Note: Where available, the PDF/Word icon below is provided to view the complete and fully formatted document
Disclaimer: The Parliamentary Library does not warrant the accuracy of closed captions. These are derived automatically from the broadcaster's signal.
9am with David and Kim -

View in ParlView

(generated from captions) to Summertime this Friday morning. and thanks for tuning in We'll kick off silhouette in rock'n'roll - with the most recognised Peter Garrett. musician, now politician, make it more than just words. with Hugh Evans, We'll revisit our chat summertime breakfast You might be enjoying a lazy from Centrelink We'll speak with a man to look at your best options. Dr John Irvine, And the patron saint of parenting, drops in with some helpful advice the kids' morning routine. on how to sort out to make up your Summertime. All that and a whole lot more

desert wind, flicking sweat, twitching in the sweltering determined to drown out the traffic. And the voice, like a gleeful magpie, Now he's a politician.

to suitably describe him. and he appreciated our efforts Good morning, good morning, mate. Was I really like that? I saw you at a concert in 1979... That's right. for some years before that? You'd been playing A couple of years before that. but it changed my life. I don't want to be too fawning here, It was an extraordinary concert. the band was an extraordinary band. That was the thing about the band, popularity, it was always solid. It didn't seem to me to have a dip in thanks very much, Well, I think, look, I mean, about what we were doing. but we were really intense in making that music. We were so in to what we were doing a little bit The one thing, I think, set us apart and the audience, we made our fusion between ourselves clubs or pubs, wherever we were, in any of those And those people stayed with us, not, it didn't really matter. whether we got played on radio or and get that energy back, and given them a bit of our energy What happened for you? conscientious, It was a very, very solid,

Did the passion die for you? No, I always loved the music it was everything around it. but I think a lot of time touring, To keep it going you've got to spend environment issues. I did work with the ACF on And I think after 27, 28 years - I love what we were doing - I mean, I love the guys,

politically. and it was time to try something you went in to politics. Yeah. I mean it's no surprise that As you mentioned, Australian Conservation Foundation. you were the president of the perhaps might have been confused But for a lot of people I think they that you'd gone to a big party outspoken smaller parties. and not to one of the more I'm outspoken in a big party. green streak in my body I've got a strong, really important for us. and I think environment is really, he's going to go to the Greens." Some people probably thought, "Maybe for me to be. But I felt Labor was the right place with Labor politics and politicians. I'd had connections in the past both policies were pretty good there. I actually thought the environment I also want to make a contribution. that that's what they say It's the great cliche for pollies but that's what I felt, you know. politics was a place to be involved in mainstream and make an effort. that I should try that you've publicly said but one of the interesting things on the program earlier this week. I know you had Kim and Susie Kim said, "Have a debate about it." industry in Australia. I don't agree expanding the nuclear more radioactive waste. I don't think we should be producing uranium floating around the system I don't think we should have more I don't think, to proper safeguards. which isn't subject, way of doing it. And, also, I reckon there's a better and the technologies are now there years ago, which they probably weren't 15-20 environmentally sensible. which is economically and money in producing energy which If we're going to invest a lot of I call him Kim now - Kim made the point -

in expanding uranium minding there was economic rationale and exporting it it we have a greater say but he was also say figure we export globally. in the non-proliferation stage I didn't really understand it. someone matches As I said to him, it's like giving

to enact contracts then it enables you which have higher safeguards. with the proliferation... The great problem to the agreement. It does to an extent you're a party and this is what we'll debate, But the issue, is whether it prevents people by agreements who don't want to be bound

enrichment. in terms of nuclear power and the 'Age', This morning on the front page of his own advisors are saying to him, good idea." "hang on a minute, that's not such a need to have which is very open. So it's one of those debates that we available to people to think through Where all the materials are the technicalities of it. dealing with what our kids are going to be

sitting here thinking But it's our kids nuke devil by the tail? when they actually got a hold of the in terms of global warming Do you think the Government gets it It's one of the big Achilles heels. No. The PM doesn't get it. Climate change is real.

this year. are going to be looking at drought doesn't get it. It's a huge issue and he just some of the more desire descriptions The PM has said he's sceptical about of global warming? of what's going to happen in terms look at the maps of Greenland, All I can say to Mr Howard is have a difficulties have a look at the incredible facing our neighbours in the Pacific are when they get extreme weather events already happening in Pacific Islands and they've got sea level rises looking at what's happening. and people's communities are already It's happening. this or his entire Government? Is it John Howard who doesn't get about climate change. There's confusion in the Government with the problem. is so important that we can't deal

to the scientists or the CSIRO. They haven't listened They're not listening to the to the conservationists. conservation organisations. a blind spot to it. They've sort of got the issue's so big, And I think frankly other issue, The fact of the matter is, like any it, humans have created it. the very big problem we've created "This is a priority for us. It's critical, it's urgent." We've got some policies on it, that I think are really good but you don't see anything from Howard and the Government. I think it could be. There's a synchronisation between what our rural communities face - We may end up, if we don't have serious spring rains in Australia, we may end up going into a hot and hard and tough summer. Climate change could be a predominant issue there. You don't want a disaster to focus people's minds on something in a political campaign but I think it will be an ice in the run-up to the campaign and it will be partly rural communities that are feeling it but also those city folk who are getting a sense of, "Hang on a minute. I've had all these hot days coming on, Why isn't there a continuation of the rebate for us to put solar on our roof? Why aren't I getting some assistance to make my house more energy efficient? Why are we not investing in public transport so that some of us that want to get out of motor cars, but can't, can. Why are big companies not being put under pressure to do something? I'm starting to read more and more about a carbon tax and I've also read that emissions trading is actually a better way Well, it's in the morning, so I'll try and do it simply. In order for us to encourage companies which is contributing to global warming, they need to have a financial incentive to do that. One way of doing that would be to enable them to trade in carbon, so, if you society figure, for example, a price of carbon,

that was able to reduce your carbon use, you effectively would be able to trade up what you've saved against those who are using more. That would create the first principle driver within economies, which move to reduce carbon dioxide and pollution that they extract Carbon trading happen within companies. quite a lot of the big energy company do it. has said that he wants it to happen within California, Now the States in Australia have said, "We think that's a good idea and we want to do it." So we've got this ludicrous situation. It's a little bit like the train tracks meeting at different parts of the State where the States have said we should have a carbon trading system

