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7.30 Report -

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Say 'broadband'.

Tonight on the 7.30 Report - can the speed of wireless broadband match the promise?

WiMAX is a very efficient wireless technology for broadband delivery.

Lots of interference, lotses of traffic, it's just not suited to regional Australia. CC

Brough warns child abuse legislation could take three weeks

Brough warns child abuse legislation could take three weeks

Broadcast: 28/06/2007

Reporter: Murray McLauchlin

As special survey teams prepare to brief the Federal Indigenous Affairs Minister on their
assessment of a number of Aboriginal communities, Mal Brough today warned it will be at least three
weeks before legislation can be drawn up to allow the Commonwealth to crack down on child abuse in
the Northern Territory.


KERRY O'BRIEN: As special survey teams prepare to brief the Federal Indigenous Affairs Minister
tomorrow on their assessment of a number of Aboriginal communities, Mal Brough today warned it will
be at least three weeks before legislation can be drawn-up to allow the Commonwealth to crack down
on child abuse in the Northern Territory.

As the paperwork is drafted, residents of Mutitjulu, a town which has been in the national
spotlight on and off for the past year, say they received little information after officials
visited yesterday and are still unsure about the fine detail of the Government's emergency plan.

Residents hope the new plan will deliver a desperately needed boost to resources. Mutitjulu's been
without a doctor for more than a year, the childcare centre is yet to open, and council services
are non-existent.

Murray Mclauchlin returned to the Central Australian town today to test the community's mood.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: Four hundred thousand tourists a year got to see Uluru in Central Australia.
They leave unaware of the Aboriginal community at the western end of the rock which has dominated
national headlines for the past year.

The 100-odd Aboriginal residents of Mutitjulu are still reeling from a welter of allegations of
maladministration and child sexual abuse.

MARIO GUISEPPE, FORMER MUTITJULU COUNCILLOR: This community is scarred, it's hurt, and there's
accusations made about this community. Now, this community's at a loss, where no one's been
charged, that there's no police evidence, was it just a beat up, was it because Mutitjulu is the
icon of Australia? Sitting at the icon of Australia, or was it?

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: The accusations a year ago of child sexual abuse at Mutitjulu precipitated the
Northern Territory Government inquiry which provoked the Federal Government's emergency response a
week ago.

The inquiry went to Mutitjulu. It found no evidence of a paedophile network, but it did find a
bewildered community.

PAT ANDERSON, NT CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE INQUIRY: We have a very sad community, really upset about a lot
of the publicity. The same time, people did speak to us and was a bit guarded.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: The spotlight refocused on Mutitjulu yesterday. It was the first Northern
Territory community to be visited by a party of federal officials, police and army and told about
the Commonwealth's emergency plan.

STEVE VAUGHAN, FEDERAL DEPT OF COMMUNITY SERVICES: This is really important and if a community is
happy to now ask the media, they've got their shots, and the introduction, that we could have some
private discussions about what the issues are in this community.

MAUREEN CAMPBELL, MUTITJULU RESIDENT: You have come to a meeting here and why are you afraid of the

MARIO GUISEPPE: They come here with an empty box and they was looking for something to put in
there. And they was asking the community what they wanted and the community was at a loss. They
were the ones who wrote us a letter and said, "We want to meet with the community".

Everything we ask they didn't have an answer. So I don't know what that meeting was all about, and
the community doesn't know what the meeting was all about.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: Whatever their concerns about impending Federal intervention, the people of
Mutitjulu were just as keen to tell the man from the Government yesterday about a decline in
services since the Federal Government appointed an administrator to Mutitjulu a year ago.

HARRY WILSON, MUTITJULU RESIDENT: We need essential services back here. We had the Minister running
this community from Perth and all you can see of the services they provided for this community,
nothing has happened. We need firewood for the elders and all the vehicles are unregistered. We
need the Minister to come and register these vehicles so we can get firewood for the elders.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: The Mutitjulu Council has not sat in this officer since mid last year when the
Federal Government put in an administrator. Council services has ceased since then.

The transport fleet, for example, has been quarantined. A former councillor Mario Guiseppe won a
Federal Court case two weeks ago when the appointment of the administrator was found to be invalid.

