Senator BOLKUS —My question is to the Minister representing the Minister for Transport and Regional Services. Is the minister aware that the Democrats are claiming that the new Energy Credit Scheme, which has been set up as part of the government-Democrat deal on the GST, will `replace the Diesel Fuel Rebate Scheme to assist with capital conversion and ongoing use costs from less polluting fuels'? Is he also aware, on the other hand, that Mr Anderson stated in parliament on 8 June that `the Diesel Fuel Rebate Scheme will be administered and preserved under the new Energy Credit Scheme'? Minister, who is right: Mr Anderson or the Democrats?

Senator IAN MACDONALD (Regional Services, Territories and Local Government) —There are three questions. The answer to the first question is no, I was not. The answer to the second question is no, I was not. The answer to the third question, as I understood it, is that they are both right. What I do know about the proposal is that it is a tremendous deal for rural and regional Australia.

Senator Mackay —You are such an embarrassment.

Senator IAN MACDONALD —I hear Senator Mackay. I am still waiting for you to ask me a question, Senator. Here is a question on the transport portfolio and it is asked by some other senator. When am I going to get a question from you?

The PRESIDENT —Senator Macdonald, your remarks should be directed to the chair and not across the chamber.

Senator IAN MACDONALD —Indeed, Madam President, but I keep getting provoked by the shadow minister for transport, who for some reason—

Opposition senators interjecting—

Senator IAN MACDONALD —Oh, she is not the shadow? Well, I cannot seem to get her to ask me a question. Madam President, I know the real shadow minister for transport, Ms Kernot, is certainly very overworked and understaffed—so I read in the paper—and she tells me she is sending you around to do her work for her.

Senator Bolkus —Madam President, I raise a point of order. Could you stop this irrelevant ranting and raving and get him onto the question? The question was specifically about a conflict between the Australian Democrats and the relevant minister, Mr Anderson, in respect of the Diesel Fuel Rebate Scheme. I have asked him to tell the Senate who is right: was it the Democrats or was it Mr Anderson? That is the question before the minister and he should be made to address it.

The PRESIDENT —My understanding was that he had dealt with those matters and has allowed himself to be distracted by responding to interjections. Senator Macdonald, I suggest you ignore the interjections and apply yourself to the question.

Senator IAN MACDONALD —Madam President, Senator Bolkus should perhaps look at Hansard and understand the questions he asked me. The first one was: are you aware? The second one was: did you read? The third one was: who was right? I have answered all three questions. I simply want to take the opportunity that Senator Bolkus has given me to emphasise what a great deal this package is for rural and regional Australia. Of course, I am the minister for regional services, and I, like most of my colleagues on this side, have a very great interest in what happens in rural and regional Australia. I know Ms Kernot has not.

Senator Mackay —You share regional services with John Anderson.

Senator IAN MACDONALD —You interject again, Senator Mackay. I hear that she is sending you around to do her work. That is a bit like sending a child to do a grown-up's job. Anyhow, that is beside the point. But I am pleased to see that, unlike the times when Ms Kernot was Leader of the Australian Democrats—when she told the Australian Democrats to stay out of the bush because there were no votes there—the Australian Democrats are now interested in the bush. A number of their senators have shown a very great interest and have actually helped us provide a package with transport and fuel that will be great news for those of us who live far removed from the capital cities. I implore the Labor Party—it is not too late—to get on board, become relevant in the tax debate, become relevant to regional Australia and join with us in doing something positive for regional Australia.

Senator BOLKUS —Madam President, I ask a supplementary question. Despite the fact that that answer seems to have been one of the worst we have ever heard in this place, can I ask the minister to clarify whether there will be any change at all to agreed levels of diesel rebates and credits when the Diesel Fuel Rebate Scheme is abolished in 2002 and replaced with the Energy Credits Scheme, or is the Energy Credits Scheme simply a new name for the Diesel Fuel Rebate Scheme?

Senator IAN MACDONALD (Regional Services, Territories and Local Government) —If we are going to trade compliments, I must say the question is so silly that it requires some great thought to try to find out what is being asked in order to give an answer. I repeat to Senator Bolkus that this is a great package. The detail will be there as we go through the legislation very shortly. It will all be there for Senator Bolkus to look at. He will be able to see exactly how the procedure and technicalities will work. It is something that I am sure he or whoever happens to be the spokesman over on that side will debate at length, as they tend to do though not with any great intelligence. Senator Bolkus might contain himself, but he should be aware that it is a great package.