between the Labor States and the Liberal Federal Government? You, you know what? Mr Blair in the UK thinks carbon trading's a good idea and he's effectively Labor. It's just a blind spot, a bloody-mindedness frankly on the part of the Government and the PM not to recognise that our environment is at risk and one way of dealing with this problem is to enable people to get in to carbon trading. I want to shift emphasis very quickly. You are Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for the Arts, Radio television? I think in television there is. But if you look at our cultural deficit, we import a whole lot more American program than what we make. And on our television programs, particularly in film, we're see a very strong dominance, particularly by the Americans, and that's partly because of the free trade agreement and partly because we probably don't support about our songwriters, our film-makers and writers. I'm one of these people that really loves sport and really love the arts. I've worked as a musician in my earlier life. I reckon the music and the songs and the poetry

and recognising the arts not only is good for us when we consume it and enjoy it, but it also makes an economic contribution to the country. Could we possibly, would there be in the foreseeable future Look, there are requirement there for people to meet. Sometimes they sort of get around them a little bit. With music we've got quite a good balance. I came up with this quote - "I don't dance like that when I'm grooving in some club. I reckon you've got groove. I groove now. it's the plumber who won't fix his own bathroom. you've come off the road to more music now than I ever did when I was in a band. And you might remember Midnight Oil was inducted into ARIA Hall of Fame last October. After the break, a bit of Bond, James Bond,

See you soon.

A former KGB colonel and double agent harboured a secret passion. So much so the Russian spy divorced his wife in Moscow to be with her. His love was unrequited, such is the inherent dangers of the spying game. Introduced to the world of espionage more than 30 years ago, he rose through the ranks -- she rose through the ranks to the first female head of Mi5. She rose through the ranks to become made covert visit to 9am one morning to shed some light on the secret world of a spy master, a world where the title Dame might be a disguise itself. If you had been granted a Damehood, do you use the title? No. I don't use it a great deal but some people like to do it because there it is. But I don't use it in my writing, I just call myself Stella Rimington. Is it correct to refer to you or call you Dame Stella? Some call me Mrs Dame and it's all very confusing. One of those most complicated titles. Are we safe to call you Stella today? You ought to know about it because you have Dame Edna. She's special and dodgy. Let's talk about

intelligence agencies and Mi5 and your life. Firstly, recently, was interesting, the media got hold of the terrorist plot that was your life. Firstly, recently, it

thwarted in Britain, and understandably concentrated on the fear generated by such a thing. Very little was spoken about the fact that it was actually thwarted and the business of intelligence agencies. They obviously did fantastic job in this case. Is that agencies. They obviously did a part of the business that you just don't get thanked? Yes t is very much, actually. There are many successful intelligence operations that nobody ever hears about at all. On this occasion people arrested but I remember many when On this occasion people were we were working against the IRA where we knew there was a bomb plot, we stopped it with intelligence and didn't say anything about it for all kinds of often reasons because if you've got intelligence sources you want to try and preserve them for another day. One of the features in working in an intelligence agency is you have to get used to your successes not being recognised and your failures for everyone to see. You can't go home and talk to your friends about your day at the office? You can't and that is difplt. If you're leading one of those agencies, you have to remember you've got to motivate people in some way to have their successes recognised because you can't go home and say, "I've done a wonderful thing today." The public don't know about it either. We were looking that plot to blow up the planes that was thwarted. For the average person sitting out there in the audience, you'd think they knew about it for a few days but I know that generally speaking does that kind of information come in over a longer period of time? Yaugsy. Classically, you -- usually. Classically you would begin with a small snippet of information and the agency has to investigate it to take some kind of action. Nowadays with terrorism, it's usually arrests and the police go out and do the job. Then the next thing the police have to do is gather enough evidence that can be used in court because often intelligence can't and you see now in the UK, the police skrar scrambling to get together a case that can be used in court. You joined Mi5 in the late '60s and stayed 27 years? Yes. How did the emphasis change? You would have seen the Cold War with the Soviet Union and it must have changed several times over? It changed radically. It height of the Cold War. The main changed radically. It was the threat to our security came from the Soviet Union and their allies and their efforts at spying and trying to undermine Western democracies. We were dealing with terrorism because we had the IRA which began about that time. We were working these two things in paraplel and as the Cold War came to an end -- parallel and as the Cold War came to an end add the end of the '80s, the whole emphasis changed. It's the same kind of you do, whether you're working changed. It's the same kind of work against espionage or terrorism, it's about gather intelligence. Where do you get information? From the spy standing on the street corner or picking up strange radio conversations or... All those things. There are many sources of intelligence but the one still is human beings. There's intelligence but the one thing gizmos of all kinds wut it's the person deep in the heart -- but it's the person deep in the heart of the terrorist organisation who you can recruit to work for you and give you a long stream of information over a long time. Your two fiction books, which were 'Add Risk' and 'Secret Asset', the main character is the kind of intelligence agent that goes to the pub and actually speaks one on one. She is. I was reading information about yourself. And I think you were talking about your first assignment or when you were in training that they'd actually do that, send you down to the local hotel to talk to somebody. That was the test. I went on this course. The first exercise was thought designed for women at all. You had to go into a pub and use some cover story about who you were and what you were doing, chat up anybody you liked in the pub and try and find out as much as you possibly could about them. Hopeless operation for a woman, of course, because this guy I was chatting up was thinking I was something quite different from an intelligence agent. When the guy from the course came in to try and blow your cover. That was the training, it's changed a bit now. It was very sexest when you first became involved. It's a miracle a woman ever headed up the organisation. It was a male-dominated world and women were second class. You were OK to sit at the desk and look after the papers. Support your man in other words because the men were sharp end. That gradually changed words because the men were the and now women are doing all the work at the service. Was it because you were woman that they decided to make that news public? No, it wasn't because I was a woman, because it was the first one appointed under the laws. But it was because I was a woman that it became a sensation. The British tabloids thought it was fantastic. And we didn't issue a photograph because the IRA was very busy on the streets of London. They had this startling announcement and no photograph to go with it. So we got absolutely bombarded with the tabloid press trying to get photographs. How did you cope because you have kids? You were a single mother at that stage? One of my daughters was living at home. She was about 17 at the time. She said she didn't know who to be scared of, the press at the front said she didn't know who to be more door or the possibility of the IRA creeping up the stairs at the back. In the end we had to go underground, sell our house because of all the publicity. How do you kind of reassure your kids it's OK? It's difficult, actually. We talk it a lot now because my kids are difficult, actually. We talk about now in their 30s and we laugh about those days but it was difficult for her, particularly. And the other those days but it was difficult for one was at university who got bombarded by people with microphones. A large part of your bombarded by people with

