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The coal industry has to reinvent itself if it wants to survive.

Tonight - turning black into green.

They've got like a billion of They've got like a billion of really tiny holes that just allow for
the hydrogen to go through.

The high-tech quest to clean up the villain of global warming - coal.

Whether it's more coastly to use coal in a clean way than it is to use it in a dirty way.

COMMENTATOR: The line's good.

It never worked

The line's good.

It never worked for him, it was just fun.

The making of a champion, how Geoff Ogilvy became the first Australian in 25 years to clinch the US
golf Open.

It is a great swing, a fantastic player, he's going to be around for 15

This program is captioned live.

Pro-whaling nations win vote

Pro-whaling nations win vote

Reporter: Nick Grimm

KERRY O'BRIEN: Welcome to the program. And later we'll also cross to Munich to discuss the
Socceroos' World Cup campaign in the wake of last night's defeat at the hands of Brazil. But first,
20 years after it was banned by the international community, commercial whale hunting now appears
one step closer to being resumed, despite the best efforts of anti-whaling nations, including
Australia. A bloc of pro-whaling nations today narrowly won its first vote in two decades at the
International Whaling Commission meeting on the Caribbean Island of St Kitts. While the win, at
this stage, is largely symbolic, it's seen as evidence that the balance of power inside the IWC is
steadily shifting towards pro-whaling nations like Japan. Nick Grimm reports.

WILL FORD, CRUISE OPERATOR: Just getting a little bit ahead of them on the side.

WOMAN TOURIST ON CRUISE: It's completely magical when everyone first sees the whales. You know,
there's a sort of a big "Oh" goes around the boat. Yeah, it's just one of those things that's sort
of larger than life.

NICK GRIMM: At this time of year, Sydney's whale-watching fleet has little trouble finding
humpbacks swimming just off the city's coast as they undertake their northern migration. The tour
operators have little difficulty filling their boats, either. Among those hoping to get up close to
the whales are visitors from Japan.

JAPANESE WOMAN: This is the first time for me to see whales, so I was so impressed.

WILL FORD: The Japanese probably get the most excited out of all of our different passengers. I
mean, they all get excited, but the Japanese really get into it.

NICK GRIMM: In fact, while these Japanese whale spotters were enjoying their brush with nature,
half a world away their government was lobbying for the right to kill more of the animals.

SENATOR IAN CAMPBELL, ENVIRONMENT MINISTER: So this is what's done in the name of science. This is
how Japan, in the name of science, collects whale meat, takes it back to Japan, sticks it in
warehouses, tries to get schoolchildren to eat it, get old people to eat it now and, of course, we
know from some evidence that they're also feeding it to dogs - all in the name of science.

NICK GRIMM: Yet, in spite of messages like that from Australia's fervently anti-whaling Environment
Minister, this year's meeting of the International Whaling Commission has seen pro-whaling nations
like Japan get closer than ever to overturning the 20-year-old ban on commercial hunting. Earlier
in the weekend, Senator Campbell had been celebrating saving the whales after narrowly defeating a
number of pro-whaling motions. But there's less cause for the Australian camp to cheer today after
the latest vote, one that reflects a significant sea change for the IWC. For the first time in 20
years, the pro-whaling nations have won by a single vote a resolution declaring that the moratorium
on commercial whaling is only a temporary measure.

JOJI MORISHITA, JAPANESE DELEGATE: My understanding is more about emotions, so-called 'public
opinion' in many countries. Maybe it's time for us to look at this issue more seriously.

NICK GRIMM: The vote won't force dramatic change in the short term because pro-whaling nations
would need the support of 75 per cent of IWC members to overturn the ban on commercial whaling.

ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR STEVEN FREELAND, INTERNATIONAL LAW, UWS: The problem with this system is that
it serves neither side's purposes properly. On the one hand, the anti-whalers are successful in
getting moratorium on whaling, but they can't stop the whaling nations from taking advantage of,
essentially, loopholes in the system to carry on whaling anyway.

NICK GRIMM: The resolution also blames whales for depleting fish stocks in the oceans and it
condemns environmental campaigners like Greenpeace for their threatening behaviour. Last summer,
Japanese whaling ships clashed with protesters in the Southern Ocean. Now, in the wake of today's
IWC vote, Danny Kennedy from Greenpeace says the organisation will intensify its campaign against
whaling.

