Senator KEMP --Can I have the figures on stress leave in the department?

Mr Barrett --When Senator McGauran earlier asked the question, we were trying to see if we could get something fairly quickly. I do not think we would have that in the time available. I did check with my people and, to our knowledge, there would certainly be fewer than 10 people in a department of 900 odd. The question also related to the duration of that leave. I would have thought that the interest was in whether people were on leave of a reasonable duration. I would have thought that there would be relatively few, but we can get the numbers on that and provide them to you.

Senator KEMP --Were you here when the Clerk of the Senate made some comments on the guidelines relating to stress leave?

Mr Barrett --I was here, but I was directing my attention to another matter.

Senator KEMP --He felt--and I think I am fairly interpreting him--that perhaps they were fairly open. I wonder whether the Department of Finance has any views on whether the guidelines on stress leave were sufficiently tight.

Mr Barrett --Stress leave, in essence, is no different to any other medical condition for leave, in my opinion. The approach that the Department of Finance takes, and I know a number of my colleagues share this, is that what we should be on about is to firstly prevent the situation in which stress will occur. We have an ongoing consultancy arrangement where we have professional people who staff can consult and, in fact, be referred to for assistance.

In that way, in recent years I think it has been demonstrated that we have been able to alleviate the situation by taking preventative measures for a lot of the problems that have been created. In the Public Service, generally, I can say that managers have become more attuned to the needs of their staff and their working environment. In that sense, I think this has added to our capacity to come to grips with preventing stress per se.

I would not have liked to have ventured a view. Quite clearly, in another capacity, I am a trustee on both the CSS and the PSS boards--the superannuation boards--and we see this quite frequently under invalidity conditions. I think there is a problem for all of us, including the medical fraternity, in coming to grips with stress in the modern community and exactly what impact it does have on people's capacity to do their work, their job.

I think, as part of modern management, public servants now recognise that the ability to be able to move people flexibly--place them in jobs which are more suited to their particular talents and perhaps to their condition--alleviates a lot of the problems that might have otherwise occurred. The answer to you is that I cannot say that the guidelines are any more or any less stringent than for any other element that people might have that creates an absence from work. But, certainly, I am saying to you that it is a difficult area and, from our experience, prevention is the way to mostly deal with that.

Senator KEMP --Thank you, Mr Barrett.

CHAIR --If there are no further questions on program 7, that completes the Department of Finance. We will turn now to the administrative services program. As I said earlier, we will begin with programs 5, 6 and 7.

Senator KEMP --Mr Chairman, before we go on to that, I have some questions I would like to put on notice.

CHAIR --I have three questions from Senator Minchin for Finance to do with Commonwealth cash management practices. Is it the wish of the committee that they be put on notice and incorporated in Hansard at the end of proceedings? There being no objection, it is so ordered.

[The questions appear at the conclusion of today's proceedings]

Senator KEMP --Mr Chairman, I have some questions I would like to put on notice in relation to the Joint House Department.

CHAIR --Is it the wish of the committee that Senator Kemp's three questions to the Joint House Department be put on notice and incorporated? There being no objection, it is so ordered.

[The questions appear at the conclusion of today's proceedings]

[10.05 a.m.]