life has been lived in secrecy. When that life stopped, when you left Mi5, how does a life of secrecy affect you tryinging to be normal now? Now I think I've got over it and I have because writing books. It took several years to get my life back in my own over it and I have because I'm

hands so I felt I was in control, not being controlled. Because the security obviously, that goes on for at least a bit. You're not really in charge of your life and it is difficult. The book you wrote about, you copped an awful lot of grief over it. An act of betrayal. Was it that? No. It wasn't. I wasn't going to write about the nation's secrets having spent 27 years looking after them. But, again, there were people Whitehall which is our Ministry of again, there were people in Defence who thought they'd make a bit of publicity about this. When I Defence who thought they'd make a sent in the draft for clearance they put it in a brown paper envelope and sent it to the 'Sun'. So that started all this publicity and furore. Very misplaced because that's a book about my life as a mother. Very much so. As a and all those things. You would mother. Very much so. As a woman

have been a target therefore, as director general of the Mi5 have been a target therefore, as talking about IRA being very director general of the Mi5 and evident, prevalent at that time, you would be regarded as a target? In those days, yes. They were aiming at anybody connected with the British state. They wanted to get the Brits out of Northern Ireland. I had to have the kind of security that you need in those circumstances. It made it worse for the girls, as you can imagine. You've written this book, which is your latest, plus an earlier book. Fictional accounts of a spy, which is a rollicking read because know all the inside business. You is a rollicking read because you know the way it works. That's what I can bring to fiction writing is a knowledge of how it works even though the plots are fictional, of course. Now it's time for a quick trip down the shopping aisle. Have you ever wanted to buy yourself or your family a digital video camera but were put off by the price? Not only are some of the digital video cameras expensive, a lot of them are bulky too. We're about to change all of that. This is the 4 mega pixel Minima -- Mini Magic camera and camcorder. It's all wrapped up in one affordable unit. It's power packed with features, including digital zoom state-of-the-art LCD colour display. You can literally take it anywhere. including digital zoom and

It folds up, pop it in your pocket, your handbag or the glove box of your car. Now you'll never miss out on capturing a special moment because it will always be close by. Best of all, it's light weight and runs on standard batteries, so it's totally portable. Now you can forget about those expensive charge packs, leads and other bulky and complicated stuff that gets the way. Your Mini Madgesic so much and complicated stuff that gets in more than a camcorder because it doubles up as a digital camera too. You can record video footage and take holiday snaps. You can use it as a web cam and as a digital audio voice recorder too. It has a 4 times digital zoom, a built-in 32 mega byte flash memory and it comes with a camera case, strap, USB cables, installation CD and a full set of instructions. You're probably thinking, "I'd love to have one of these." But you probably thinking that they're really expensive. Take a look at this. Some camcorders can easily cost over $750. And digital cameras can cost over $500. Don't the Miniy Magic camcorder is both a can cost over $500. Don't forget, camcorder and a digital camera combined in one neat unit. Now the good news is, you're not going to pay $1,250 for this little beauty, good news is, you're not going to it's not going to cost you $1,000 or even $750, in fact, the deal it's not going to cost you $1,000 have for you today is so red hot, we even give you 30 days to shop or even $750, in fact, the deal we

around to see if you can find better value. If you do, send it back to us within 30 day and we'll gladly give you your money back less delivery. Here's that red hot deal you've been waiting for. If you always wanned to buy a camcorder or a digital camera but found them too expensive, then things are about to change. The Miniy Magic camcorder can be yours for five easy payments of $frin.95 plus delivery, less -- 45.95 plus delivery. They can easily cost over $750. Our Global Shop Direct offer is less than half that amount and it comes with a 12 month warranty. You get our amazing Mini Magic camcorder for half the amount the stores, plus it comes with our camcorder for half the amount in

12-month warranty and 30-day money back guarantee. We'll do even better than that. If you call today and pay in full with your card, we're not going to give you and pay in full with your credit one Mini Magic camcorder, we'll give you a second one free. Buy one, get one free. Call us now. With two of these beauties, you can have in the car and one for your home. of these beauties, you can have one

Or you can give one away as a great gift. This is not going to last long because these are limited stocks. Call us right now. And don't forget to ask our operators about our optional recharger kit and the optional about our optional battery

memory upgrade. They are sold separately. Call now and don't forget when you pay in full by credit card, you'll second Mini camcorder for free. credit card, you'll receive a

That number below. After the break, we'll head to the

It's a fresh finish now -e end of this week. It's a salad, perfect for these warm days. Not just any old this week. It's a salad, perfect

When I had my cafe I had a customer and he used to come in and say, "Have you got the nice salad today?" It's nice because it's from Nice. You were saying earlier that you actually had a Nice salad? I did in Nice. How glamorous. Some people aren't sure whether it should be real tuna or tinned tuna and you can do either but the one I had in Nice was definitely real tuna, as I sat there drinking a crunchy chardonnay, looking out over the harbour looking at super yachts in a previous life. Oh, well. Where we didn't discuss blisters. Move on. Move on. Both of you. Thank you to everyone who is sending in emails telling me how to get rid of my sprinter. No-one's interested. No-one has sent in. People are more caring than you. That's not fair but maybe. Harsh but fair. Probably. I'm going home today after this to play with my new, I have a bag beautiful things from the kitsch toon take home to M rierbgs a. How play with my new, I have a bag of

come you got a bag? I can't tell you. It's a secret. They're great those little things. She's having a great time. The salad, so easy. Yes, the reason we're here. I might make the dressing first because we'll sit that around for a while. In there, I'll get rid of that... A hairy fish. Do you like hairy fish? I'm not a fan but I don't mind the flavour. Exactly. Anchovies. I couldn't follow a whole one. Another sprinter. In a sprinter in my throat. Because of its big Right. If you mash it it my throat. Because of its big bones. disappear and you can obviously Right. If you mash it it will chop it. It just... Mashed fish and oil. You're adding to the oil? Because if people don't particularly like anchovies, they don't really know it's in there. How devious of you. That's awful. Do you think so? That's it. That's right? Can I have those spinach leaves in there? And other thing is hard boiled eggs and the easiest way to open a hard boiled egg, and this does depend on whether they're fresh or not and this one has been sitting around for a while and the shell will peel off. 10 minutes I reckon. You just roll it? Roll it so all the shell crumbles. Are you going to put it in there? If you want me to. Don't worry. That's OK. Can you throw the tomatoes in to that bowl? These are cherry tomatoes. I love growing these. They taste better at home. Frplgt they're so much sweeter. You have a vegie garden, don'ts you, David. Yeah. I'm glad it's Friday I'll start talking about sprinters again. I I have blanched these and I like to keep them crunchy. Do you keep them that crunchy for men? You have to work out what your kids are up to. I like to keep the colour and Mia does like the crunch. And to keep them like that... It would be great to feed your 18-month-old Nice salad. She's up for anything. You put them in a bowl of water. To To stop them cooking. Tuna steak is this size. I like to middle bit rare. Two or three minutes on each side. In to there this size. I like to keep the