DANNY KENNEDY, GREENPEACE: They start killing humpbacks next year there won't be a whale-watching
industry up the east and west coasts of Australia in years to come.

WILL FORD: Still a long way to go before the humpbacks are fully recovered.

NICK GRIMM: Back on Will Ford's boat, a group of Japanese travel agents has been getting a taste of
the whale-watching experience. It's hoped they'll head back home and recommend it to their
customers.

WILL FORD: I don't think you can go out on a cruise like this and see the whales up close and
personal and still want to kill them and go home for a whale steak sandwich or something like that.
It's just not the way people think when they leave.

MIDDY NAKAJIMA, JAPANESE TOUR OPERATOR: For myself, I've never eaten whale meat in 30 years and I
asked also to my clients or guests or whoever, they normally don't eat.

NICK GRIMM: In fact, it seems the Japanese aren't all that keen on whale meat after all.
Traditionally, few Japanese ate it but after World War II they were encouraged to tuck in to put
more protein in their diet. Now, many younger Japanese regard it as an austerity food, sort of like
the spam of the seas.

MIDDY NAKAJIMA: In my opinion, maybe people looking at the whale, not as a food anymore.

NICK GRIMM: They're not looking at it as food anymore?

MIDDY NAKAJIMA: No, no, no.

NICK GRIMM: They're looking at it as something - as a wild animal that they would like to see more
of?

MIDDY NAKAJIMA: I think so, yeah, yeah.

NICK GRIMM: Well, if it's true that the Japanese are losing their taste for whale meat and
developing instead an appetite for whale-watching, then why is their government to keen to resume
commercial whaling? Well, the answer to that question might lie in the fact that the poor old
whales are becoming pawns in what's really a game of global politics.

ASSOC. PROF. STEVEN FREELAND: So if those countries are going to whale anyway, my argument is then
we must put in place a proper system to make sure that what they do is environmentally correct.

NICK GRIMM: Steven Freeland is an Associate Professor of international law at the University of
Western Sydney and an expert on the international enforcement of environmental laws. He believes a
compromise now needs to be found, and that might mean allowing some commercial whaling.

STEVEN FREELAND: The recriminations and the argumentation means that it could get worse, and by
that I mean, that the pro-whalers could actually decide in the end that they're so frustrated by
this process they will actually leave the Whaling Commission altogether, form some other form of
management regime and not even be bound by the moratorium.

DANNY KENNEDY: It would be a stupidity really for civilisation to go back to this old barbaric
business - which there is no demand for, I'll note, in this day and age - and actually deplete the
asset that the whale-watched business is based on.

NICK GRIMM: Certainly the idea of limited commercial whaling is one that's struggled to find
acceptance inside the vote-crunching environment of the IWC. For those getting up close to whales
in the wild, though, whale hunting may simply remain the most unpalatable of options.

WOMAN TOURIST ON CRUISE: There's no humane way to kill a whale, absolutely none. You're firing an
explosive device into the whale and rupturing it and it just bleeds to death. It's completely
inhumane and completely wrong.

Coal industry develops clean technology

Coal industry develops clean technology

Reporter: Peter McCutcheon

KERRY O'BRIEN: The Prime Minister has recently argued that nuclear energy is cleaner and greener
than fossil fuels. He says it's one of the main reasons he's opened a debate about whether
Australia should have nuclear power. But the coal industry counters that it is developing a new
type of clean coal technology that will dramatically reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Power
stations using this non-polluting form of coal technology could come on stream in the next four to
five years. But does it all add up financially? Peter McCutcheon reports.

PETER McCUTCHEON: In a Brisbane laboratory, engineer Dr Joe da Costa is working on cutting-edge
technology that could stop greenhouse gas pollution. He's perfecting one of the world's smallest
sieves that can separate carbon dioxide from hydrogen. This means, in theory, a non-polluting
source of power from that much-maligned fossil fuel, coal. Many people think of coal as a dirty
19th century-type technology. Do you think that's about to change?

DR JOE DA COSTA, CENTRE FOR FUNCTIONAL NANOMATERIALS, QLD UNI: I think it is changing already.

PROFESSOR IAN LOWE, AUSTRALIAN CONSERVATION FOUNDATION: The coal industry really is in a position
where it has to reinvent itself if it wants to survive.

