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(generated from captions) go, a brief recap of our Thanks, John. And before we

stories tonight. Kevin Rudd go, a brief recap of our top

that his wife's made an embarrassing admission

underpaid nearly 60 of her workers. And the Federal Government is facing a fresh attack over indigenous affairs. And that's attack over its record on

ABC News. Stay Kerry O'Brien ABC News. Stay with us now for Kerry O'Brien and the '7:30 Report' coming up next. We'll leave you with Melbourne Zoo to mark the 21st birthday of one of its Sumatran orang-outangs.

Closed Captions by CSI

welcome to the program on

another unpredictable day in

what has been an unpredictable

year in Australian

politics. With Kevin Rudd the

centre of attention and he's

here to discuss his quandary in

a moment. If this week was a

tennis match the first two sets

went to Labor, but John Howard

has just picked up the third

and for the moment at least the

pendulum has swung back to the Government. In the spotlight

today the business affairs of

Kevin Rudd's wife, Therese

Rein. And whether she pays her

staff Farlie. Regardless of

her statement and his public explanation late this

afternoon, a damaging story was

allowed to run for most of the

day, suggesting a double

standard in the Rudd household

on the very issue that has been

Labor's ace policy area -

fairness in the workplace. The

claim in two newspapers this

morning was that Ms Rein's

multimillion dollar employment

agency had acquired another

company and put staff on

individual contracts, not AWA,

but bought out overtime and

shift allowances for another 45

cent s an hour. Ms Rein's

company statement said they

discovered that some staff had

been paid less than they should

have and they were recompensed

in April this year. This is

not the first time that

potential for conflict between

Kevin Rudd's political

aspirations and his wife's

career has been a problem.

You've admitted embarrassment

over your wife's employment

contracts with her workers. If

she's done nothing wrong, why

are you embarrassed and why on

earth did it take so long today

to come up with an

explanation? She's in London is

the answer to the second part

of your question is London is a

long way away in a different

time zone. Not with

communications the way they are

these days? Hang on, I first

heard this issue was being

raised at 7 o'clock last night when I was off to the State of

Origin in Queensland, a matter

of high religion and went to

the game and then attended to

it when I got back. In London

it's already a different time

of the day, so at that stage

not knowing fully the facts it

took some time to put together

the detail. If nothing's wrong,

why embarrassed? Just saying we

wanted to be as thorough as we

could in terms of the detail of

these arpgts. It's not just

her in London, it was her CEO

and the chairman of the

relevant part of the company.

So it was the question of

finding the right people in a

different time zone. So by the

time we finally settled this in

terms of her company's

statement on these matters and

she'd been through the detail

it was already about 6am in the

morning London-time. It wasn't

any slackness on her part. So

why the embarrassment? Well, I

just think if you're in my

position and you're putting

yourself up as the next Prime

Minister of Australia you don't

want these sort of things to

happen. It's as simple as that

and that when it came to

Therese's arrangements and I

love her dearly and I've always

supported her in her chosen

career in business, to buy this

company which she did last

July, then obviously perhaps

greater efforts could be put in

to make sure all things were

done according to her and they

weren't. Would you agree that

45 cents an hour for losing

extras such as overtime seems a

paltry sum, element as paltry

as you're painting WorkChoices? It may vary between one individual and the

other in this company which

employs I think 200, 220

people. It's one part of a

company which Therese has been

building up since 1999. It's a

relatively recent acquisition.

I also don't know what's the

average amount of overtime

worked in this place, secondly

what's the standard hours of

work? Is it 38, 37.5, the

surrounding details I'm not

familiar with. On the face of

it, if that's an average would

you agree that 45 cents an hour

as compensation for all of

those things sounds a rather

paltry sum? What I'm pleased

about is Therese when she

became aware of this through a

review of what was going on

about five or six months after

the company was bought at the

time when the Fair Pay

Commission determined the new minimum wage and they were

trying to apply the new wage to

the different classifications

within her company and they

didn't think it was right so

they brought in external

consultants and worked out

there had been wrong

classifications, she then acted

and acted voluntarily. Isn't it

true your wife put her own name

to the deal on the letter of

offer? I'm uncertain of that.