MARIO GUISEPPE: This has been like this for the last 12 months since we've had an administrator put
in. There's a sport and rec car there, there's a community bus there, we used to take the kids out
with an old woman and man to do food gathering. There's a fully equipped workshop. You, know, we
can't get the vehicles registered for these people to run the programs and the Government has cut
the funding, because the administrator is in charge of it.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: Mutitjulu's health clinic, too, is under administration. The doctor here resign
beforehand the administrator was appointed 18 months ago.

But while the Federal emergency plan is to send doctors to do compulsory health checks on all
Aboriginal children in Northern Territory communities, the Federal Government was reminded
yesterday that Mutitjulu remains without its own doctor.

HARRY WILSON: All them years they've been singing out for a doctor to put in the clinic and now
you're bringing on a doctor. Why? They've been asking the clinic to get a doctor, they've been
asking the Government to bring a white doctor to this community and now they're coming in with

MUTITJULU RESIDENT: We don't want administrators, we want doctors.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: Reports over the past few days have mothers at Mutitjulu fleeing with children
to outlying sand dunes to evade Federal officials have no substance.

MARIO GUISEPPE: Just rumours I think Murray and yeah, it's just been made up, I think. People with
a bit sceptical of what was going to happen, because when it was announced it was just the army's
coming, the Federal Police coming, so what do you expect? What's going to happen? Aboriginal people
never had this happen to them before.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: But the man from the Federal department of Family and Community Services
yesterday was still keen to quell alarm.

STEVE VAUGHAN: We want to make your community safe so you can live here without any fear, so that
your children are safe, a very important thing. So your children can go to school safely and it is
not about taking away children.

MURRAY MCLAUGHLIN: Aboriginal communities in the Northern Territory like Mutitjulu, can expect the
arrival of more than just Government officials, police imported from interstate and army soldiers
to back them up once the Federal Government's assessed and needs for support.

Civilian volunteers, too, will be enlisted to provide services. And at Uluru yesterday, the
conscience of at least one tourist was touched so she's now reviewing her Christmas holiday plans.

HELEN LEMARQUE, QUEENSLAND TEACHER: There's going to be a lot of need for nurturing and talking and
you know, you have to really get the feel of the people and be there among them and live with them
and sleep with them and eat with them and then you can only reach out. And I'm thinking we've got
six flat weeks during December, maybe I'll come this way again.

KERRY O'BRIEN: Murray Mclaughlin reporting from Mutitjulu.

Questions raised over wireless broadband capabilities

Questions raised over wireless broadband capabilities

Broadcast: 28/06/2007

Reporter: Greg Hoy

The Government has made some ambitious promises about the Internet speeds it will deliver to the
bush via wireless broadband- promises they may not be able to keep according to some experts.


KERRY O'BRIEN: Depending on which political side you listen to, it will cost anywhere between $7
billion to $9 billion to properly equip Australia with high-speed broadband, to facilitate world
class telecommunications for the nation's future.

Question is, what chance this high stakes, high-tech process can be achieved without being
subverted by political interests hoping to gain advantage in a fiercely fought federal election?

At least the roll out of optical fibre in metropolitan areas will now be subjected to an open
tender process no matter who wins government.

The story's different for rural and regional Australia.

The Government's made some ambitious promises about the Internet speeds it will deliver to the bush
via wireless broadband, promises they may not be able to keep according to some experts.

But there are also questions emerging over funding for the Opposition's plan.

Greg Hoy reports.

GREG HOY: The delivery of high speed access to the global Web has become a tangled web of political
intrigue. The public ensnared in spin must try to decipher what is true fast broadband and what is

HELEN COONAN, COMMUNICATIONS MINISTER, December 2006: More than 80 per cent of Australian
households and small businesses already have access to fast broadband.

GREG HOY: But that view changed once Labor promised the laser speed of a new optical fibre network.

KEVIN RUDD, OPPOSITION LEADER: We have a proposal which will cost up to $4.7 billion in joint
partnership with the private sector to lay out fibre optic to the node for 98 per cent of the

GREG HOY: So the coalition responded.