PETER McCUTCHEON: Australia is at the forefront of research for clean coal technologies. But the
jury is still out on how and when this technology will be moved from the laboratory to widespread
industrial use and a key challenge will be how to provide financial incentives for the coal
industry to change.

PROFESSOR JOHN QUIGGIN, ECONOMIST, QLD UNI: What we need is to give industry a price signal that
carbon emissions are costly and then let industry work out the best way of reducing emissions.

PETER McCUTCHEON: Clean coal technology basically boils down to capturing carbon dioxide and
storing it somewhere else. And to some extent, industry can already do this. The Queensland
Government-owned CS Energy recently applied for Federal funding to convert this decommissioned
power station into an almost greenhouse gas-free energy producer. But there's one big obstacle to
widespread use of this technology. It's simply too expensive.

DR KELLY THAMBIMUTHU, CENTRE FOR LOW EMISSION TECHNOLOGY: Those cost figures we currently estimate
as being 50 per cent more, say, than the price of electricity than it would producing electricity
without CO2 capture.

PETER McCUTCHEON: Dr Kelly Thambimuthu is the chief executive of the recently-established Centre
for Low Emission Technology in Brisbane. His centre is focusing on the single most expensive part
of clean coal technology - how to capture carbon dioxide emissions. Dr Thambimuthu is liaising
closely with CSIRO scientists in looking at ways of turning coal into a gas and extracting separate
streams of hydrogen and CO2.

DR KELLY THAMBIMUTHU: Two-thirds of the cost of capture, transfer and storage is in the capture
area.

DR JOE DA COSTA: I just want to show you one of those membranes to make here.

PETER McCUTCHEON: Can I touch it?

DR JOE DA COSTA: Sure.

PETER McCUTCHEON: The centre is also taking a keen interest in Dr da Costa's tiny sieve which
separates carbon dioxide at the molecular level. And there's billions of holes in this?

DR JOE DA COSTA: Yes, that's right.

PETER McCUTCHEON: And can you really design a sieve that small on a large industrial scale?

DR JOE DA COSTA: We can. We have the technology here. We're taking the technology to a stage in
three years that it will be able to compete against those conventional mature technologies.

VIDEO: Instead of burning coal, coal gasification opens new possibilities.

PETER McCUTCHEON: But how far away are we from turning science fiction-type animations like this
one, presented to a 2004 International Energy Agency conference, into reality? Well, according to
Dr Thambimuthu, it all depends on how much society is willing to pay for its electricity.

DR KELLY THAMBIMUTHU: If they were willing to tolerate that higher cost now, we could implement the
first solutions, say, within a five-year time frame.

PETER McCUTCHEON: Within five years?

DR KELLY THAMBIMUTHU: Within five years, provided that we are willing to tolerate a higher cost.

PROFESSOR IAN LOWE: I certainly think we can use coal more cleanly than we have in the past and
clean coal has to be better than dirty coal.

PETER McCUTCHEON: Environmentalists cautiously welcome but are reluctant to wholly embrace clean
coal technology, with concerns about mining practices and the safety of underground CO2 storage.
But Australian Conservation Foundation President Ian Lowe agrees one of the biggest hurdles to
overcome is an economic one.

PROFESSOR IAN LOWE: But at the moment we don't charge for releasing carbon into the atmosphere and
so it is more costly to use coal in a clean way than it has been to use it in a dirty way, just
polluting the atmosphere. So until the technology is proven and until there are economic incentives
to use it, we're probably not going to see it happen.

PETER McCUTCHEON: There is no financial incentive for industry to move from dirty to clean
technology, is there?

PROFESSOR JOHN QUIGGIN: That's right, and in the case of carbon emissions there's no reason at all,
unless we have some, either a carbon tax or an emissions trading scheme, even if it was very cheap,
there'd be no pay-off to industry for adopting it.

PETER McCUTCHEON: Nonetheless, with close to $1 billion in combined funding from Federal,
Queensland and Victorian Governments, industry is working closely with scientists to fine-tune
clean coal technology. For this meeting of the research and investment committee to the Centre for
Low Emission Technology it's a question of when, not if, this new technology is introduced. Coal
may never be as clean and green as renewable energy sources like wind and solar. But while
researchers like Joe da Costa work on cheaper ways of capturing greenhouse gases, coal may still be
a major source of power well into the 21st century. Do you think in your lifetime you will see
clean coal technology used on a large industrial scale?