It wouldn't surprise me if that

was the case at all. She takes

personal responsibility for

this. It's her company, her

baby. She's been building it

up for a long, long time and

this was a relatively new

acquisition. The other thing

she has said today is she'll

agreements with all of her now review all her common law

staff to make sure there's no

other problems and if there are

I'm sure appropriate

adjustments will be made. Let

me come back to the point about

the 45 centance hour. If it's

true as I understand it that

your wife's name might actually

have been on the letter of

offer that presumably outlined

and buyout of those things on

the face of it 45 cents an

hour, a rather paltry sum? We

all in large corporations and

governments for that matter,

and her company employs a total

of about 1,200 people around

the world, she'd be acting on

the basis of advice. What she

told me today was she had legal

advice from the country's most

reputable legal companies about

making sure that the basic entitlements that were

reflected in the relevant award

in terms of the salary and the

package which was constructed

on that was entirely consistent

with legal arpgts when it came

to common law agreements. Was

it also fair? Plainly her

discovery after the event was

no, but she did, she needed

time to work her way through

that. But when she did act on

it and discovered of her own

volition there was a problem,

no pressure from outside

organisations or whatever, she

did the right thing. She's a very good person, my

wife. Would you agree given how

vociferously you've tried to

use individual examples of the intrinsic unfairness of the

Government's AWAs not all of

which have turned out to be factually correct by the way that Mr Howard and his

colleagues were remarkably

restrained in their criticism

of this issue today? That's a

matter for them in terms of their political tactics in

Parliament. When it comes to

the question of individual

firms Darryl Lea and the others

Spotless. Having sat around

the tactics table of the

Australian Labor Party for

quite some time when these

individual AWAs - and I say

again my wife has never used

AWAs - but when AWAs roll in

the door in the case of Darryl

Lea no additional benefit at

all. On that issue of scrutiny

what about the motel? Yesterday

the City Motel that it seemed -

and this is a point that the

Government did go after you on

today - was picked up by Labor

from a press report and not

checked out and that City Motel

has lost city as a result and

that the facts aren't as

accurate as Labor was portraying? In the Parliament

itself no reference was made to

the name of the company at

all. But Julia Gillard your

shadow minister did identify

that company in a radio

interview? When it comes - what

she was talking about the

Parliament in the debate and I

didn't hear the interview

concerned was the fact that

this was an AWA being used

broadly across the hospitality

industry in NSW as I understand

it. And that her concern was

that not with individual employers who are operating

within the laws which Mr Howard

has laid down for all

Australians to comply with.

Our objection and our attack is

always on the laws themselves.

And the fact that when it comes

to Mr Howard's unfair laws

they've gone too far. We need

to restore the balance and part

of that is also having a robust

independent umpire. It must now

be clear to both you and your

wife that if you want the keys

to the Lodge you're going to

have to find a better way to

neutralise your wife's business

affairs? This has been a sober

wake-up call for us both. It's

been an embarrassing day, I

admit that. My wife has always

been dedicated to her own

business, I'm proud of what

she's done. She started with

nothing back in 1989. Half a

secretary in an attic officer

in Brissie and employs 1,200

people around the world. I

understand in modern Australia

women have their own careers

and I've respected that all the

way through. And we've hoped

beyond hope that we could

reconcile the two universes. I

hear a but coming? It's getting

tough. I chatted to Therese a

little while ago and we'll have more discussions about how this

might be dealt with. Is it

inevitable that your wife will

have to sell her

business? After taking advice

from a range of people

including former senior public

services is this, that the

responsible course of action

would be if we won the election

to go to the secretary of Mr

Howard's department and ask for

his advice about how we would

manage any conflict of

interest. You'd be going to the

person who would be answering

to you and asking him to tell

you what to do in a situation

where your wife's business has

all those Government contracts.

