range of aircraft grounded and

therefore the airline would not

operate. But at no stage, at no stage

stage did he indicate the

possibility of a lockout of the work force which is precipitateed his announcement

of a 5pm shutdown of Qantas

both domestic and internationally. And Minister and Prime

and Prime Minister, Minister,

when you spoke to Mr Joyce on Saturday, the Prime Minister has said today that he had

alternative options that he

didn't use, did you put that to

him on the conversation on Saturday and has Saturday and has the Government had that conversation with him

since and what reason does he give for why he chose that option and not others? I don't

intend to go through song and verse of all verse of all the details of conversations that I had with

CEOs but suffice to say that it

is fair to argue that Mr Joyce put it very clearly that put it very clearly that this

was a decision that had

made by the Qantas board.

made by the Qantas board. He acknowledged that at no stage

had he asked for government intervention either up to that

time or indeed at that time. He

informed me that he was simply

letting me know of the decision

of the board that was made that morning. I morning. I certainly indicated to him my concern about what

the board had decided and about

the timing of it. Before we

take any take any questions I'll actually ask the Minister for

Workplace relations to Workplace relations to describe

some of the options some of the options that are available under the Fair Work

Act. Thank you, prvem Prime

Minister. Just to make the

point that the suggestion that

there was no other advice I have from my

Department is that they had a

range of options, they include

accessing a number of

provisions in the act which

would have allowed would have allowed them to seek

intervention and termination of industrial action because of

the threat to the economic

threat to Qantas and its employees, or they could have

applied under the 424

provisions which we use which

went to significant and

economic damage to the economic damage to the public

economy o they could have made of industrial action to enable

a cooling off period. There

were a range of measures open

to Qantas under the Fair Work Act other than the one they

chose to use and I make the

point when I received

from Mr Joyce on what was still

Saturday morning in Perth it

was to advise me as a courtesy

that they were taking that

action, that that was a

decision that had been endorsed

by the board and that they may

have to shut the airline down became public because of their concerns that they would have

to close the airline rather than keep flying than keep flying after announcement. So the clear

implication to me was that implication to me was that it was the decision had been taken

and that it would apply at 5:00

or earlier if required and when

I pressed Mr Joyce as I pressed Mr Joyce as to whether or not whether or not there had been a

change in circumstances given

that the air craft engineers had suspended their industrial

action for 3 weeks, whether there had been a change of

circumstances on that day, circumstances on that day, he

was not able to answer that and

he just made it clear that I

should be aware of their

circumstances. But I him as to whether anything had changed to bring about this

course of action and he course of action and he said that his answer was that this

was the only option available

to Qantas. Before we take the

next question, so can I just in

terms of that discussion say I do not accept that Qantas' only

choice on Saturday was to take

the extreme action of grounding

all planes and leaving tens of thousands of passengers

stranded. I do not accept Just in terms Just in terms of getting the facts on the record, facts on the record, because there have been some other

claims made which should be

corrected, there are claims in

newspapers this morning that Mr

Joyce was seeking to speak to

me and had I taken his call the

planes would have not been

grounded. That is untrue and Mr

Joyce has confirmed today that

that is untrue. So those reports are wholly wrong. There's also been some speculation and

reporting that Mr Joyce

requested the Government in his telephone

use section 431 of the Act, any reporting of that nature is

wholly untrue as well. Yes, Dennis. You've mentioned the legal uncertainty of using legal uncertainty of using it, when did the Government actually look at at was your advice on that and

when did you get that. As

Minister for Workplace

relations has made clear the

advice we received from the

relevant Department on Saturday

was the appropriate course was

to use the section that we did

use, section 424. I also think, perhaps the best thing to do

would be to look at the outcome.

outcome. What is the outcome. What is the outcome?

The Government wanted to see industrial action cease, industrial action cease, we

wanted to make sure stranded

passengers could get their

flights, we wanted to make this damage to the economy was brought to an end and we have

succeeded. Consider using 431

before Saturday Dennis, you misunderstand misunderstand the nature of 431 in asking that question. 431 requires the same test of

damage to the national economy

as section 424 does, the section that we used until dispute escalated and dispute escalated and let's remember Friday Qantas was talking about negotiating this dispute through. That

advice on Friday. Saturday the

nature of the dispute changed

when Qantas decided to

when Qantas decided to ground

the fleet at 5pm and to proceed with with a lockout. It wasn't until that change of circumstance

Qantas moving from talking

about negotiation to that escalation of the dispute that

any of these any of

presented as live questions for government determination,

anybody who puts any other

version of the facts in

relation to that is simply not telling you the truth. Tony

Sheldon said today the union is

considering a legal challenge

to the Fair Work ruling. In

your conversation to Mr Sheldon are you going to tell him to to

drop that as part of your wish

to have it sorted out? No

appeal has been filed to Fair

Work aut Australia's ruling.