HELEN COONAN: Say 'broadband'.

GREG HOY: Pledging to explore a similar but corporately funded network in metropolitan areas and a
subsidised alternative solution for rural Australia.

JOH HOWARD, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: This morning I announce a plan that will deliver by June of
2009, that's in two years time, very fast broadband to 99 per cent of the Australian population.

GREG HOY: By committing on top of its $2 billion regional telecommunications fund a further $1
billion broadband taxpayer subsidy for OPEL, an Optus Elders joint venture, trumpeting its reliance
on so called WiMAX wireless broadband, billed as state of the art.

GREG TILTON, DGIT TELECOMMUNICATIONS CONSULTANTS: WiMAX is a very efficient wireless technology for
broadband delivery, and WiMAX is capable of delivering very high speeds over some fairly long

HELEN COONAN: You'll be able to take your laptop out to the shed and you'll be able to get on with
business in the global economy.

GREG HOY: Promises, promises. Commercial and political rivals lined up to heap scorn on the idea.

take your, with this technology the Government's delivering, you can take your laptop out into the
shed, it actually won't work. And that's simply because the Government have gone for a cheap model.

exactly clear what they're going to play with. In a frequency which won't travel far, it won't get
out to customers. It's public frequency, so it's shared.

GREG HOY: So, who do you believe? The devil it transpires on both sides, is in the technical
details that sound so impressive to the layman.

BROADBAND INTERNET EXPERT, June 18 Press Conference: This uses 5.8 gigahertz on the spectrum.

JOHN HOAWRD: That's Optus?

BROADBAND INTERNET EXPERT: It's a class licence spectrum.


BROADBAND INTERNET EXPERT: So, everyone is free to use that. There's plenty of spectrum to play in,
that's the good part about it.

JOHN HOWARD: Oh yeah, that is good.

GREG HOY: No, Prime Minister, 5.8 gigahertz is not so good. True WiMAX is good with the capability
of delivering true fast speed wireless broadband over long distances with minimal interference from
weather and buildings, but the experts tell us that 5.8 gigahertz is not true WiMAX.

True WiMAX requires a lower frequency, higher quality wireless spectrum, licensed only for multiple
millions of dollars. Although 5.8 gigahertz is free, it's only good for short distances and if
there's two users it goes half speed. The more users, the less speed.

STEPHEN CONROY: If you pick up your cordless phone while you're using your Internet, your line can
drop out. If you use your microwave, your line will drop out.

I've heard some of these comments and they are very very misleading and I think they're unfair to
potential customers. The reality is with the sort of strength of signal you're delivering off
WiMAX, small hand held battery operated devices like cordless phones or garage doors are simply not
going to be capable of creating interference.

GREG HOY: Optus is now playing down the emphasis on broadband delivered by 5.8 gigahertz public
spectrum wireless.

PAUL O'SULLIVAN, CHIEF EXECUTIVE, OPTUS: At this stage we're planning to use a couple of
frequencies, which are, one is 5.8, and the other is in the 3.4 gigahertz range. There are a
variety of ways in which you can access spectrum in Australia, you can buy spectrum at auctions.

ACME BROADBAND ADVERTISEMENT: Jack and Jill are both getting broadband.

GREG HOY: The 7.30 Report checked with telcos Austar and Unwired, who have paid millions at auction
for the great majority of WiMax spectrum for the next seven years. Neither have been approached to
onsell what they have, both have their own plans, and both are sceptical the taxpayer subsidised
wireless broadband network will work as promised.

PAUL O'SULLIVAN: Can I reassure customers Greg or potential customers, this is a plan delivering
high speed broadband to the majority of Australians in the next two years and that's a very
important that they fully understand and are confident with what we are delivering.

GREG HOY: It's the WiMAX you have that attractors say when you can't afford true WiMAX. So, what's
really driving this? Here's the map of the planned Government OPEL broadband network, and here's
the map of Telstra's existing 3G mobile broadband wireless network.

The duplication is clear, and with further duplication likely in the cities, it's good news for
competition. But ominous for Telstra's new public shareholders.