I come back to you. You're

saying that's what you were

going to do, that now suggests

you're going to have to review

that? We are giving it serious

thought about the way ahead.

It's a tough thing for my wife.

This has been embarrassing, I

accept that. But is she

acknowledging to you that she,

too, is going to have to

rethink? We've started to talk

that through. She's a

formidable lady in her own

right. This will test your

powers of negotiation, seriously I would have

thought. I've been married for

25 years to this wonderful

woman Kerry and I don't always

win. Since we're talking about

individual contracts, your

predecessor Kim Beazley

promised to tear up Australian

Workplace Agreements a year

ago. You and Julia Gillard

have obviously put intense

scrutiny on this and reaxed the

promise. You can't say how

you'll enforce the ripping up

of valid AWAs if workers want

to take you up on that promise

and for those workers who are

happy with their AWAs and want

to renew them you still can't

say what you'll replace them

with. Is that really good

enough for an alternative

government at this late stage

in the peace? You've got about

1,000 times more detail on us

on industrial relations policy

than you ever had from Mr

Howard before the last

election. Once he obtained the

control of the Senate he raced

away with it and brought his

policy WorkChoices out into the

field and legislated with no

preelection commitment

whatsoever. Perhaps that -

winning in the Senate took him

as much by surprise as anybody.

Labor's had a year to plan how

it's going to implement its

policies and there is still

this glairing area where you

don't have the answers

yet? Julia and myself are

currently consulting with

businesses up and down the

country about transitional

arrangements between the

existing industrial relations

system and what we'd replace it

with. We're very mindful of

the fact that a number of

companies right across the

country. Some 3% of employment right across Australia

currently has AWAs are engaged

in contracts which affect their

business. We're mindful of.

That but we've got to also make

sure that people who have been

very badly affected, very badly affected, have a way through as

well. So this is a detailed

consultation with business.

Not just with the mining

industry, with general business

as well and we intend to get it

right. I've said before we'll

be finetuning the detail when

it comes to our industrial relations policy and this is

part of it. We will do this

well prior to the election.

People will be very clear about

where we stand on this. You've

put a lot of effort into trying

to lift Labor and your economic

credentials in the eyes of the

public but the polls would

strongly suggest that voters

still aren't buying the line.

They still see the Government

as significantly superior in

that regard. One wonders how

much more you can do and how

much more you can add that's

going to in any way impress

them anymore than you have or

to the extent that you've

already failed to do? My job is to put the case to the people.

How they respond is ultimately

a matter for them. I'll be

working hard to make sure they

know the comprehensive plan for

the future and that means the

economy. Productivity growth

right now, zero. The argument

we'll be advancing is how do

you lift productivity growth

rather than hope and depend as

Mr Howard and Mr Costello do

that this mining boom will last

forever. We're confident we

will punch through with that

message. We've had $32 billion

worth of tax giveaways. It's

the advantage of incumbency.

We intend to be competitive and

we intend to have a very cogent

case to put to the Australian

people on the economy as we

believe we already do. Kevin

Rudd, we're out of time, thank

you for talking with

us. Thanks, Kerry. This Sunday

will mark 40 years since that embarrassingly long overdue

referendum in which Aborigines

were finally given full

citizenship rights in their own

country. The overwhelming yes

vote was the culmination of a

10-year campaign by white and

black Australians led by the

daughter of a south sea

islander slave Faith Bandler.

At the time it was widely hoped

the referendum would also

deliver something closer to

equality for Aborigines. After

more than 100 years of deep

inequality, Aborigines were

also looking for justice. 40

years on the push for

Aboriginal rights has produced

mixed results. The poor health

and poverty rates of poor Aboriginal communities remain

an international plight.

Deborah Cornwall reports on the

campaign that led to that '67

referendum and its legacy.