as well. Little ligurian olives. It's that style. Isn't there something called little green apples? Little brown jug. You're the muso. Maybe you could play it for us. I don't know how traditional that is, but I like the mint. That's news to me but that would work. If you can give that a toss, Kim. I'll drop them. I can only do one implement at a time. Potatoes you still want to keep firm. Throw them in? Yes. I have a question for you. I love making chips at home , we get fish and do our home-made chips but what's the best potato to cut in to the fish and chip shop chips? I don't know, I don't make chips. I reckon these will be good. Let's get it on to the plate. Right. I'll move my cup of tea. I'll get this tuna. This is one I've cooked earlier. Righto. Let's go. Chuck it in to that on there. Be nice with it. I look forward to the day you open your restaurant. It won't look pretty but it will taste alright. Quickly. Very important. There we go. Might have to have some tuna. You've got great big pieces of it. Generally you put pepper on it. Lovely. There we go. Look what he does. If you would like a copy of today's recipe or any other creations this week, all you have to do is log on to the website. Not bad but it's not a typical. No beans. You hid the beans from me. God, you ratbag. Go and spear a piece of tuna with a bean. Excuse fingers. The lack of cutlery didn't stop us wolfing that little treat down. Stick around. Well, here's James to talk about Well, here's James to talk about the Magic Bullet and a summer offer. Hi. What a summer the Magic Bullet and a special offer. Write down this number. Listen to this, they're giving away Magic Bullets for free but you better call now. The phone loans are going to grow crazy when you ring now and order the original Magic Bullet 17 piece set, Danoz Direct will gifrbg you another Magic Bullet set free. When you buy one you get one free. Two of the Magic Bullet set free. When you buy price of one. What does the Magic Bullet do? It does everything under 10 seconds and that's why millions have been sold around the Bullet do? It does everything in

world, over 65,000 Bullets have been sold here in Australia. Look at how quickly you can make coffee grind in just seconds. Are you excited? Yes. You can make a salsa in seconds. Perfect in summer. Would you like to make a slushy for the kids? A bit of cordial together and ice, and you have a slushy in seconds. A tpwregs healthy smoothie at home, you can do it -- fresh healthy smoothie at home, you can do it in seconds. I'd like to taste that. You think it would make a do it in seconds. I'd like to taste

great gift? Of korsz. You can chop garlic in seconds, fat free bean dips, you can create your own salsa and even cook in your Magic Bullet. You can make pasta sauces in seconds without dirtying a sinal pot or pan. It's perfect for ice seconds without dirtying a sinal coffees and desserts. Turn frozen pot or pan. It's perfect for ice fruit and orange juice into fruit and orange juice into fat free sorbay. You can do all this in under 10 seconds each. Call now and you'll get the complete 17-piece Magic Bullet system. It includes two heavy duty Magic Bullet cups, blades, shaker lids, resealable stay fresh lids and everything but the motor is dish washer safe. It can clean up in less than 10 seconds too. Plus your Magic comes with the original cook book. seconds too. Plus your Magic Bullet It's got over 60 recipes and only the original Magic Bullet comes with this set of four self-blending party mugs. OK. What more can you tell us? Anything more? Heaps. Take a listen to this and listen to what these people had to say. What do you like about the Magic Bullet? It's small and compact. Really small. Easy to use. Convenient. You It's small and compact. Really can do everything in two seconds. small. Easy to use. Convenient. You

Is it the juicer, the blender or the four party mugchise is the best? The juicer. Blender. All them. Slurpies. My daughter loves best? The juicer. Blender. All of slurpies. Cocktails. Cocktails. What would you use the blender for? Cocktails. Smoothies. You can make anything. Would you buy a processor, a blender, chopper and grater for $300 or would you buy the Bullet? The Magic Bullet. The Magic Bullet. How much does it cost? $300 or would you buy the Magic

Don't spend hundreds of dollars on other bulky appliances, call now. You'll get the original Magic Bullet system including the four party mugs and cook book for three payments of $55 plus postage and handling. All you'll pay, that's not all you'll get, call right now and you'll get the blender attach want plus the juice extractor kit free. It will save you hundreds of dollars if you have to buy a blender and juicer in shops. Does that mean we get two free blenders? Yes. When you buy one you'll get one free. Two of the price of one. Thank you, James. After the break, one of Malta's finest sons.

One of Australia's finest, singer song writers, Joe Camilleri released an album. Is there such a thing as Maltese reggae? There is now. You're both Maltese and this album is fabulous. All the photographs here are of Malta. There is a picture of my mum on the back too. My mum on a vespa. It is There is a picture of my mum on the too. Is there a Maltese influence to your reggae? I don't think so. I think the think the title track lime'Limestone', was a travel log of all the things you could do in Malta and see. It was a very easy thing to write. It was almost like we were picking out just the words from above us. And it fell in to place. But the reason why we made this record was a love affair for lovers rock, reggae music that we both shared. And the song 'Limestone' happened to fall in place. There's a connection with the island life. Malta is a very small island. What's it like? The rocky outcrop, basically. It's all limestone in the Mediterranean. Right in between Europe and Africa. You've got this little Everyone's been through it and it's got heritage and history there, You've got this little jewel.