GEOFF BOOTH: The money should be spent on the quarter of a million customers giving them city like
customers. It should be spent on running fibre to very remote places like Birdsville, not
duplicating existing infrastructure.

GREG HOY: It would be unfair to suggest the political spin has been one sided. If such an important
decision for the future of Australia's telecommunications is to be left entirely to politicians,
both sides must expect closer scrutiny.

The question for Labor is how carefully did it arrive at its Budget Estimate that promised delivery
of optical fibre to the node, for 98 per cent of Australians? The figures were based on an old and
somewhat vague Telstra broadband document from August 2005.

SHARA EVANS, MARKET CLARITY TELECOM. CONSULTANTS: The maps that accompany the document aren't very
clear exactly which areas would have fibre to the node and which areas would have ADSL2 Plus. And
other parts of Australia would be covered by other wireless technologies. I've not seen any more
detailed costing estimates, even things as basic as how many fibre to the node nodes would you roll

GREG HOY: Labor's response to this was to shoot the messenger, telecommunications consultant Shara
Evans of Market Clarity.

STEPHEN CONROY: Let's be clear about Market Clarity, they're a company that have been attacking the
Labor plan for a couple of months now. We've had lengthy discussions with Telstra and we're very
confident about Telstra's costings and we're very confident from talking to other industry players
that these figures are realistic.

GREG HOY: It's true Market Clarity has previously sided with the Government, locked horns with
Labor and attracted criticism for its interpretation of OECD figures. But Labor does not deny its
broadband budget is based on this 2005 Telstra document.

The 7.30 Report later checked with Telstra, which denies having any subsequent discussions with
Labor about its old plan, which is not specific about how much of Australia could be afforded
optical fibre and how much would only receive lesser broadband technologies.

PAUL O'SULLIVAN: We've talked with Telstra at length. We've talked with the Optus G9 consortium at
length. We're very confident about our figures.

GREG HOY: Again, such vagaries are not one sided. Try asking Optus simply how many of its customers
will be stuck with the vulnerable 5.8 gigahertz service and how much will get true WiMAX?

PAUL O'SULLIVAN: To be frank, we haven't finalised the exact nature of the roll out, but I think
it's almost a red herring. People don't buy technology, they buy services.

GREG HOY: What is true fast broadband, and what is not? Though the debate has raged all year, all
that's become clear is this argument has a long way to run.

KERRY O'BRIEN: With a certain amount to be taken on trust. Greg Hoy with that report.

Aussies hope for psychological boost for Bledisloe Cup

Aussies hope for psychological boost for Bledisloe Cup

Broadcast: 28/06/2007

Reporter: Mary Gearin

Australian rugby's big moment of truth in the shadow of the world comes this Saturday in Melbourne
when the wallabies line up against an intimidating All Black team in the Bledisloe Cup.


KERRY O'BRIEN: Australian rugby's big moment of truth in the shadow of the world comes this
Saturday in Melbourne when the Wallabies line up against an intimidating All Black team in the
Bledisloe Cup.

In the doldrums for longer then they'd care to acknowledge, the Wallabies are looking to the return
of top sports administrator John O'Neill for a psychological boost, although even he can't be
expected to perform miracles overnight.

O'Neill's previous eight years at the helm was mostly a golden period for the Wallabies, and his
brief stint at the head of Australian Soccer also coincided with a magic run for the Socceroos at
the FIFA world cup in Germany last year.

And this time around, he's off to a predictably interesting start, as Mary Gearin reports.

(excerpt from the song by Travis.)

TRAVIS (singing): Why does it always rain on me? Is it because I lied when I was seventeen?

(end of excerpt)

MARY GEARIN: There's nothing like atrip to Melbourne to give Australian rugby players a morale
boost. The Wallabies did the hard yards this week flushing out union starved Victorians in slippery

JOHN SO, MELBOURNE LORD MAYOR: We will see a huge power again turning out to cheer the Wallabies.

MARY GEARIN: This devoted turnout and ticket sales of 80,000 for this weekend's Bledisloe Cup match
shows the Wallabies brand name still stands tall in sports marketing landscape but it won't last if
the team can't recapturing the days of world domination, a fact not lost on this man.