Indigenous viewers are warned

that this story contains images

of people now deceased. You

can't trust a bloody black

fella doesn't matter where he

is. He gets on the plonk and

he won't work. A few of them

are nice and they're clean and

they wear nice clothes and

everything but most of them are

all dirty and everything. Aborigines were all

but invisible in '60s

Australia. Most of them fringe

dwellers, forbidden to travel,

denied entry to pubs, paid in

meat and salt instead of

dollars. Under the rule of State welfare boards they

weren't even counted in the

national census. What has been

forgotten in the history of the

country are those terrible

years when the first people

were locked away on reserves.

Their whole lives were totally

controlled by one white person.

We were being herded into

almost a concentration camp. My

father and anybody of his

generation couldn't go beyond

Year 4 at school. At the time,

the only Aborigines allowed to

live or work outside the

reserves had to have a licence.

They call them dog tags. The

dog licence could be bought

from the Aboriginal welfare

board. I mean, it's too crazy

to think of it today, but

that's how it was. Ladies and

gentlemen, Mrs Faith Bandler.

It was in this climate, Faith

Bandler a daughter of a south

sea islander slave, began

pressing a simple proposition.

She wanted Indigenous

Australians to have the same

citizenship rights as white

Australia. Opening the doors

to basic Commonwealth services

like health and education. And

the mood for change was

gathering force. Never to

bring reconciliation and

healing... In 1965 Aboriginal

activist Charlie Perkins led a

busload of university students

on the now infamous freedom

ride, touring NSW confronting

locals and demanding an end to

discrimination. The white

person in Australia must be

educated to be able to

understand the Aboriginal

person to be more tolerate

towards him. A year later,

stockmen in the Northern

Territory staged the first ever

strike by Aborigines. These

Aboriginal stockmen are on

strike. They walked off the

job over a month ago. Their

wives, children and relatives

went with them. This is the

Wave Hill mob. It started with

a call for equal wages at Wave

Hill pastoral station but quickly developed into

ownership of the land. Jimmy

Little, Australia's best-known

black entertainer of the '60s

was another to join the fight

for recognition. Now perhaps

for the first time, you are

going to see a film in which

nothing but coloured people of

my race are given the

opportunity to express

themselves and tell you of the

problems which have prevented

them from their rightful place

in this community. They hung

on every word I spoke, and what

a grand opportunity to say,

"Hello friends, oh by the way,

there's a lot of Jimmy Littles

out there who want the same

opportunity. "

SONG: # Vote yes for Aborigines #

The referendum is on Saturday

and it's important that we

should have the maximum vote

because the eyes of the world

are on Australia. After a

decade-long campaign in clubs

and Town Halls across the

country, in May 1967 Faith

Bandler and her supporters in

the Federal Council of

Aborigines and Torres Strait

Islanders finally got the

referendum they had been

fighting for. An overwhelming

90% of Australians voted yes,

ushering in a new order for

Aborigines and paving the way

for unprecedented spending on

welfare and education

programs. I couldn't believe

it. (Laughs) Couldn't believe

it. I didn't think that people

cared that much about it. It

would take another 26 years

before the High Court delivered

the landmark Mabo judgment, a

final recognition that

Aborigines did have a claim to

their native lands. But while

land rights are mired in legal

battles and the life

expectancies of Aborigines

remains a scandalous 17 years

short of the national average,

Faith Bandler believes the

gains four decades on, have

been profound. Today we have

young people walking in and out

of universities like I walk in

and out of my kitchen. Well

that was unknown not that long

ago. Lawyer and Cape York

Aboriginal leader Noel Pearson

says the referendum was a

remarkable achievement. But he

fears many of the gains in the

past 40 years have been

squandered. What was not well

understood back then was that

putting people on a permanent

hand-out would ultimate ly

unravel the strengths that they

had managed to muster together

in 100-plus years of prevailing

against all odds. Noel

Pearson's tough love doctrine

has antagonised many Aboriginal

rights activists. But his call

for Aborigines to start weaning

off welfare and begin aspiring

to home ownership and

mainstream jobs is now being

championed by the Howard

Government as an historic new

direction for

Aborigines. There's no white

saviour being in the form of om

nymph tent government or a

bureaucrat at the frontline of

that judgment. They can't save

us and they can't guarantee a

future for our children. Only

we can do that. Look at this

poor old tree. At 89, Faith

Bandler says her's is now a

very private life well away

from the front-line. But she often reflects on the

extraordinary struggle she

faced to bring the rest of the

country along with her. Would

you do it all again? Oh, I'm

sure I would. I'm sure I would

do it again. Wasn't easy, but

it was most rewarding. The

40-year anniversary and the

faith of Faith Bandler.