DR JOE DA COSTA: Yes, I think for the next 20 years, those ones are going to be in place already.

PETER McCUTCHEON: 20 years away?

DR JOE DA COSTA: Yeah.

Socceroos prepare for Croatian clash

Socceroos prepare for Croatian clash

Reporter: Kerry O'Brien

KERRY O'BRIEN: Such is the hope Australia is pinning on the Socceroos to blaze an unprecedented
trail to the final 16 at the World Cup in Germany, that the post-mortems of last night's game
against world champions Brazil are sounding more like they're describing a victory than a 2-0
defeat. Now needing a draw against Croatia on Friday to move to the next level, the Australian team
is taking heart from both its defence and attack at Munich in the early hours of this morning, our
time. To dissect the game against Brazil and look ahead to the likely outcome against Croatia,
Peter Wilkins joins me now from the spectacular new Munich stadium, although we'll have to bear
with the significant satellite delay. An overview first, Peter, and I notice that quite apart from
the Australians' capacity to see a silver lining in this defeat, there's been a lot of compliments
for the Socceroos from various non-Australian newspapers around the globe, so they must have done
something right, despite the score line?

PETER WILKINS: Indeed, Kerry, and the compliments are deserved ones. They played superbly. It was a
performance that made you feel extremely proud, and the basis of it was control. This Australian
side circa 2006 has the ability to control the game and with that control comes confidence and with
the confidence comes ability to create chances. They defended resolutely. Overall it was just a
brilliant performance and they were hampered by some refereeing in the second half which was
curious to say the least. If you're an Australian involved in a 50-50 tackle with the world
champions, then that constitutes a foul if you win the exchange. The rules seemed to have changed
overnight.

KERRY O'BRIEN: What did it say about Australia's defenders that they were able to contain Brazil
for most of the game?

PETER WILKINS: The defence played brilliantly, particularly in the first half and at many moments
during the second half. But Lucas Neil, Craig Moore, Tony Popovic, et al., the list goes on - they
were brilliant. If you're a young player or a player at any level and you find one of the best
players in the world coming at you, your concentration powers have to be high. They can slither
past you in a trice and make you look a fool. There were several moments when the tackling was
absolutely precise. It is real textbook stuff and if you're a football apprentice or someone, a kid
on the rise, have a look at some of the defending from Lucas Neil and the like in last night's
match and you'll see how it's done. They can hold their heads high.

KERRY O'BRIEN: So what were the lessons for the Socceroos out of the two Brazilian goals?

PETER WILKINS: Well before the game, Tony Popovic, one of the players who featured in Guus
Hiddink's interesting selection plans - he always comes up with a few surprises. Popovic said, "You
don't want to be watching the Brazilians play football." That's what they did for a five or
six-minute period after half time. They were on their heels instead of their toes. And they need
half a chance, the Brazilians, to make you pay. And Ronaldo, who wasn't in the game for a lot, his
square ball to Adriano - beautifully finished. He had time to pick his mark and Schwarzer couldn't
really answer that one. The second goal late in the game, it was a different story. The game you
could have said, you get a feeling from the crowd sometimes, and the crowd probably flattened out a
bit. The result was not in doubt and they went to sleep a little bit. That goal didn't really
reflect the contest, I think. 1-0, 1-1 might have been a truer reflection of the game.

KERRY O'BRIEN: They're a team of superstars, as everybody knows, but did Ronaldino and Ronaldo play
like superstars. I think you've been critical about Ronaldo and, for that matter, the new Brazilian
star Robinho?

PETER WILKINS: Well, if Guus Hiddink was coaching Brazil I think he'd have Ronaldo on the bench at
the moment. He's not doing enough. It's this little nexus between senior player and coach and
respect, too. Maybe respect is going too far as far as Ronaldo goes. He had a couple of chances, he
did set up the goal, but his work rate is impact. He's not the player he was. That's showing him no
disrespect. It's just a changing of the guard. Ronaldino, his star is still shining, he did enough
during the game and will blossom as the tournament progresses. And Robinho, he's an outstanding
talent at 22 years of age. He is going to be one of the superstars of the game. But he did come on
late against fatiguing legs. He did looked spectacular in his work. But again, it could have been a
coaching situation, a selection dilemma that allows the coach to bring him on late to make his
impact rather than put him in the tough stuff at the start of the game and be negated there.