there's temples there that are older than the Stonehenge. What kind of music comes out of Malta? Country sort of... Country. Folk. Folk music. And things have moved on a little bit. They liked the Beatles for about 50 years and have moved on. It's a great destination for a lot of European people end up in Malta. There's lots of those modern discos and things that go with it, what kids like. I don't know if there's many bands playing reggae in Malta but they appreciate that. They have lots of jazz. jazz festival there. It's quite big. In Australia there aren't that many that. They have lots of jazz. The

bands playing reggae. You were the founder of Australian reggae? It turned out that way. One of my favourite bands seriously was The Falcons, probably the greatest live band of the time was Joe's band. You were doing that song, 'So Young'. That's right. That had that feeling. But I was turned on by Ross Wilson. Ross Wilson actually came back from Jamaica with a song called 'I'm In A Dancing Mood'. gave me a sinal by Delroy Wilson and I couldn't get enough of it. I called 'I'm In A Dancing Mood'. He

took it to the rehearsal and we played that. Out of that I got involved in that music and started writing songs. At that time wasn't even writing songs. Wayne writing songs. At that time I Ber, it was doing all the writing for that band. I had a band, an R & brbs band, we kind of crashed -- B band, we kind of crashed the two things together and got examine yien In', the wasn't a things together and got 'Shape reggae thing. That thing. And that's... It's a happiness, really. With reggae, what is that thing? The beat's on the other foot. Only a musician can do. How did this collaboration between the two of you happen because you adore each other? We've both been doing music. I got a phone call from Joe, we had a song out called 'Hail That Taxi' and Joe rang up and said, "Love the tune." It was beautiful to receive the phone call from him. And having that respect for him as well, it was a... And then we just got together and ended up playing on one of your records. Was doing a song for Adam Harvey on his first album, a country artist, and I asked him if he would play drums and we hit it off. A nice feeling. With reggae as the sort of focus point for talking and then we started the label together based on that. I'm not a musician but I often hear musicians talk about that bit of magic that happens S. that what you guys had? I let him dee what he wants to do and it there. I had one small idea that we can sing on each other's songs dee what he wants to do and leave

and as long as the parameter was lovers' rock music. It was a joyous thing to do. We had a lot of fun doing it. It was painless. There was no grief. And every time we came together, it was just an easy feeling and a nice thing to do. We had UB40 on earlier in the week and we were talking about the different names for reggae. This style is lovers' rock. Please tell me what that is? We were playing with UB40 last night. It was great. Lovers' rock is not the political side of reggae. So I couldn't, as much as I like that, I felt it wasn't part of my culture. And I felt that pretty songs were something that I was attracted to. Somethings like 'I'm Pin A Dancing Mood' and '98 Degrees In The Shade'. Nothing to do with the fact reggae has that. Lovers' rock. What happened with reggae, in 1963, scar music burst on to the scene and very uptempo. And apparently there was really hot summers happened and they told the DJs to was really hot summers that

slow down in music because it became hot. And then because of that sort of rhythm, it was a bit romantic and then they do sort of love songs over those particular rhythms with chords that were more sympathetic. It's a whole study. You're going to stick around and play for us. Fortunately we'll see it in action. Thank you both for coming in. Time now for a spin in the Summertime shopping cart. Would you love the luxury, the comfort and the convenience of a reclining bed in your own home? If you've ever looked at their prices, well, you probably agree they're well out of the reach of most of us. In fact, it would be quite easy to spend $4,000 or $5,000 just for an average recliner bed. And some models can cost up to $10,000. Well, you can relax because I'm going to let you in on a little secret. Now you can enjoy the benefits of a reclining bed in your own home without spending a led of money. Thanks to the Magic Recliner, this ingenious invention allows you to turn your existing bed into an all-purpose versatile adjustable bed in a matter of seconds. Just look at this. Would you love the luxury and convenience of a reclining bed in your home? The only problem is it would be quite easy to spend $4,000 to $5,000 just for an average recliner and some models could cost up to $10,000. Now you can enjoy the benefits of a reclining bed with the Magic Recliner. Are you uncomfortable when you try to watch TV and have sleepless nights? Now with the comn magic Recliner, you can comfortable and relaxed. It helps magic Recliner, you can be to support your head, neck, shoulders and back. I'm reading I have to stack four shoulders and back. Usually when pillows. This is so comfortable, I just recline and it's very conforming to my neck, especially in the shoulders. My lower back feels really comfortable. In fact, it works on any type of matress. Inner spring, foam, latex, spring, twin, queen or king. Press the button and relax. Use the remote control to raise or lower your recliner in just a few seconds to the comfort level you prefer and the matress always stays put. Forget about hunching over pillows or leaning against a hard headboard. You can enjoy reading, watching TV and even breakfast in bed in a whole new level of comfort and affordability. It can make your lower body relaxed andinable. Place it under your matress, any matress, -- comfortable. Place it -t-t under your matress, it is extremely comfortable. Instead of leaning up against a hard wall or a head board, you can lean against a cushion against a hard wall or a head board, backing that's just so comfortable and relaxing. The Magic Recliner is so luxurious and comfortable that once you use it, you'll wonder why you didn't get one sooner. They're ideal for watching TV or working on the laptop or how about breakfast in bed? Take a look at this. Heres rar second-hand recliner bed for in bed? Take a look at this. Heres sale on the Internet for $975. With our exclusive TV offer, you even pay a fraction of that. So make sure you call the number below. our exclusive TV offer, you won't

The Magic Recliner is only available from Global Shop Direct and the only way to get one is to call now. Forget spending possibly thousands on expensive reclining beds, it's so easy and when you buy it now, we'll deliver it to your door for two monthly payments of it now, we'll deliver it to your $39.95 plus delivery. Kwhrie not get one for every bed in the house? We know you'll love the extreme comfort of the Magic Recliner. Use it on your bed and if you don't love the comfort and support it gives you, send it back within 30 days for a full refund of the purchase price less delivery. you buy the Magic Recliner now, be sure to ask our operator how purchase price less delivery. When

can save $60 on a memory pillow. Don't miss out on this sure to ask our operator how you

can save $60 on a memory foam

luxury and comfort. Call now. Back after the break with some more of the marvellous Mr Joe Camilleri. A horror day ahead for residents of the Adelaide Hills firefighters struggling to contain a massive blaze

threatening dozens of homes. A man has been shot dead and a police officer left in hospital after a dramatic high-speed chase through Perth.