Deborah Cornwall with that

report. Statues in public

places are usually reserved for

former Prime Ministers and ill-fated splors not

hard-living rock singers even

if they become great exports.

In the West in Fremantle a

proposal for the statue of the former AC/DC singer Bon Scott

has the backing of his friends

and the local council. Scott

died from alcohol poisoning in

1980 and his grave outside

Fremantle draws thousands of

visitors a year. His friends

say Scott's contribution to the

arts demands something like a

statue and the Fremantle

Council can see the tourism

potential of the plan. Hamish

Fitzsimmons reports.

(Sings) # It's a long way to

the top if you want to

rock'n'roll #

Bon's lyrics the way he

delivered them, all that. And

it's so succinct and it's true

and it's real. Though he died

27 years ago, his legacy lives

on. Nowhere more than in his

adopted home town of Fremantle.

So much so that the city has

just launched a project to

celebrate his life in art, with

calls for submissions from

around the world. But for now

the only way fans can pay

homage to Bon Scott is to visit

his grave site three kilometres

from Fremantle's centre. That

one's for you and one for the

boys. And this one is in

memory of loss and absent

friends. His grave site is now

one of the most visited destinations in Western

Australia. If we have the seventh fleet come here and

there's 6,000 people on board

or 7,000 you'll basically have

99% of those will go and visit

that grave site. The Scott

family migrated from Scotland and arrived in Fremantle when

Bon was 10. He grew up in the

rough and tumble of the port

town. A troubled childhood led

to stints in juvenile detention

and a series of dead-end jobs,

but the one stabilising factor

in his life was music. Bon

Scott with life-long friend and former bandmate Vince Lovegrove

dreamt this passion would take

them places. He was a loving

guy, he was a really loving guy

but there was something about

him that was impish, there was

a bit of Larkin about him. Bon

finally escaped the musical

confines of Perth joining AC/DC

in 1974 which stormed the

international rock scene. It's

been excellent. All the gigs

we've done have been received

better than we expected and

some of them, at least more

than half have been incredible.

At least like back home. He

was certainly no saint and

that's something that we should

never forget here. He was a

flawed character like us

all. But Bon Scott's legendary

lifestyle caught up with him

and he died in London in 1908

after an all-night bender. Some

people say that he had said

that -- #19d 80. Some people

said that he's probably not

going to hang around. That's

why he lived his life the way

he did. I wish he'd been a bit

more careful. Despite his

unsavory end, Bon Scott's fans

still flock to Fremantle to see

where his story began. Darren

Collins and his daughter Molly

made the trip from Victoria and would like to see a more

significant tribute to one of

rock's great frontmen. If they

can do it for horses and

greyhounds why not for a

rock'n'roll singer, you

know. There's a plan for a

cast-iron contribution of the

singer. Leading the campaign

is Buzz Bidstrup, a close

friend of the singer's. I think

it's just important that

Australians recognise more than

explorers and ex-prime

ministers and people like that

in statues. The proposal for a

stootu and a park to house it

in has the backing of the local

council which is all too aware

of the tourism potential of the

project. It's not just about it

being good for business. It

will be good for branding of

what makes Fremantle different

to most other places. But

before the metal is even cast there's scepticism about the

idea of a memorial for a dead

rock star. It doesn't sit well

with those who still cherish

the idea of rock'n'roll as

rebellion. If anybody in the

rock'n'roll industry in

Australia deserves one he does,

but do we need one for

rock'n'roll music? Who knows.