KERRY O'BRIEN: So how do you summarise Australia's strength in attack overnight and where was the
strategic imprint of the coach Guus Hiddink?

PETER WILKINS: Well again it was all over the contest, Kerry. He came in with a more defensive
arrangement. He left Marco Bresciano out of the side to start off with and Harry Kewell. And when
he brought them on, the impact came straight away. You don't know if that would have happened at
the start of the game. It might have been another brilliant selection situation. But Harry Kewell
came up with a chance that he'll reflect on. It'll sit in the back of his mind. When you're playing
at the top level, you have to take those moments. You have to make them count. He had one or two
that were agonisingly close and Marco Bresciano, he was feverish in his work and had one or two
chances. You only need one to change the tempo of a game and change the mind-set of the Brazilians.
I thought Bresciano was close to the best player on the field, considering he came on late. He
really gave the attack some energy. And in combination with Aloisi, who came on later, and Viduka,
they looked superb. When you're creating five, six, chances against the world champions you're
doing something right. They didn't take any and today when they reflect on the game they'll say,
"Hey, we played well and we can be proud, but we lost. Why did we lose? We didn't take those
chances."

KERRY O'BRIEN: So very briefly, Peter, how will Australia go against Croatia at the end of the
week?

PETER WILKINS: It will go very well, Kerry. Croatia have to take the game to Australia. They have
to win the game. Australia are in control of their own destiny. It's going to be a grand game with
everything on the line and don't be surprised if they get the result that they need and they move
into the last 16. Who would have thought it? The last 16 and a potential second round contest with
Italy. I mean, the mind just boggles. Before the tournament, if you'd suggested we'd be in this
position. You would have said, we'll take it. Hands down, now they're there.

KERRY O'BRIEN: And another front-row seat for you on Friday night. Peter Wilkins, thanks for
talking with us.

Ogilvy takes US Open trophy

Ogilvy takes US Open trophy

Reporter: Mick Bunworth

KERRY O'BRIEN: On the other side of the Atlantic, another sporting drama was being played out early
today and this time, Australia went one better. Victorian golfer Geoff Ogilvy's win in the coveted
US Open was a stunning achievement, particularly when you consider that Australians rarely win the
American Majors. Greg Norman has never done it and the last Australian to win the Open was David
Graham a quarter of a century ago. On this occasion, at the notoriously tough Winged Foot Country
Club outside New York, where Tiger Woods crashed and burned after two rounds, and no-one was under
par, Ogilvy kept his nerve and took the trophy with a four-day total five over the card. Mick
Bunworth reports.

COMMENTATOR: Alright, the 18th tee - Geoff Ogilvy plus 5. One back.

MICK BUNWORTH: To win the US Open, Geoff Ogilvy did what no-one else could manage - he parred the
last four holes of the notoriously tough Winged Foot golf course in New York State.

COMMENTATOR: Did he hit it? Yes he did - he's given himself a chance...

MICK BUNWORTH: After Ogilvy's coolness on the course, such as his chip on the 17th...

COMMENTATOR: The line's good. Oh my God!

MICK BUNWORTH: And his putt on the 18th.

COMMENTATOR: And it does!

MICK BUNWORTH: He still had to endure a nervous wait in the clubhouse, as he watched American Phil
Mickelson throw away what had appeared to be a comfortable grasp of the title.

COMMENTATOR : Doesn't like this one - going way left, way, way left. Oh no he's caught a gum tree
solid. I believe it's gone backwards. Ogilvy might be signing the winning card. Just crazy shot
selection. I'm sure Jack Nicklaus is in Florida thinking, "Man, Phil".

GEOFF OGILVY: He's won a few Majors recently, so I can maybe take one away. Thank you.

MICK BUNWORTH: Back at the Melbourne bayside suburb of Black Rock, Geoff Ogilvy's proud parents
were running on a heady cocktail of adrenaline and champagne as a steady stream of media lay siege
to their home.

JUDY OGILVY: I've been up since 2 o'clock because I got up to watch the Socceroos, which was
cool... and then I've been watching the telecast since 3:30. And, no, I won't come down for days.