And the Beckhams are taking on Hollywood the former England soccer captain announcing he's leaving Real Madrid for the LA Galaxy. Details at 11:00. As promised, Joe Camilleri and Nicky Bomba. SONG: # Good morning, Joe. # Hello. # Suzanne, be aware of the devil # Don't let it spoil your heart # Suzanne be aware of the devil # Didn't I hear you say we've got to part # Didn't you say let's go forward? # Didn't hear you say you've got someone new # Did you say you like the colour of his shoes # I don't know what's going on # You're not the girl I used to # Turning my head upside down # Greeting me with a frown know

# Suzanne be aware of the devil # Don't let it spoil your heart # Suzanne, be aware of the devil # Don't let it pull us apart # Didn't hear you say you're leaving town # You say you're making it around # Didn't I hear you say you're serious # Did you say it's all # You won't change the dream # All the things we planned and schemed # Do you really want to go # Or is this just an overnight blow # Suzanne, beware of the devil # Don't let it spoil your heart # Suzanne beware of the devil # Don't let it pull us apart # Tszyu zan, don't let us spoil your -- Suzanne, don't let us spoil your heart - don't let it pull us apart # Wake up in the morning # Going to bed # I was late as usual # Good morning, good morning # Suzanne, beware of the # Don't let it # Don't let it spoil your heart # Suzanne, beware of the devil, # Suzanne, beware of the devil

don't let it pull us apart # Oh, yeah. That was fantastic. Lovely, nice work. You'll be tapping your foot for the rest of the day, as you will be if listen to the album. The album is called 'Limestone'. More after this. the day, as you will be if you

Craig from Bessemer is with me in the kitchen this morning with a great new summer offer. This food, Craig, looks and snells delicious. It sure does and it is and quality Bessemer cookware makes it so easy to cook mouth-watering food just like this. Be sure to write down Bessemer's phone number. Because this healthy cook Bessemer ridged grillit and nylon tongs and the Country Kitchen casserole are part of a great summer offer that's available to the in the 200 people who get on the phone and order from of a great summer offer that's only

Bessemer today. How does it work? Simple. See how the ridges away the fat and oil which is ideal Simple. See how the ridges drain for cooking a piece of Atlantic salmon like this. You've got to get on the phone right now because you'll only receive the free products if you're one of the first 200 people to order today. Let me ask you a couple of questions - do you love you love the exciting flavour oofz spicy Thai stir fry? What about traditional succulent lamb roast? spicy Thai stir fry? What about a If you love cooking you'll love cooking with Bessemer. When you order direct today, we have a fantastic summer offer so you can get your own Bessemer cookware set for less than half the normal retail price because you'll receive two free pieces of Bessemer' top the range cookware which includes our 3-litre Country Kitchen two free pieces of Bessemer' top of

casserole free. But remember, this offer is only available to the first 200 customers who order today. Take us through the various cookware products? Bessemer has a cookware product for every job, including saucepans, frypans, casseroles, baking dishes, woks, specialty cookware and so much more. It's hand-made and comes with a 5-year guarantee for peace of mind. The bay sides and the interchangable lid are cast from the same thick material so that heat is dib tributed evenly throughout the cooking. -- distributed evenly throughout the cooking. What's extraordinary I'm still cooking with the same cooking. What's extraordinary is Bessemer I bought 10 years ago. It's an amazing quality product. The last thing I want to do is be scrubbing pots and pans with two little kids at home at the end of the day. With Bessemer, rinse with warm soapy water and it's done. Healthy cook is really important. I don't have to -- cookie is really porpbtd. I don't have to add fats and oils. Bessemer cookware has been enjoyed in kitchens for 40 years. The finish of Bessemer has gotten better as well. The terrific heat resistant handles as well. You told us about a special summer offer? You can have this fantastic Bessemer essentials set, including the 28-centimetre thick cast aluminium fry pan. The matching 28-centimetre cast aluminium lid, plus the 4-piece Bessemer utensil set for only two 299. This offer gets better -- $299. This offer gets better because when you order now, you'll get the casserole base and look, the lid from the fry pan fits the 3-litre Country Kitchen casserole and we'll add the ridge grillit valued at $199. That's $600 coo worth of Bessemer product. Yours for just $299, plus delivery when your one of the first 200 people to order today. Bessemer is available in classic flame or and backed by a 5-year warranty. If available in classic flame or ebony you're looking for extra why not become a distributer? To find out more information, call you're looking for extra income,

of our operators. They'll give you all the details on how you can do find out more information, call one

this. Call now: don't miss out on this incredible summer offer. Thank you Craig, for joining us from Bessemer.

It is the season of fine weather when we all should get out of the house and into the great wide yonder. Get some leg work in, hot-footed, beat the rocks, burn a little shoe leather. He means a walk. In order to heed such sage little shoe leather. He means take advice, we gave Kristy Malthouse a pair of soles and said get a wriggle on. I'm about to do one of my favourite things and that's to do bush walking. I have a bush walking body with me and it is Prue. First of all, tell us what actually qualifies as bush walking? Do we have to travel three hours to go? Absolutely not. Bush walking is available anywhere where there's bush that you can go walking. Close to the cities is fantastic parklands or you can venture out couple of hours from the city and parklands or you can venture out a go to some of the couple of hours from the city and go to some of the most spectacular remote places. It's the middle of winter, lucky we have a nice day in Melbourne. No mud around. When is the best time to go walking? When the weather is nice. We're lucky today, being winter. But in the weather is nice. We're very spring, and autumn, they're great times to go and summer is an awesome time as well. You have make sure you're not going on a awesome time as well. You have to

really hot day but winter can be fantastic. You have to be more prepared to rug pup and get wet. Yeah, might want to take an umbrella perhaps. Absolutely. Let's start walking. When you go walking you shouldn't go on your own, you should have a body or start walking. When you go bush

partner with you. -- buddy or partner with you. Bush walking is fantastic. It's free to do. That's one of the best things about it. Today we're on this great wide path. That's great for people with prams or kwheelchairs. Bush walk king be accessible to lots of different people. You can go out to some remote tracks that are a bit more rug udif you've got more fitness. Walking can be so good for your fitness, what about bushwalking, I imagine it's got even extra benefits because you're walking up hills and perhaps climbing over imagine it's got even extra

some rocks? Absolutely. That's the great thing about planning your bushwalks. You can plan to go terrain. Or your butt. We're both carrying backpacks with us. Not too bushwalks. You can plan to go into

heavy because you don't want them to be too heavy. Why don't you show me what you've got in them? are essential items you need to take, as well as telling people me what you've got in them? There

where you're going and perhaps what time you're expected to be home. Definitely. Make someone know where you're going and when you exexpect to get back. You have to take a couple of essentials. Taking enough water. You need to take add least a litre of water. And a first-aid kit. A map of where you're heading off to. Someone like me who has no sense of direction, I definitely need a map. And because we're in sense of direction, I definitely Australia, such a hot, dry environment, take a bit of sunscreen as well. Hopefully Kristy's blisters have healed now. We take a walk around the tropics right after this.