The advice to us is that it is

a robust ruling, operation now and it will

continue to be in operation so

the industrial dispute has been

terminated, the opportunity is there now there now for parties to get

around a table and out. If they're unable to then

Fair Work Australia will sort

it out for them in 21 days'

time but let's be very clear

for members of the for members of the travelling public, moving back into the sky as

this 21-day period of conciliation goes through Qantas planes will be

travelling in the sky, travelling in the sky, they will be working as people

expect waunts - Qantas expect waunts - Qantas to work. If the parties don't resolve it and Fair Work

Australia arbitrates it Qantas will continue will continue to function as normal during arbitration. Mr Joyce in arbitration. Mr Joyce in his

press conference today used the press conference today used the

term nooit noling as you wuld expect him to as COE that people cannot people cannot book Qantas flights with confidence. On

section 431 if it's never section 431 if it's never been

used and it is open to appeal

what's it there for and can you

describe a situation where it

could be used. Secondly, in

terms of the industrial dispute

one of the criticisms Qantas

had was that the unions were

asking for things about

they should not be asking for,

do you think there's any room

in Fair Work Act to maybe include an allowable strike

provisions clause and in the

hearing yesterday they decided

on 26 October that the talks

with the TWU had failed. Do you

think they had planned this for

more days than they're letting

on? On matters related to the

TWU I might refer to Minister Albanese. On the questions you ask the current

section in the leb legislation

remember Kates sections in

earlier versions of the act.

It's that as a last result. It's never been consequently because it's never

been used there's not certainty about the way in which courts

would deal with that provision.

So, you know, it's there as a

last resort should a last

resort circumstance ever present. What the Government determined to do quickly on Saturday afternoon with the

first hearing Saturday night was to use a provision of enable us to get an enable us to get an order that the industrial action be

terminated, that passengers

could start moving again, that

people would no longer be stranded, we achieved what stranded, we achieved what we

set out to do and that is a win

for passengers who will be able to

to start getting back on planes

rather than being stranded and

of course we were motivated by

our concerns about the national

economy and the economic damage

including to the tourism industry. Now

industry. Now you had three questions, one's going to

Minister Albanese, what Minister Albanese, what was the

second.? That Qantas had

decided on the 26th that their talks with the TWU had

failed. Minister Albanese will respond to that. I read this morning in the 'Daily

Telegraph' that Mr Joyce had a meeting in my Marrickville

office the Friday before last.

I don't normally disclose

private meetings but given it's

appeared in the press on this

occasion I will and confirm the

fact that I have had 3

face-to-face meetings with Mr

Joyce in the past 8 days prior to his announcement. The Government

Government wasn't sitting back

doing nothing here. The Government was attempting to facilitate discussion between

the parties. I had a meeting

between myself, Mr Joyce and Mr Sheldon on the Sheldon on the Friday before

last in my Marrickville office.

I chose the Marrickville office so it wouldn't get out because

I attempted to have a without

prejudice discussion to see where two where two people who I have a good relationship with could

get to. In terms of the details

of those discussions it's not

appropriate to reveal them. is, however, notable that after

that meeting Mr Sheldon that meeting Mr Sheldon and the

TWU called off, as they said

they would, the planned

industrial stoppage they had

scheduled for Wednesday. I then

had a future meeting with Mr

Joyce in my office later that afternoon about

impact of the dispute on Qantas

and I had a further meeting with Mr Shell dn and Mr Joyce

on last Wednesday afternoon. It

was my view that considerable

progress was being made and you

will note that there were reports indeed in the newspaper

early last week about the

progress that had been made with spokespeople from both

Qantas and the Transport

Workers' Union indicating that that was the Ways - case. Under

those circumstances, that is part of the reason why I part of the reason why I found it quite extraordinary, quite extraordinary that extraordinary that I received

the notification that I did

from Mr Joyce on Saturday

afternoon. I believe to if afternoon. I believe to if both parties, both the employer in