MICHAEL OGILVY: Judy spoke to him and he wished me happy Father's Day and said, "I've won you a
Father's Day present". It's Father's Day in the US.

JUDY OGILVY: It was never work for him, it was always just fun.

MICHAEL OGILVY: I was over in Arizona a short while ago and he said, "I'm going out for practice
Dad, do you want to come?" So I said, "Yeah, I'll come." And so we go up in the morning and eight
hours later, we're still hitting golf balls. It's just as well I like hitting golf balls.

MICK BUNWORTH: Former golf pro and friend Mike Clayton says Geoff Ogilvy's win was crucial for
Australian golf, which so often demands yet so rarely gets to fete a new hero.

MIKE CLAYTON: We've been desperate for someone to win a Major. Elkington was 11 years ago,
ironically beating Montgomery. We've been trying to replace Greg forever. You won't ever replace a
guy like Greg Norman, but to have someone come out and win a Major. Just not a one-hit wonder. He's
a guy who's been around since he was 17 - he led the Victorian Open after three days - he has a
great swing, a fantastic player. He's going to be around for 15 years.

MICK BUNWORTH: Geoff Ogilvy joins a short list of Australians who've claimed a major American
tournament in the past 25 years. Steve Elkington won the PGA in 1995, Wayne Grady won it in 1990
and David Graham was the last Australian to win the US Open back in 1981. But to join this list,
Geoff Ogilvy first had to master the infamous Winged Foot course, where Greg Norman's Open
aspirations were dashed in 1984's play-off against Fuzzy Zoeller.

MIKE CLAYTON: I think it's a stupid golf course in the sense that they distort the dimensions of it
by just growing long grass all over it. And I know Geoff thinks the same thing. I spoke to him
about it earlier in the week. He just said the course is crazy the way it's set up. But it rewards
someone who's stoic and patient and puts up with the bad stuff that happens. There's always been a
wrap on Geoff he had a bad temper. I didn't see anyone calmer out there.

GEOFF OGILVY: What a golf course, this is a pretty special place, the history here. Obviously one
of the toughest golf courses we've ever seen set up, tougher than we've seen, tougher than I've
ever seen anything else.

MICK BUNWORTH: Geoff Ogilvy's path to US Open glory started here at Cheltenham Golf Club in
Melbourne, where he started hitting golf balls with a set of clubs cut down by his father.

MICHAEL OGILVY: The players who he played with at Cheltenham were a lot taller and bigger and
older, like three years older. In fact, he had a nickname in Cheltenham Golf Club called "The
Mighty Mouse", 'cause he was little and he hit the ball a long way.

JOHN SANGER, CHELTENHAM CLUB PRESIDENT: As you can see here, Mick, in 1990 Geoff Ogilvy was our
minor champion, B Grade champion, at a very young age.

MICK BUNWORTH: How old was he?

JOHN SANGER: Around 13, which is a fantastic effort.

MICK BUNWORTH: Outside on Cheltenham's fairways, admiration for the club's most famous son was
rippling around lady's day.

LADY GOLFER 1: I heard it on the radio, coming up to the club. He was one up when they got through
the 10th and I thought fantastic, absolutely wonderful, our boy, our local boy.

LADY GOLFER 2: Such an honour for Cheltenham that he has started his career here. Because, you know
we're not a very big club.

MICK BUNWORTH: And already, the next generation of golfers are heading for Cheltenham, although one
wonders if they've got what it takes to be US Open champion.

BOY GOLFER: Well, I'm going for my handicap today, so I've been here twice this week, yeah.

MICK BUNWORTH: And Geoff Ogilvy, you know, is legendary that he can hit golf balls for eight hours,
are you ready for that type of commitment?

BOY GOLFER: Oh, I don't know, might cut into my skateboarding time, but yeah, I reckon I probably
could.

MICK BUNWORTH: After today, surely the skateboard will have to make way for the golf clubs.

KERRY O'BRIEN: Winged Foot brings back memories. I was at the 18th green there back in '84 in the
Open, when Greg Norman sank a 20 metre putt to tie the tournament with Fuzzy Zoeller, only to be
beaten by eight strokes in the next day's 18-hole play-off - the first of his many frustrating near
misses. Mick Bunworth with that report.

We'll be back at the same time tomorrow, but for now, goodnight.