JOHN O'NEILL, ARU CHIEF EXECUTIVE: The big overarching objective is to restore rugby's popularity.
We've got to get people back to the game. They've drifted away, they've found the game
unentertaining, boring and we haven't been winning, so it's not a great combination.

HOST: John O'Neill, ladies and gentlemen. (audience claps)

MARY GEARIN: He says he's not the Messiah, but the second coming of John O'Neill to Rugby Union
ahead of this year's World Cup has certainly galvanised the rugby world. He's been named the top
Australian sports administrator of the year three times, twice in Rugby Union and once during his
term at Football Federation Australia.

SPIRO ZAVOS, RUGBY COLUMNIST & AUTHOR: And Neil came in. He was a former banker and a lawyer and he
had to well, as Lennon says, you can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs and he had to
break some eggs. That was resented. Despite the terrific success of the 2003 Rugby World Cup.

MARY GEARIN: But perhaps the rugby world can expect a slightly different John O'Neill this time

JOHN O'NEILL: Look, I'm a bit older and wiser I guess. I'm not here to distract or indeed be

MARY GEARIN: Is that a recognition that perhaps your style was abrasive, that as much as you're
credited with uniting the factions of Rugby Union, that you are also seen as something of a
divisive character?

JOHN O'NEILL: Look, I often hear that, but there's very little to support it. I effected some
people's power and influence and they didn't like it. It's a pretty robust environment, rugby
politics, and it's not for the faint hearted. I'm very unapologetic.

MARY GEARIN: John O'Neill wants Australia to carry more clout with the International Rugby Board,
and he's certainly prepared to be unpopular with his South African counterparts over their plans to
not send their best Springbok team to Australia for their Tri Nations game.

That's after they drew packed crowds in their country in matches featuring top flight Australian
and New Zealand line ups. Today on his first day in the hot seat, he would not rule out legal

JOHN O'NEILL: They've failed in their obligations to us, it's not good enough. If this was a
commercial matter I'd be looking at suing them for damages.

MARY GEARIN: Isn't it commercial, shouldn't you be suing them?

JOHN O'NEILL: Day one of the job, it's something to look at.

FAN: Oh damn, thank you.

MARY GEARIN: Die hard fans in Melbourne who lined up last Sunday to breathe the same chilly air as
their heroes faced disappointment this Saturday night along with thousands of others if they don't
have pay TV.

Channel 7 will not be playing the Bledisloe Cup match live into Melbourne, and more generally, the
station ranks rugby well below AFL, which it only won back this year.

JOHN O'NEILL: It should be live across the country. The fact that it isn't is very disappointing. I
haven't spoken to my good friend David Leckie for a while but I look forward to having a chat to
see whether we can fix that problem. But I need to understand, where does rugby fit? I no doubt
will get a blast telling me where rugby fits. But look, we just need to make ourselves more popular
so it becomes a compelling argument that the free to air network, whichever one it is, shows the
Test matches live across the nation.

MARY GEARIN: And for that, this Saturday, John O'Neill will be closely watching the style in which
the Wallabies face up to their clash with the world top ranking All Blacks attack.

JOHN O'NEILL: It's about the Wallabies winning, playing entertaining, attractive rugby. We're
probably about fourth in the world at the moment. But that's good. I mean, I love being the
underdog and favourites often get beaten.

RUGBY COMMENTATOR: And Matt Giteau scores for Australia.

KERRY O'BRIEN: As long as underdog doesn't become a permanent condition. That report from Mary

Scott Bevan reports from the Pasha Bulker salvage operation

Scott Bevan reports from the Pasha Bulker salvage operation

Broadcast: 28/06/2007

Reporter: Scott Bevan

The tide has turned at Newcastle's Nobby's Beach where one of the country's biggest salvage
operations is finally underway tonight. The salvage team says conditions are conducive to the ship
moving, and that is what has been happening over the last few hours.


KERRY O'BRIEN: The tide has turned at Newcastle's Nobby's Beach where one of the country's biggest
salvage operations is finally underway tonight.

Waves of four to five metres are pounding the Pasher Bulker as a team of experts tries to refloat
the 40, 000 tonne bulk carrier.

