Mr SNOWDON (4:48 PM) —I second the motion. In opening my remarks, I would like to welcome two prospective candidates for the armed forces parliamentary scheme who are sitting on the Labor side of the table. I know that the Minister for Veterans' Affairs and Minister Assisting the Minister for Defence, who is at the table, will take note of their names.

Some might ask what the member for the Northern Territory is doing seconding this motion. The reason is very simple. Despite the fact that I have been labelled with all sorts of things over my life in politics, including some rather extreme ones, I think that what the previous speaker has said has highlighted a deficiency of knowledge in the federal parliament about defence related matters and the ignorance that is reflected in many of the debates in the parliament about the way in which the Australian Defence Force works, and particularly about the way in which Australian Defence Force personnel undertake their duties, the hardships that they confront, the difficulties they have in doing their job and the importance of their job to the Australian community.

I should point out that as a young person I was a member of the Air Training Corps. Later I joined the CMF. To counterbalance that, in my years in education I was an activist for the peace movement and was the co-author of a peace curriculum which was accredited and taught in schools in the Northern Territory. But my vision has never been clouded or misled by any underestimation of the importance of the Defence Force to the Australian community. Living in Northern Australia, where we had only last week the commemoration of the bombing of Darwin in 1942, what we see is the importance of defence in a policy and a strategic sense to the Australian community. What we see are large numbers of Defence Force personnel undertaking their daily duties, without complaint by most of them, and under great sacrifice. Whilst members of parliament experience great difficulty in their family lives, being separated from wives and children in particular for much of the year, the same is true for many in the Defence Force. I do not think that is commonly understood by the wider community, let alone by people in this place. This scheme will provide an opportunity for members of parliament to gain in their understanding of the defence forces and the way they work so that they can come back to this place and be informed and able to be participants in debates in the parliament, whether on developing policy or talking about budgets, whether or not they are supportive or critical. In this particular instance, it is just as important to have knowledge if you are critical as it is if you are supportive.

From my experience, I know that there are about 30 different ADF units in the Top End of the Northern Territory, covering all three services. We see the importance of those units to Australia's defence, to Customs and to the breaching of our borders. There are currently six patrol boats based in Darwin. They are at the cutting edge, involved in the interdiction of foreign vessels in our waters. They confront illegal immigrants on a weekly basis, in difficult circumstances. Some might argue that those vessels are almost past their use-by date, but they carry out a very important role very efficiently. People like me who observe their operations still do not fully understand what goes on on board those vessels and how the crew are involved when they confront a difficult situation. It seems to me that this proposal provides a capacity for people like me, or indeed even you, Mr Deputy Speaker Jenkins, with rank, to go onto one of those vessels to experience the daily lives of the officers and sailors as they undertake activities on behalf of us all. When we have seen the hardships they work under and the difficult circumstances which they confront, we would come to this place with a much better understanding.

Recently, the Defence Subcommittee of the Joint Parliamentary Committee on Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade was in Timor. Among other places, we visited Suai, where we had a lengthy conversation with Brigadier Gillespie. We were there for only half a day. Brigadier Gillespie said that he would like us to have spent more time at Suai so that we could learn about the way in which their work was being undertaken. This scheme would provide an avenue for that to happen. Not only that; you would go in around the rank of major, which would give you the capacity to be involved with all ranks and you could have conversations with privates right through to the officers commanding. You could then give youself a better understanding of the different issues which go across the ranks, although there may be many common issues. In the Northern Territory, we have the 1st Armoured Regiment, 2nd Cavalry Regiment, 5/7 Royal Australian Regiment, 8/12 Medium Regiment Artillery, Combat Engineer Regiment, 161 Reconnaissance Aviation Squadron and Norforce, to name a few, which would provide an opportunity for members of parliament to get a very good understanding of what goes on. Down the highway at RAAF Tindal, we have our fighter squadron—the FA18s and the 75 Squadron. These are the key units in implementing our defence strategy which, as the member has said, was amplified in the government's white paper, and which, as our leader has indicated, is in effect pinched Labor Party policy.

I have been a critic and continue to be a critic of many aspects of the way in which the government administers Defence. As the minister at the table, the Minister for Veterans' Affairs, knows, we have a running battle over a number of these issues. That should not cloud the fact that we have a common purpose, which is to make sure that Australia has a competent, able, professional Defence Force. What we are about is ensuring that it has the capacity to do the job we want it to do. I am not sure what this project is going to be called—an armed forces parliamentary scheme or exchange scheme of some description. Despite the fact that we might have grave differences on the floor of the parliament, this scheme will mean that those of us who are lucky enough to participate will at least come here with an informed position. It has been a concern of mine for some time that people who come into this parliament are expected to debate all manner of issues, often without any great knowledge or experience of the circumstances which they are debating. This seems to me to be something we should be addressing—the way we induct people into the parliament as to what is provided by the parliament and by the government—to ensure that people in this place have the knowledge they require. I think this initiative goes some way to addressing the shortfall of knowledge that exists across the parliament in terms of the defence forces and how they operate. I am very pleased to be able to support this proposal. It has the potential to ensure that a large number of members, even my two comrades at the table here, the member for Watson and the member for Grayndler, will sign up as volunteers when this scheme is proposed, to do short stints and perhaps undergo some training. That would be of great assistance to all of us, including me. (Time expired)