That's a very good question.

SONG: # It's a long way to the

top if you want to rock'n'roll #

His friends think Bon Scott's contribution to the arts

outweigh any questions about

his lifestyle. Rock'n'roll

still today as always has never

been seen by the mainstream of

our arbiters of art to be

legitimate art. To raise money

for the statue Buzz Bidstrup

staged a concert bringing together contemporaries and

friends of Bon Scott. If the

project goes ahead, it will be

the first monument to a rock star in Australia and one of

the few in the world. While

the old rockers go through

their paces in memory of their

friend, some think Bon Scott

would be the first one to find

the whole idea somewhat

absurd. Bon wasn't a statue man

and he would be the first one

to thumb his nose at a statue

of anyone let alone himself.

Thank you very much again for

coming. We'll see you next

year for the updating of the

statue. There are some pretty

ordinary statues around the

world. Hamish Fitzsimmons

reporting. Finally, John

Clarke and Bryan Dawe flag a

change in the weather.

Mr Hockey thanks for your

time. It's very good to be here

Bryan and you're still here,

too. Why? Couldn't you find an

electorate e - I thought you

people were - I don't want to

go intee politics. What

happened to you? I was in

television. Really? Another guy

and I we made weekly television

appearances. Is that

right? Just like you and,

what's his name. John

Clarke. Fantastic fun, I loved

every minute of it. What went

wrong? You know, bands break

up, study your history. The

other guy goes solo? The other

guy did in this instance,

yes. So what are you doing

now? I'm the Minister for Workplace Relations,

Bryan. Really? It hasn't been

easy Bryan I'm not going to

pretend it has. I'm really

sorry to hear that? Imagine how

I feel. You've had awful

mistakes there? I wasn't there

then of course. I realise that,

how did they get it so

wrong? Got a pencil. Kevin

Andrews, 27 Complete Nutcase

Avenue. That's in Barking Fruitloop. We're doing what we

can. We've had a stock take,

we've got to move it. Having a

fire sale. Everything must go.

Crazy Joes. If our prices were

any lower you couldn't get in,

Bryan. What stuff are you

ditching? Everything. We've

got silly stuff. Kevin

introduced a kind of slavery

for young people product at one stage. WorkChoices? It's not

called that anymore, let me

tell you that for nothing. What

are you callinging it? Fairness

Through Worship. Work

Chances? I forget what we have

gone with in that area. The

key point is that the fairness

test exists. Why did the

Government introduce unfair

legislation in the first place? Bryan let me clear about

this, it's a cock-up. We've

got this whole thing wrong, we

have got this wrong but if

you're accusing me of

listening, guilty Bryan, guilty

as charged. Lock me up, take

me away. But you didn't listen

before? Beg your pardon. The

public told you these laws were

unfair in the first place?

We're rebadging everything and

shoving them out. John says

everything must go. If it looks

like a duck and quacks like a duck? It's not necessarily a

duck. What is it? The biggest

advertising - we're spending a

fortune, quite a moderate

amount of our money on

explaining exactly what it

is. How will I know when I see it? The advertising campaign? Yes. Looks like a

duck and sounds like a duck. Is

that a weather map there? Have

you got a pointer. You know

there's a job going here. I'm

your man, get me a pointer. That's the program for

the night and the week. Don't

forget Stateline at this time

tomorrow. We'll be back with the 7.30 Report on Monday. For

now, goodnight. Closed Captions by CSI

THEME MUSIC I'm Graham Phillips. Hello, welcome to Catalyst. every single one of us Ageing, it's happening inside

trying to avoid it yet we tend to spend more time than actually understand it. we ask the question - Well, on tonight's Catalyst, just why do we age? to do with our livers? Is it something Is it tied up with free radicals? gradually building up mistakes? Or is it just a case of the body

To help answer the question, leading scientists, of course. we ask some of the world's in five generations of one family But we also follow the ageing process from age 2 to 100.