Ms MACKLIN (2:39 PM) —My question is to the Minister for Vocational and Technical Education. I refer to the $400,000 worth of New Apprenticeships research that the Howard government was finally forced into releasing last week. Minister, doesn’t the research show that nearly 25 per cent of people who complete a new apprenticeship did not receive any off the job training, nor did they have an external trainer who came to the workplace? Doesn’t this show that the New Apprenticeships scheme is a sham and that one in four participants get no formal training whatsoever?

Mr HARDGRAVE (Minister for Vocational and Technical Education and Minister Assisting the Prime Minister) —I thank the member for Jagajaga for this question. The Skills at work report which she is referring to in fact has shown that the total numbers of apprentices in training is up, completions are up, the range of incentives and the number of employers actually accessing those apprentice incentives are also up. It is also interesting to note that on 10 June Minister Nelson and I attended a ministerial council meeting, and the Commonwealth, state and territory ministers were all at one about this report showing that things were very good in the area of new apprenticeship training and that things are so good in fact that we have some reason to celebrate.

Ms Macklin —Mr Speaker, I raise a point of order on relevance. The question was about the fact that one in four of them do not get any training.

The SPEAKER —There is no point of order.

Mr HARDGRAVE —The member for Jagajaga asked about the Skills at work report. We believe in outcomes, we believe also in accountability and we are always happy to make that information available to her. It is interesting how she has taken a small part of a small part of a small part of the report to try and drill down in such an incompetent misuse of the figures that it seems to me if she applied the same principle to those who are on the back bench opposite she might actually find a support base for herself.