Qantas and the employees act

like adults they can certainly

get this done. In terms of the issues in this have to do with Qantas's proposed restructuring of proposed restructuring of its international division, does

the Government have a view on

that and specifically do you

have a view about whether

anything that the company

proposes to do runs

Qantas sales act? On the Qantas

sale act I'll go to Minister

Albanese. I'm not going to be

drawn as the conciliation

process unfolds over coming days on

days on individual issues in

this dispute, what we need now

and I've conveyed this directly

to the parties myself to the parties myself this

morning, is we need them to get

around a table

opportunity to get this fixed,

to get this done, they have a

21-day period, it's in their interests that they start and

they get it done as quickly as possible on the sale act I'll refer to Minister

Albanese. With regard to the Qantas sale act, the government has made our position very

clear, that we will not count innocence any breach of the

act. We have a watching brief and as Qantas makes announcements or makes its position further clear position further clear as issues develop with regard to its plans for restructuring the

Government will seek advice as

that is made but we have made

it very clear that we intend to

uphold the Qantas sale act. At the moment there is nothing

that has been proposed that I have advice is in breach of the

act but we of course have not

seen the full detail of that have not been finalised. We'll

go over to Lenore and back to

Michelle. Lawyer o. Sorry,

don't trade places, I'll be in even worse straits.

Laura. Could I just clarify,

some of the employers and

others have been suggesting

that this dispute itself is,

shall we say a love child of given greater powers to the

unions, to pursue a wider range of issues beyond of issues beyond workplace

conditions. I was wondering

whether you could whether you could address that particular point please? I'm happy to address that particular particular point. It's

certainly true that the

bargaining system we introduced

under the Fair Work Act does

enable working people to bargain

bargain on things like job security and so they should. So

they should be able to bargain on job security. It's not

appropriate, and I don't think it's right, for Australian

womps - workplaces that, for

taken as a reference to the Qantas Qantas dispute, I'm using a hypothetical example so please note that, it's not acceptable

to me that we could have to me that we could have a

situation where an employer

agrees with his or her

employees that they are to be

paid a certain wage and then

during the life of that

agreement when the employees

are obligate ed to not are obligate ed to not take industrial action, that's the

rules under the Fair Work Act,

the employer starts employeeing contractor s at cheaper rate

and making those employees

redundant. That acceptable to me. I can

understand that people want to bargain on job security

matters. Now let's remember bargaining

bargaining does not mean agreement.

agreement. It means that you

get to raise the issue and you get to have the conversation. Work

Work Choices was all about

leaving employees without any ability to pursue issues in their

their own - on their own behalf

without any ability to really

have a voice. The express

desire of the Howard Government

and the Liberal Party of

cabinet ministers like Tony

Abbott was to make sure employers had all of the say and working people had and working people had none of the say. That wasn't right the say. That wasn't right and

working people rightly rejected

it in the 2007 it in the 2007 election. I owe

Michelle a question. You said

that you're now talking to all

the parties. Do you think it

would have made any difference

if you had become involved in

this in a more high profile way

getting the parties together as

your Minister did but with the extra clout from ministerial meeting or ministerial meeting or do you think you did everything you could have to get this could have to get this dispute resolved

resolved before the weekend? I believe I did everything that I could and could and I believe the Government pursued the appropriate strategy at every

point I have been in contact

with and briefed by my ministers. I was obviously well

aware of Minister Albanese's discussions, well aware discussions, well aware of Minister Evans' discussions and

the like. They were using their

good officers to see what could

be done as I think would be done as I think would be very transparent to you now available during the course of this press conference, clearly that wasn't going to lead to an

outcome pause Qantas determined

on Saturday to take on Saturday to take the extreme

action we have seen. My view is with the Government having

taken the right steps quickly, to bring this industrial

disputation to an end, with disputation to an end, with the

Fair Work system delivering a

termination of the industrial

action with the Fair Work system delivering a 21-day conciliation period, in the interests of all of

these parties and I put

obligations on their shoulders

equally, it's in the interests

of all of these of all of these parties each

trade union and Qantas to get around the table and get this

fixed. Thank you very much. That it was Prime Minister