New AJAX Professional Ultra Bathroom. Here's a test - my boy's working on cars. Just watch.

AJAX Professional removes tough grease and grime easily. Wow! Anything tougher? The soap scum you find here and here. AJAX Professional Ultra Bathroom is 50% tougher on soap scum than the leading soap scum spray. Incredible! New AJAX Professional Ultra Bathroom. Put it to the test in your bathroom.

It's like another country, different weather, different people, different language. However, our different weather, different people, esteemed colleague and -s no doubt able to visit the glorious coastal sinew. The seafood banquet and palm treed laden resort. Here she Close your eyes and imagine the perfect combination. A charming seaside village that has full-on resort luxury and looks right over the Great Barrier Reef. Open them and welcome to Palm Cove in Far North Queensland. This very pretty part of the world is nearly 2,000 kilometres from Brisbane and popular with anglers, sailors and kilometres from Brisbane and is divers, as well as those who want divers, as well as those who want a bit of solitude. The temperature stays pretty constant all-year round. It really is the perfect holiday destination and it's got round. It really is the perfect the perfect place to stay. This is the pinnacle in resort luxury, the Outrigger Beach Club and Spa at Palm Cove. It offers absolutely everything for the guest, including a really nice way of being collected. TRANQUIL MUSIC PLAYS A FANTASTIC WAY TO EXPLORE IS XPBS A FANTASTIC WAY TO This is the oldest tropical rainforest in the world and the tranquility and This is the oldest surviving

peacefulness are awe-inspiring. The most spectacular way to see the rainforsrs with skyrail. The -- rainforest is with skyrail. The views are out of this world. rainforsrs with skyrail. The --

It's a brand new day in paradise and it's time to catch the train to work. Well, it's not really to work. The railway train winds through 15 tunnels and over thribs bridges as it travels along the 90-minute train work. This has got to be the best commute to work I've ever had. You're room awaits at the Outrigger Beach Club and Spa at Palm Cove. The best way to get to Far North Queensland is with Virgin Blue who fly there daily. Make a day on the cruise. And don't miss the chance to ride the Kuranda train and Skyrail. Maybe no longer one of Queensland's best-kept secrets but certainly its most beautiful. We'll see you here soon. And we'll have more Summertime right after this. see you here soon. And we'll have Every time you're on the road, you're gambling that the point around you are just as good a driver as you are but that's a gamble you can't always win. If you lose, this is where your car could end up. And that's why you need car insurance but you don't need to pay higher premiums just because other people can't drive properly, not higher premiums just because other anymore. Because Budget Direct is here to change the way insurance operates in Australia. Budget Direct's underwriting is more comprehensive than most other insurers, they're very focused on ensuring that the individuals they choose to insure are identified accurately and assessed correctly. So they're able to offer good-quality drivers competitive rates. Apart from great good-quality drivers more prices and great service, Budget Direct also offers some great competitive rates. Apart from great

benefits. You can nominate your preferred repairer, get someone you trust to fix your car. Pay either monthly or annually. It's up to you. And whatever suits your budget. You never have to fill in a form, monthly or annually. It's up to you.

everything is done over the phone. It's so convenient. If you're a better driver than most, don't pay for the others. Give Budget Direct a call today for a no-obligation free quote. It will only take a a call today for a no-obligation minutes and could save you a fortune. To have all your questions free quote. It will only take a few

answered, ring now. If you don't, it's just like throwing your money away. There's no obligation and it's free. Except for mobiles, you're not even paying for the phone call. So give them a ring now. Because there's a lot of bad drivers out there, but you're not one of them. After the break, parenting expert Dr John Irvine with some handy hints during that time before the kids go back to school.

The kids are mean, I'm not going to school. If this is part of your morning routeine, salvation is at hand in the form of Dr John Irvine. That's a big call. Kid can get tummy migraines. They can get them. Don't tell my kids that. Don't be listening. I must read out this email we received. "Hoping you can help me sort out my 6-year-old grandson. He won't cooperate. He has to catch a bus at 8:09. "I feel sick, I'm not going." His mum dresses him and gets him to eat a little. He's so small, he really needs his morning nourishment. He goes off quite willingly and in the afternoon he comes home with a but the mornings are so upsetting afternoon he comes home with a star for everyone. Thank you for that. Every family watching this will be able to relate to this. Did you ever have this problem? My is sometimes difficult to get off to school. What have you found is ever have this problem? My daughter

the reason for that? I haven't found it yet. You have to become a detective. If it's recent you have to go, "What's going on here that this is not a pattern they're usually used to. Is something affecting them in the playground or the classroom." Ear even on the bus. Yeah. -- or even on the bus. Yeah. First you do a medical check to make sure there's nothing going on there that's undetected. Then you do a home check. What's happening at home? The pace or the pressure. Our families are going so fast now. By the time the kids wake up, eat up, shut up and buckle up then they get to school and they're fed up. The pressure in the mornings now is so jam packed, some of the kids it's all too much and so jam packed, some of the kids say not get aglot of parental attention it's all too much and if they're at night. They'll do anything to be able to get a little bit of one to one. Even if it is anything to try and put you back in your place. The first thing you've got to do is become a bit of a detective in terms of what are the dynamics at home? Is there too much pace, is the pressure in the morning such the whole tone's wrong. It's just, go, go, go. You do home, school, play ground and classroom, then, as you said, Dave, the transition, is it something in the bus? Some of the checks with yourself and the teacher. You can ask the teacher to get information on and ask is it school sicky he is throwing or the get information on and ask is it a separation anxiety which the kids are having an enormous struggle with that. That's a very real problem. Parents come to me all the time saying, "My kid won't go to school." 60% of separation anxiety is parent-based. The kid's reading the vibes from Mum or Dad and could be for a lot oaf reasons. It could be that the kid's been sick or that this is mysh my last child or whatever it is. Kids read that, 90% of what kids pick up from us is in non-verbal. Body language and all that stuff. You have to show confidence to the child that they're fine. Some parents are nervous or anxious, then you think cleverly. You get together with another mum and the two of you take the kids and you get another mum take them. Just yesterday to a the kids and you get another mum to family, "I want Dad in on the for the next four weeks." Dad gets the kid to school. When the tummy family, "I want Dad in on the act

