Senator LUDWIG (2:26 PM) —My question is to Senator Herron, the Minister representing the Minister for Aged Care. Can the minister confirm that prior to 15 February this year, there had been no surprise inspections of nursing homes under the government's new system? Can the minister inform the Senate how many surprise inspections have been carried out since 15 February?

Senator HERRON (Minister for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Affairs) —There have been a number of inspections of nursing homes and hostels over a fairly long period of time, but I think the important point to make is that this was the first government that introduced a system whereby we could bring in accreditation so that we could check the standards of the nursing homes and hostels. There have been a number of inspections, as Senator Ludwig would know, of aged care centres and hostels over a period of time.

What we are trying to do is fix the 13 years of neglect of the Labor Party whereby, in their last year of office, they cut $70 million from the capital funding for nursing homes, reducing it by almost 70 per cent. Under Labor, 10 per cent of hostel residents needed a high level of care. We are fixing the problem and we are fixing that by inspecting aged care hostels and homes so that we can see what the quality of care is in those places. Since we came to power, every single facility has been visited to check the quality of the buildings in which older Australians are living, and more than $1.3 million has been expended on certification visits.

Senator Chris Evans —Madam President, I rise on a point of order. Senator Ludwig asked a very specific question about how many spot checks had been carried out under the government's new system. Minister Bishop has admitted there were none prior to 15 February. Can the minister answer the question or not? The diatribe he is reading has nothing to do with the question at all.

The PRESIDENT —The information is relevant to the question but there are some specifics that Senator Ludwig asked and I am sure the minister is still coming to it.

Honourable senators interjecting—

The PRESIDENT —There are far too many senators making a noise in the chamber and it is difficult for everybody to hear.

Senator HERRON —Over 330 aged care facilities have been accredited, and by January 2001 all will have gone through this process. In relation to the specifics of the number of visits that have been made, I will have to refer that to the minister so I can give—

Opposition senators—Ha, ha!

Senator HERRON —They can laugh on the other side, but they really should hold their heads in shame because of what they left for us to fix. We are doing something about it. We are doing spot checks. We are checking facilities.

Senator Robert Ray —Name them.

Senator HERRON —I am happy to name one, Senator Ray. Alchera Park has had a spot check. Senator Ray is probably not aware of that, but it has had a spot check. There are others that have been done as well. I do not have the specifics in the brief in front of me, so I am happy to refer that to the minister and come back to the senator.

Senator LUDWIG —Madam President, I ask a supplementary question. I understand the minister's answer but, to be sure, can he take it on notice and get back to me about the two parts of the question in respect of the number of inspections? In addition, in light of that response, would the minister agree that the only reason the surprise inspections are now being carried out is the bagging the government has been receiving in the media since 15 February?

Senator HERRON (Minister for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Affairs) —In relation to the last part of the question, that is a laughable suggestion. It is absolutely laughable. Senator Evans would like to beat that up. I know he is a young man, and he has a good career ahead of him in the parliament if he sticks to his last. You have to hand it to him. With the help of his friends up there, he has beaten this up with the egg beater, and good luck to him. That is politics. But the reality is he is playing with elderly people in this community and their lives. He does not realise the damage that he is doing to the aged care providers of this country—the people who provide the aged care and the people whose vocation is in aged care facilities—by denigrating the standard of care that they are giving, by denigrating the provision of care that they give throughout the country. It does him no good when he has that record to stand by.