The salvage crews say conditions are conducive to the ship moving and that's what's been happening
slowly over the last couple of hours.

Watching events unfold on nobby's beach is Scott Bevan.

Scott, bring us up to date, does it look like it's going to happen?

SCOTT BEVAN: Well, Kerry I can tell you it is a miserable night to be standing on an exposed
headland by the sea but the salvage team say it is a good night to try to remove the Pasher Bulker
and refloat it.

What's been happening is that all afternoon they've been pumping out thousands of tonnes of water
to lighten the load so that it lifts in the meantime, six lines have been attached to the ship.
Three to sea anchors, three to tugs that are about 400m offshore here. They've been pulling as the
high tide has peaked. That happened about an hour ago so for the past hour there has been an
almighty tussle between Mother Nature trying to push the ship onto shore and the tugs and the
anchors pulling. And you can see the ship literally moving sideways, going out and then the sea
taking it a little back in. But the Ports Minister, Joe Tripodi, says it is moving horizontally
towards the sea.

KERRY O'BRIEN: So, Is there any sense of how long this process might take or is that very much a
matter of guesswork?

SCOTT BEVAN: It is guesswork and there were all sort of complicating factors, always arising.

For example, about half an hour ago one of the lines broke, one of the bow lines attached to a tug
broke so it's now down to five lines. Now the salvage master has continued with the operation for
now, but he and his team of about 25 who are on board constantly assessing to work out what to do
in terms of this battle between time and tide and trying to get the Pasher Bulker back out.

Of course, this window of opportunity closes as the tide goes down over the next hour or so, which
means they'll try again in another 12 or so hours and that pattern will continue until they remove
the bulk carrier.

KERRY O'BRIEN: Can you give any sense, or were they prepared to give any sense, of how confident
they were that they had be able to pull it off in one window if you like, and when they do pull it
off, are there any further complications from that moment that they're anticipating?

SCOTT BEVAN: At this stage they are giving no time frame, how many times indeed they might have to
try before they can get the Pasher Bulker off the beach here. There are other factors they're
having to worry about if and when this occurs, one of which is the structure of the ship itself.

Now there have been buckles seen on the side of the ship, but the great unknown, the great mystery
here is what damage was done underneath when the ship was washed in over the reef and onto the
beach on June the 8th in that dreadful storm. It's clearly been some sort of breach because water
has got in through the outer hull. Just how bad that is, no one knows yet. No one will know until
the ship gets out into deeper water. There are scuba divers on board. They'll go down and do an
assessment and at that time they'll work out what to do next.

The other major factor is the environment and Joe Tripodi has said there's the great concern about
the risk of an oil spill and that is constantly being monitored. Made all the more difficult, of
course, in the darkness like now, but that is foremost on people's minds as well.

KERRY O'BRIEN: Scott, thanks very much for that update.

SCOTT BEVAN: Thanks, Kerry.

KERRY O'BRIEN: And, of course, news, ABC News will keep you up to date on developments over the
next hour or so.

Clarke and Dawe: making friends with Kevin Rudd

Clarke and Dawe: making friends with Kevin Rudd

Broadcast: 28/06/2007

Reporter: John Clarke and Bryan Dawe

Clarke and Dawe on Kevin Rudd's efforts to win friends and influence people.


KERRY O'BRIEN: And now it's time for John Clarke and Bryan Dawe on Kevin Rudd's efforts to win
friends and influence people.

(John Clarke plays Kevin Rudd, Bryan Dawe is the Interviewer)

BRYAN DAWE: Mr Rudd, thank you for coming in.

JOHN CLARKE: Good evening Bryan, very good to be with you.

BRYAN DAWE: How are things going?

JOHN CLARKE: Not bad, yes, a bit busy.

BRYAN DAWE: Can you give us an assessment of this election campaign and how it's going?

JOHN CLARKE: Yes, in broad terms, Bryan, there are three major issues, they are the environment,
national security and the economy.

BRYAN DAWE: And how do the sides measure up?

JOHN CLARKE: Well, the Government doesn't understand the first one.

BRYAN DAWE: The environment?

