Senator CARR (Minister for Innovation, Industry, Science and Research) (6:39 PM) —The concern that the government has with the foreshadowed amendments that you are seeking to present to this chamber today, Senator Mason, goes with the issue of the micromanagement of universities. There is a fundamental philosophical difference between us and you on the issue of the management of universities. The view that this government takes is that we do actually trust universities. The view I would ascribe to you is that you do not. You fundamentally take the view that you need a punitive mechanism like this because universities will inherently disappoint you. We do not share that view.

What we do say is that there are ample requirements in the current legislative framework for accountability to ensure that universities report to and effectively work with government departments—both the Department of Education, Employment and Workplace Relations and, in my case with regard to the research programs, the Department of Innovation, Industry, Science and Research—and that that accountability mechanism is sufficient. You do not need a punitive measure like this—a penalty of 7.5 per cent to be taken from a university’s base grant if the National Governance Protocols are breached in the way which you seem to think will happen.