goes tight, they promise at night they'll be good and comes the morning and they know it's irrational but any sort of fear it tightens them up. I have to break the dynamic with another parent coming in or a grandparent taking the kid to school. That's something special. A treat to look forward to. It can be but it's it's often between one parent and the child. You've got to change the dynamic. Somehow you've got to change it, giving the kids super things to do when they get to school. It sometimes works with soft avoidance. when they get to school. It You have to do this or hand that out. With the kids who have a real anxious almost phobia about it, you've got to change the whole dynamic so that it works. Look at the dynamic, I'm saying to every family, look at your done dynamics there, if there's too much pressure and pace, you're going to have problems in the morning. the point Dennis makes, the kid won't eat? You made a good point problems in the morning. What about

that no kid in the area is like 3 have died of starvation, but do kids need sometimes, they're not going to eat, you need to change their routine of food and so on? All the pace and pressure, you can do a lot of pre-organising the night before with the uniforms and what they're going to take. A lot of times kids can't eat in the morning, it's because the tummy's tight and when the tummy's tight, the gastric juices dry up and you're not hungry. What should you do? Take the pressure off and see if you can find one or two things that they really like. Even if you can get fluid in to them. Milkshakes are good. That can offer settle them. Pressure and pace. Back on the other side of this. We call it junk mail because most of it goes straight into the recycling bin. But every so often you find a diamond in the rough. A car insurance company that could save you hundreds of dollars on your premiums. Budget Direct believes good drivers shouldn't have to subsidise bad, high-risk drivers. So if you're over 25, have a driving history and drive a So if you're over 25, have a good standard vehicle, then you could save hundreds of dollars each year on your car insurance with Budget Direct. Just like these real customers who are doing exactly that. And it's not just customers who are recognising the savings. 'Money' magazine recently featured a study that found over 90% of the time Budget Direct offered the best quoted price for comprehensive car insurance for average Australian good drivers. Of course, money isn't the only thing to consider when you're choosing car insurance. You also want the best options and peace of mind as well. With Budget Direct, you get a 21-day moneyback guarantee, as long as you haven't made a claim, you have three weeks to change your mind. There's no paper work to fill out, ever, even when you make a claim. You can pay monthly or yearly, kwhaufrb suits your budget. Most importantly, you can nominate your preferred repairer. So it's got to be worth your while to find out what Budget Direct can do for you. Give them a call today. It will only take a few minutes and you could save hundreds. So, contact Budget Direct today and get a fast quote. Even if your insurance isn't due, you can switch policies immediately and saving. What have you got to lose? policies immediately and start Nothing. In fact, you could save hundreds. Your child comes home from school and says, "I want to help the poor." lovely idea. A community walk perhaps, a weekend starvearbsthon but when he packs his bags to go to the Philippines, what do you do? We met a mother who did that. She flew the family coup to help the underprivileged. How do you get this sort of enthusiasm? What do you say when your son says that? Well, he wasn't really stoppable. And we didn't want to stop him. What he wanted stoppable. And we didn't really

do was such a fabulous thing and want to stop him. What he wanted to there are risks here and there. Right from the very beginning he had enormous passion and we wanted to support him like all of our children. The Oak Tree Foundation which you set up is an aid organisation and it's run by young people. I think you kick them all out at the age of 26. Was this something that was always there? When did you notice he was utterly altruistic? I don't know if I ever described him as that or him either. But certainly when he started doing the 40-hour Famine and got the greatest amount for the State and things like that, we thought he had fire in his belly but he kept growing and growing. How do you nurture it as a mum, it's a great quality? You nurture it supporting them, by giving them unconditional positive regard for quality? You nurture it by

whatever they want to do, provided it's safe and helpful to the community. And you just love them. Be there for them. Cuer clearly a community. And you just love them. man -- you're clearly a man of great faith and great hope doofplt you despair at the level of disease and poverty and war and terrorism in the world? I think that when you consider the amount of poverty in the world, the fact that a child dies every three seconds due to causes that are preventable, it makes you go, "What kind of world are we living in." but at the same time I'm so filled with this huge sense of encouragement when I see the passion of young people. This morning I was at a high school and there were like 200 students that got up at sixam this morning to help us with -- 6am this morning to help us with a documentary. There's such dedication amongst people all around Australia. We such dedication amongst young have like 3,000 volunteers around Australia now. You go, "Man, we really can change the world." We often talk about this, on the couch and also in the office afterwards about how impressed we are the and also in the office afterwards

younger generation, the generation that comes behind us, who seem so passionate about this very thing, about aid, eradicating poverty their care for the environment, about aid, eradicating poverty and which seems to have passed us by. Is that the case, do you think? Are you frustrated by older generations, they haven't done you frustrated by older enough? I'm not frustrated by older generations but I guess I'm excited to see that older generations are increasingly supporting younger generations. The thing about my generation, our generation, is that we have the ability to end world poverty. We have a framework to do so. We even have the creativity, the scientific research, we have enough mun a. There's enough wealth in the world. So forming strong intergenerational partnerships can be really powerful through mentoring, the support partnerships can be really powerful has given me and the support through mentoring, the support mum

family and community. Great things has given me and the support of can happen. Let's talk about the Oaktree Foundation. What does it do? Ultimately every young person in the world would have a good education, that's the vision. We started three years ago with young people here in Melbourne and we have grown in the last three started three years ago with 30

years to have over 3,500 volunteers around the world. Young people under the age of 26 who are providing young people in the developing world with access to education. We're now working in the Philippines, East Timor, developing three schools this year in East Timor. Also working in Papua New Guinea to provide access to educational opportunities and across South Africa, including Ghana and West Africa where we're releasing young women from slavery and providing them with education. One of the big passions we have is we believe education is really, it's really the key to changing the world. That's something Nelson Mandela once said. That's kind of what our foundation pillars are and we want to ultimately create a worldwide movement of young people who say, "We want to make a difference." Perhaps the South African health minister might need a bit more education. She has been loom pooned. 60 international experts on HIV have called for her resignation because among many other silly things, she suggested or as part of the South African Government suggested that garlic lemons and African potatoes may be an alternative medicine anti-retro drugs. I caught up with someone and she came out to spend an alternative medicine to

some time with us in Melbourne and said at the recent aids aid conference, that kind of myth -- AIDS conference that HIV doesn't cause AIDS is rubbish. I think sometime there is are political agendas underpinning these kind of statements rather than necessarily an abshruetd belief that's true. So I think ultimate -- absolute belief that's true. So I think if we can serve to create the political will around the world, when you see things like that happen at the G8 last year where $40 billion was give