JOHN CLARKE: No, they can't even spell it, Bryan, so...

BRYAN DAWE: So you've gone better there.

JOHN CLARKE: They're hopeless.

BRYAN DAWE: National security, of course?

JOHN CLARKE: Well national security is where they went pretty well last time.

BRYAN DAWE: Yeah, children overboard?

JOHN CLARKE: They pulled a trick.

BRYAN DAWE: Which won a fiction award?

JOHN CLARKE: It was short listed for the Booker, Bryan, but it didn't win.

BRYAN DAWE: It did win here. They went good on the economy though, didn't they?

JOHN CLARKE: Normally they would, Bryan, but they've introduced appalling Workplace Relations
awards and are taking a bit of water there.

BRYAN DAWE: And haven't we got the biggest debt in the country's history?

JOHN CLARKE: I wouldn't worry about that.

BRYAN DAWE: Well isn't is that a concern? I mean, we are in the middle of the biggest commodity
boom in 40 years and our debt goes from here to the Antarctic.

JOHN CLARKE: I wouldn't worry about that Bryan.

BRYAN DAWE: You wouldn't worry about it?

JOHN CLARKE: Bryan, please don't upset the market here. It's very important that we don't upset the
market here.

BRYAN DAWE: You went to New York recently, didn't you?

JOHN CLARKE: I did, earlier in the year I went to New York.

BRYAN DAWE: You like to travel?

JOHN CLARKE: I love travel, yes.

BRYAN DAWE: Broadens the mind, of course.

JOHN CLARKE: I enjoy it anyway.

BRYAN DAWE: Now, you had a meeting with Mr Murdoch.

JOHN CLARKE: Yeah, that was a highlight.

BRYAN DAWE: Went well?

JOHN CLARKE: Oh yeah. What a marvellous fellow. I had a good conversation with him.

BRYAN DAWE: Good. What did you discuss?

JOHN CLARKE: Very general discussion, Bryan, it has to be said, very general.

BRYAN DAWE: What did you actually say to Mr Murdoch?

JOHN CLARKE: I said look, if things look to be going the way they are at the moment there's every
possibility the Labor Party might win the election and I could be the Prime Minister.

BRYAN DAWE: Right, and did you get the job?

JOHN CLARKE: He's gonna let me know, Bryan. He's a very nice man, and I'm sure he'll let me know as
soon as he finds out.

BRYAN DAWE: There are other applicants?

JOHN CLARKE: No, no, no. His other phone was ringing. He's a very busy man.

BRYAN DAWE: Well he'd have a bit on, wouldn't he?

JOHN CLARKE: Yes, that's right. He told me he's trying to buy the universe.

BRYAN DAWE: But, Mr Rudd, it would be silly if everyone voted in Australia for you and then you
weren't allowed to do the job?

JOHN CLARKE: Yeah, that wouldn't be the best way to run a country, would it?

BRYAN DAWE: No. Has that ever happened before?

JOHN CLARKE: Only ever in the past Bryan.

BRYAN DAWE: If the Australian people vote for you, that should be it, shouldn't it?

JOHN CLARKE: We know what the Australian people think, Bryan, we're waiting to see what the people
who run the Australian think.

BRYAN DAWE: I see. And will you let us know?

JOHN CLARKE: Yes I will. Do you have Foxtel? Has someone got Foxtel.

BRYAN DAWE: No, this is the ABC.

JOHN CLARKE: Well get me a remote. I'll find Foxtel. It's pretty easy to find. Can you get me a
remote please?

BRYAN DAWE: Mr Rudd, what's Foxtel got to do with the way I'm going to vote?

JOHN CLARKE: Just get me a remote, I'm going to do it myself.

BRYAN DAWE: Mr Rudd, could you answer the question?

JOHN CLARKE: I'll answer the question, Bryan. As soon as you get me Foxtel, I'll flick it on, I'll
find the answer, I'll tell you. Get me Foxtel, would you?

BRYAN DAWE: Thanks for joining us.

That's the program for tonight, don't forget 'Stateline' at this time tomorrow. Ali Moore will be
in the chair from Monday while I take a break, but for now, goodnight. goodnight.